Driver Education Car qualification

[KKothand]

I was going to sign up for the DE through the PCA club, and upon reviewing their safety checklist, it looks like ANY kind of leak is grounds for disqualifying the car. Since I was planning on doing this when I bought the car ( new owner since Nov-13) I am very disappointed and looking for options. Hope the more experienced folks can provide some input on this, and their experiences with their local PCA DE's.

At this time it looks like my desire to become a better porsche driver is not an option through the DE program unless I fix my slight oil leak that my car has. Thanks,

[zippy_gg]

Where is it leaking from? Bermuda triangle? Oil return tubes? Valve covers?
All of these are relatively easy to fix.
Mine also has a leak at the soft oil lines at the front cooler.

[ginot912]

You can usually get the car tech'ed before the event. I would do that before registering.
A lot of air cooled porsche's leave a spot or two.
As mentioned above check the three most likely spots.
What year is your car?

Gino

[tonythetarga]

I'm sure you wouldn't want to lose your car due to someone else's oil leak. I agree that tech is the best way to go first. Very minor oil sweating is common but if you drop oil as the car is running then it gets on the driving line for everyone else.

[Jesse16]

I don't believe a drop on the floor is what the intent is "usually". Leaving a trail on the track is another matter or setting you car on fire is very bad form. Just take you car to the garage/person who would likely tech. it for a DE and get their input. They're the one who will look in the most detail and decide to stamp your form or not. The tech at the track in my experience is much more of a quick double check. The guy who checks my car via the checklist is usually part of the team doing the track tech also. They're just looking out for you.

[HarryD]

Good advice above. I would contact the organizer and tell them you have an air cooled 911 and ask them directly what would constitute a disqualifying oil leak.

[ejp]

I've done PCA DE's and have passed every tech inspection. My motor shows signs of seepage in multiple areas. I've never experienced any problems getting through tech with this. If you have a relationship with a decent shop who knows you and your car, this shouldn't be a problem. I've had two shops point out seepage (and offer to fix them, for a pretty penny), but I've never failed pre-tech for that stuff. I've heard of air-cooled cars that don't show any signs of oil seepage, but I believe that these are found in the unicorn aisle of your local store.

On the other hand, if you're dropping significant amounts of oil onto the track surface (or have fittings that show imminent signs of catastrophic failure), that car probably shouldn't be on the track.

[KKothand]

Originally Posted by zippy_gg

Where is it leaking from? Bermuda triangle? Oil return tubes? Valve covers?
All of these are relatively easy to fix.
Mine also has a leak at the soft oil lines at the front cooler.

zippy: When I did a PPI I knew it had leak, and it is mostly under the crankcase I thought. I don't recall any oil on the valve covers. I will have to do a more detailed investigation in the three spots that you note. In the short time I drove may be a few days before storing it for winter, I didn't notice any oil on the floor, but not sure if it is because of the cold weather and 20W-50 oil.

Ginot, Jesse: Thanks for the advise. I think getting it teched is a good idea to see what is involved before I register. I will certainly ask questions and get some clarifications before assuming all is lost.

Mine is a 1982 911SC, and I certainly agree with the point of dripping oil making it hazardous for everyone.

Thanks everyone for some great feedback!

[SteveDraz]

You won't get disqualified for a tiny leak, otherwise I'd never get on a track with my '70. There are some nickel/quarter sized drops under the car but nothing huge. If it forms a puddle in your garage after a week - that's another story.

[zippy_gg]

Originally Posted by KKothand

zippy: When I did a PPI I knew it had leak, and it is mostly under the crankcase I thought. I don't recall any oil on the valve covers. I will have to do a more detailed investigation in the three spots that you note. In the short time I drove may be a few days before storing it for winter, I didn't notice any oil on the floor, but not sure if it is because of the cold weather and 20W-50 oil.

Some of the leaks may not be easy to locate because the heat exchangers are in the way. In my case there was a bit of oil dripping on top of the HEs and the smell was horrible.
I had leaks at the exhaust valve covers (the bottom ones), oil return tubes, and Bermuda triangle. It all added up to a stinky car and greasy mess in the engine compartment.

[jittsl]

As a veteran of many years of DEing and a couple as track chair for NER I think I'm qualified to say - The "rules" are not designed to ruin your day. They're designed to ensure that all entrants can safely coexist in a high speed driving environment. I have never personally, nor have I seen anyone else, disqualify an entrant for having an oil seepage issue. If I had, I would have had to disqualify almost evey air-cooled Porsche brought to an event.

Oil leakage, on the other hand, is a major safety concern. If your car drops any more than a single drop or two on the ground in the ten minutes it takes to do a tech inspection or leaves a trail of smoke as it burns off the oil dropping on the exhaust then I would expect it to fail and would insist you have it repaired before attending a DE. It simply doesn't make sense to allow anyone to pollute the racing surface and/or endanger other drivers. The fear is not so much for the few drops but rather what will happen to the engine when put under the stresses of high performance driving on a race track?

If you are in the first category, don't sweat it. You'll be fine. Go and enjoy the pleasures of driving your Porsche as it was intended. If you really do have an leaking issue then you probably want to get it fixed anyway.

[jittsl]

As a veteran of many years of DEing and a couple as track chair for NER I think I'm qualified to say - The "rules" are not designed to ruin your day. They're designed to ensure that all entrants can safely coexist in a high speed driving environment. I have never personally, nor have I seen anyone else, disqualify an entrant for having an oil seepage issue. If I had, I would have had to disqualify almost evey air-cooled Porsche brought to an event.

Oil leakage, on the other hand, is a major safety concern. If your car drops any more than a single drop or two on the ground in the ten minutes it takes to do a tech inspection or leaves a trail of smoke as it burns off the oil dropping on the exhaust then I would expect it to fail and would insist you have it repaired before attending a DE. It simply doesn't make sense to allow anyone to pollute the racing surface and/or endanger other drivers. The fear is not so much for the few drops but rather what will happen to the engine when put under the stresses of high performance driving on a race track?

If you are in the first category, don't sweat it. You'll be fine. Go and enjoy the pleasures of driving your Porsche as it was intended. If you really do have an leaking issue then you probably want to get it fixed anyway.

[michael lang]

I have been a tech inspector for a few years, not so much last season because of other things tying my time up but I'm still real familiar with the tech sheet. If your car has split cv boots and there is grease slinging under your car, yes, you will need to fix that. But if I see only wetness on the bottom side of your motor and when I clean it off and the wetness does not return while the car is on the lift, I'm not going to give you a hard time. I'll probably just tell you to make sure you have an extra qt or two of oil in your track box. The nice thing about the checklist is that it gives everyone a "guide" in which to follow to make sure they have a problem free fun filled weekend. 95% of 80s era 911s are wet underneath to one degree or another. Ideally, yes there should be no leaks at all but the checklist allows for inspector discretion.

[Trackrash]

Originally Posted by michael lang

I have been a tech inspector for a few years, not so much last season because of other things tying my time up but I'm still real familiar with the tech sheet. If your car has split cv boots and there is grease slinging under your car, yes, you will need to fix that. But if I see only wetness on the bottom side of your motor and when I clean it off and the wetness does not return while the car is on the lift, I'm not going to give you a hard time. I'll probably just tell you to make sure you have an extra qt or two of oil in your track box. The nice thing about the checklist is that it gives everyone a "guide" in which to follow to make sure they have a problem free fun filled weekend. 95% of 80s era 911s are wet underneath to one degree or another. Ideally, yes there should be no leaks at all but the checklist allows for inspector discretion.

Were do I find a copy of "the checklist"?

Before my first DE, I took my car to a local shop where the local PCA tech guru worked. I figured if there was anything that could be and issue, he would, and did, find it. Better there, with time to fix it, than at the track.

If you are new to PCA you may want to read your region's classing rules. If you have made mods to your car you may be required to have extra safety equipment. My wide tires and big bore kit required me to have a roll bar and harnesses for DEs.

At the last autocross I attended I was warned of oil leaking from my motor. Turned out there was ALREADY oil on the ground where I parked!

[ginot912]

Here's a checklist

Mechanic Driver
Initials Initials
_______ _______ Brake lights - Functional.

_______ _______ Pedals - Free return and in good operating condition. Firm brake pedal.

_______ _______ Windshield - No cracks. Functional wipers with good blades.

_______ _______ Windows - Can open or close fully. Window net removed or fastened back.

_______ _______ Mirrors - At least one. All securely fastened.

_______ _______ Seat Belts - Lap and Shoulder - Securely anchored metal to metal for both driver and passenger. Equal
restraints for Driver and Passenger. Both driver and passenger seat and belt the same type. If modified
harness restraint is used, webbing must indicate 5 years old or newer and it must be installed through the
holes of a proper seat according to manufacturer’s instruction.

_______ _______ Cars without tops require roll bar, 5 point harnesses and arm restraints. Cars with soft tops
require roll bar only. Cars with hard tops meet same standards as closed cars. Cars with hard roofs
(including Targas) must run with sunroof/hatch closed or else must meet same standards as open cars.

_______ _______ Roll bars must pass “broomstick test” – driver and passenger’s helmets must be beneath
“broomstick” running from windshield top to bar top.

_______ _______ Fire Extinguisher - Recommended but not required. Securely anchored to frame of car in reach of
driver. BC or ABC rated and fully charged.

_______ _______ Helmets - 2005 ( or newer) SNELL rated. Snell “SA” rating recommended. Snell “M” or “K” rating
accepted. Snell Sticker must be attached. No “DOT” rated helmets allowed. Helmets should have
driver’s name printed on side.

_______ _______ Brake Fluid - Brakes must be thoroughly bled prior to all high-speed track events. It is
recommended that brake fluid be completely changed at least annually. Old ineffective brake fluid
is usually dark color. Brake fluid conditions will be checked at the track.

_______ _______ Battery - Securely fastened and in good condition. No leaks or corrosion. Positive terminal
should be insulated.

_______ _______ Engine drive belts - Properly tensioned and in good condition.

_______ _______ Throttle linkage - Freely operating linkage and good return spring.

_______ _______ Leaks - No leaks of any fluid.

_______ _______ Rust - No excessive rust or damage to suspension or chassis parts.

_______ _______ Steering and Front Suspension - No excessive looseness in steering or suspension. Lower trailing arms to
radius tight. Tie rods secure. Axle and shock bolt tight. Ball joints in good condition. Axle boots and oil seals
in good condition.

_______ _______ Rear Suspension - Check half shaft and shock bolts. Tighten 911 CV joint bolts.

_______ _______ Exhaust - Noise reducing muffler in place.

_______ _______ Wheel Bearings - Correct adjustment.

_______ ________ Brakes - Sufficient pads or linings. (At least 1/4" on disk pads.) No cuts or abrasions in brake lines. Check
rotor condition.

_______ _______ Wheels - No cracks or bends. All lug nuts engaged. Valve stem must have airtight cap.

_______ _______ Tires - Good condition. No cracks or bulges. Minimum tread depth 3/32" on contact patch area. Tires must
be speed rated above your expected maximum speed. Speed ratings are: "S" up to 112MPH. "H" up to 130
MPH. "V" over 130 MPH. "Z" over 149 MPH. (Exceptions to tread depth requirement may be made for race
or shaved performance tires at the discretion of the chairman. Cars with slicks or bald performance tires will
not be allowed to run on a wet track.)

[tonythetarga]

Rules for DE tech inspections vary by region. Our committee in the Niagara Region PCA just revised ours last season and are making minor adjustments prior to the 2014 season. We are also adding shops on the area that can provide the inspection but they are not exclusive. A good shop should be able to follow the tech form .

[OldSpool87]

Congrats on the new ride…whatever you do, make sure to have the car tech'd with enough time to make repairs. I get mine 3 weeks out. Everyone involved in DE is an enthusiast by nature, and it's been my experience that common sense prevails as long as safety is not compromised. Talk to everyone you can at the event and get your instructor's email address. Have a blast.

[Cajundaddy]

As others have said, get your car inspected by a shop that regularly does PCA tech inspections to determine the severity of the leak. Ideally "no oil on the track" is the goal but there are reasonable limits. If you do have a significant leak you probably want it fixed anyways. An engine oil leak may slobber oil on your rear tires during performance driving resulting in a complete loss of control. Bad things happen when you are going backwards at 80 mph.

[jager911]

In addition to all the great advice given above, years ago, I tracked down several common leaks by pressure washing all the grime to assess how bad the leak was. The leaks are relatively easy to fix (except for engine drop) but if you're a newer owner, this will help to narrow it down. After fixing the leaks, presenting a clean undercarriage at Tech makes it easier to pass and to spot recurring leaks.