Radar detectors

[DocG]

One advantage that I see in having a radar detector is that as the radar signal scatters from other cars ahead of you, it will provide you with enough time to slow down just enough that another car, without a detector, is the one who gets the ticket. It's like the old adage about being chased by the bear. You don't have to be the fastest runner, only faster than the slowest camper.

[joe payne]

Originally Posted by X JBM X

I too have a V1 in my 911... but I find I get so many falses, that I don't really pay that much attention to it. I have to figure out how to reduce the falses it gives off...

Anyone have some suggestions for me on how to do this?

I have a V1 and I keep it in the Pro Logic mode all the time in L.A.
Push the mute button until the "L" is lit.
Don't drive in the "A" mode because that alerts of all signals good and bad.
Also, just because the Laser alert goes off does not mean a ticket because laser scatter can be picked up bouncing off other cars etc.

Last but not least, use your EYES..

[TheSt|G]

Speaking of bears, getting a CB radio and requesting a "bear check" from the truckers out there than be quite helpful as well.

[flatsicks]

Originally Posted by dfhtrhjn

Sometimes an officer will be behind you on the hw. You can tell he's there if the radar on his car is on, so you know not to speed. This happens to me a couple times a year.

Valentine one has a sensor in front, side and rear. It even shows you with arrrows where the signal is coming from. so even if you have someone behind you with a laser or radar you will be warned. It is an expensive unit, but it was worth the extra bucks to me. Be careful in the mountains, as none of them (including you, the driver) can see what is happening behind the next hill! That is how I got zapped last time I deserved it tho. Won't happen again.

[T77911S]

Originally Posted by DocG

One advantage that I see in having a radar detector is that as the radar signal scatters from other cars ahead of you, it will provide you with enough time to slow down just enough that another car, without a detector, is the one who gets the ticket. It's like the old adage about being chased by the bear. You don't have to be the fastest runner, only faster than the slowest camper.

i am a RADAR tech for the FAA. been one for over 20 yrs now.
this is pretty much what i was going to say. the non lazer stuff goes everywhere pretty much. even with instant on as long as you are in traffic you stand a very good chance of picking up the signal before they can get you. now if you are by yourself, slow down, your screwed.
lazer is a different story. i dont know the lazer stuff but assuming it is much like a lazer pointer, and has to be aimed directly at the car, your screwed again. probably not much signal to bounce around or make it past the car the cop is shooting.
radar is like a pie wedge. yes it can be focused to a narrow beam, not sure how tight the police stuff is, but the further out it goes, the wider it gets.


i am looking at getting one. i am looking at the V1, but i like the escort because it remembers false targets adnn wont give false alerts.

[burtm5]

I keep multiple detectors in different cars as I'm too lazy to move my VI around and worried it will be stolen. So I use old Cincinnati microwave escorts, passports and newer escorts in my DDs. These were made by Mike Valentine before he sold out to Bell? in the late 80s? Around here, Louisville KY the PO use a lot of Ka band. My question to the experts is did the Cincinnati escorts and passports ever detect Ka band. and if so which generation. And to add to the discussion, try to stay out of the "fast" lane or follow 1/4 mile behind a bright red corvette or Ferrari so your detector will pick up their scatter. best, be safe out there, Henry

[tirwin]

Originally Posted by joe payne

I have a V1 and I keep it in the Pro Logic mode all the time in L.A.
Push the mute button until the "L" is lit.
Don't drive in the "A" mode because that alerts of all signals good and bad.
Also, just because the Laser alert goes off does not mean a ticket because laser scatter can be picked up bouncing off other cars etc.

Last but not least, use your EYES..

Good point. My wife had this misguided notion that a radar detection works something like a cloaking device. That took some 'splainin at first.

It takes driving with it for a while to develop a feel for what it can and can't do. Around Atlanta and the burbs the LEO's mainly use Ka and they are zapping so many cars ahead that even with instant on I pick them up way in advance. The places I see laser the most are the long interstate corridors. Even if you're driving 10 over and you get zapped by the laser you have enough time to take your foot off the gas. They see you're slowing down as they try to get a lock and don't bother you. There are usually much bigger fish to fry. The most I've ever had happen is the LEO chirped his siren as we passed as if to say "watch it."

The main reason I bought the detector is because we drive to the Florida and Georgia coasts a good bit. Once spring starts every podunk town sets up a speed trap between here and there to catch the vacationers. There are so many places where you're driving along at one speed and then suddenly the speed limit drops by 10mph and then right after that another 10mph and wouldn't you know that there just HAPPENS to be a police officer stationed right there. What are the odds??? If you're not paying attention to the posted speed limit and just following along with traffic you can get zinged easily. It is just so obvious it's a revenue trap it's almost comical.

The other reason I got it was I figured if it comes down to a choice between pulling over a 911 at 10 over or a family SUV at 15 over (all other factors being equal), the Porsche is getting the ticket every time so it is just extra precaution.

If you're driving 20+ over the limit all the time it becomes a simple matter of statistics... it's not IF you'll get busted but WHEN. No technology is infallible.

The nice thing about apps like Waze is you get a bunch of other useful info like bad weather, poor visibility, accidents, etc.

[kodioneill]

LASER
light amplification by stimulated emission of radiation
Not lazer.

[dicklague]

Has the OP come back in on this thread?

[tirwin]

Originally Posted by T77911S

lazer is a different story. i dont know the lazer stuff but assuming it is much like a lazer pointer, and has to be aimed directly at the car, your screwed again. probably not much signal to bounce around or make it past the car the cop is shooting.
radar is like a pie wedge. yes it can be focused to a narrow beam, not sure how tight the police stuff is, but the further out it goes, the wider it gets.

Here's what I know about lasers. I am by no means claiming to be an expert in how lasers are used in law enforcement.

Everyone knows that a laser is a fine beam. BUT there are differences. You mentioned a laser pointer. Well, technically those aren't really lasers, they are LEDs. In high bandwidth data networks you commonly see different classes of equipment based on the distance. The optics used within a building has to be pretty cheap (relatively speaking) and it only needs to go a few hundred meters at most. This is where LED technology is used. One of the characteristics of LEDs is that the dispersion of the beam is much greater than that of a "real" laser. You can see this effect yourself if you have a laser pointer. Hold your hand right in front of it and then shine it at something off in the distance notice that the pattern is larger. The point here is that if the laser guns police use were to use "real" lasers they would not be nearly as affordable and because the pattern spread is larger over a greater distance it makes it more practical to detect. And I'm sure someone would "claim" possible retinal damage if they shot real lasers at your eyeballs. (I know, it's all about the energy level...)

So why does that matter? Well in order for the laser to work it needs to actually get reflected back to a receiver. Angle of incidence = angle of reflection. In order to get a lock on you, the beam has to leave the officer's hand and he has to hit something that is relatively perpendicular to the vertical plane on your car at an angle that the beam will be reflected back to the receiver. This is why they tend to aim at things like the front license plate.

The other thing worth noting is that if you and the officer were on a perfectly flat plane at say 1/4 mile apart, very small movements in his hand will translate into the beam bouncing around a pretty wide area on your end. If I did the math right, a 1 degree change from level in the officer's hand (let's say he is holding the gun at 6ft off the ground) translates into +/- 23' elevation change at 1/4 mile away!

And remember you're moving at a fairly high rate of speed. So the laser detectors are banking on this variation in where the beam is moving around as the officer tries to get a lock on you to detect it. That's one reason you should keep your detector at the center line of your vehicle. If the officer is aiming at your license plate and he is moving high and low, your detector stands a better chance of catching it than if it's off to one side. So don't put it on the driver side visor. Try to put it right below the rear view mirror (check out Blendmount).

Some of the laser shifters work by mounting a laser detection lens over your front and rear license plates. Once they detect the laser beam, they change the frequency of the reflected wave to something that is outside the expected range, which confuses the gun's logic. The result is no lock.

Other factors to consider are that most rules around laser use require that the officer be out of the car (to eliminate the possibility that the windshield introduces variance). This means the officers will be standing in the door of their cruiser or on a motorcycle. They often don't use laser in rainy weather because (a) they don't want to stand in the rain and (b) water droplets in the air can cause beam dispersion. Another thing to think about is that officers in a cruiser have to get back in the car and come after you. If you were really going fast and they were alone, the odds of catching you aren't in their favor, especially if it's someone on a sport bike. When I see lasers being used from a patrol car, they usually have one officer zapping cars and then radioing ahead to one or two units down the road that are actually the ones to pull people over.

It always has been and always will be a cat and mouse game.

[HawgRyder]

All arguments really break down to one question.
Can you react faster than the speed of light?
The signals from both Radar and Laser are travelling at that speed.
The processing takes about 1/10,000 of a second before the police have the answer (your speed).
Also...what happens IF you get a ping from your detector?
You stamp on the brakes?
What about that semi behind you?
He's not expecting you to slow down that fast...with no indication of trouble ahead of you.
If you must speed....pay the price...or scream down the track on race day to satisfy your inner needs.
Bob

[tirwin]

Originally Posted by HawgRyder

All arguments really break down to one question.
Can you react faster than the speed of light?
The signals from both Radar and Laser are travelling at that speed.
The processing takes about 1/10,000 of a second before the police have the answer (your speed).
Also...what happens IF you get a ping from your detector?
You stamp on the brakes?
What about that semi behind you?
He's not expecting you to slow down that fast...with no indication of trouble ahead of you.
If you must speed....pay the price...or scream down the track on race day to satisfy your inner needs.
Bob

Bob,

Completely get where you're coming from... it is always about being a responsible driver no matter what.

That being said, there is more to it than the speed of light. There is a human factor involved on the part of the officer. He has to aim at something long enough to get the reflected signal to get a lock. That process likely takes on the order of magnitude of seconds.

Slamming on the brakes is stupid.

The semi was following too close. Yes, I know it is small comfort given the inertia of a semi compared to that of a 911. He wins and the result ain't pretty. But that is a discussion more about how people drive stupid with or without radar detectors. If you put ANY space between you and the car ahead of you around Atlanta, someone will cut in front of you and fill that spot. Drives me bats**t crazy!

Should people speed? Not for me to say. However, nobody seems to bring up the ethics of using a cat bypass pipe on their exhaust. What about the future of our endangered species? How can we live with ourselves for wiping this poor creature out of existence for a few measly horsepower???

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by HawgRyder

All arguments really break down to one question.
Can you react faster than the speed of light?
The signals from both Radar and Laser are travelling at that speed.
The processing takes about 1/10,000 of a second before the police have the answer (your speed).
Also...what happens IF you get a ping from your detector?
You stamp on the brakes?
What about that semi behind you?
He's not expecting you to slow down that fast...with no indication of trouble ahead of you.
If you must speed....pay the price...or scream down the track on race day to satisfy your inner needs.
Bob

Good point Bob, brake light kill switch and a stiffer suspension to eliminate brake dive while you shave speed to turn off your laser jammers is definitely the way to do it.

[dicklague]

A laser shifter at least gives you a chance with laser. You have to install a switch to shut it down fast once you have tweaked their signal.



This is what I have in my 4 door. Something similar in my 911

[HawgRyder]

I used to work for Beltronics as a tech...testing and improving the radar detectors and other pieces we made.
Several of the designs were just too good...so they got "detuned".
The reason...too many "hits" per mile...some from legitimate sources...but also from microwave towers...police relay units...ambulance IFF units...Fire engine traffic light triggers...and who knows what (there was one street in Mississauga that triggered every time I tested) ... so...is the unit good?
Maybe...but considering the frequencies used...there are dozens of things also on that area of the spectrum.
At Beltronics...we knew this...and sold the detectors anyway...laughing all the way to the bank.
And...Laser units?
The beams are only about 1/4" wide (at a mile) so the police can choose which side of your licence plate to hit (using the scope attached to the gun).
Any vertical surface...metal...or plastic will bounce the beam (because of the paint I think).
Once again...laughter at the factory.
Bob

[bfunke]

Just need to strap on an ALQ-184 pod to counter multiple sophisticated emitters in dense electronic threat environment. Ha! Anyone care to comment about the effectiveness of Dick's shifters?

[RSBob]

My V1 has paid for itself many times over. Going up 101 in N Cali I picked up a CHP coming up behind me due to the directional arrows - about 1.5 miles back. About an hour later had another coming at me about a mile ahead flipping on his unit only when he saw a car approaching. He flipped it on about 10 times just for a short blast and immediately flipped it off. Had plenty of time to slow down with the arrow pointing forward. And when he hit me, I was right on 60 and off he went blatting others behind me.

[dyusem]

I have an integrated Escort 9500ci in the '10 C4S and I use a portable Escort Passport in the '80 SC and while using other vehicles.

Both have saved me numerous times, however as has already been mentioned, a radar detector is just another tool.

In addition to being prudent and safe, and understanding the detector's limitations, letting a rabbit take the hit in front of you is a good tactic to inhibiting LEO from fulfilling their revenue generating responsibilities on your dime.

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by HawgRyder

I used to work for Beltronics as a tech...testing and improving the radar detectors and other pieces we made.
Several of the designs were just too good...so they got "detuned".
The reason...too many "hits" per mile...some from legitimate sources...but also from microwave towers...police relay units...ambulance IFF units...Fire engine traffic light triggers...and who knows what (there was one street in Mississauga that triggered every time I tested) ... so...is the unit good?
Maybe...but considering the frequencies used...there are dozens of things also on that area of the spectrum.
At Beltronics...we knew this...and sold the detectors anyway...laughing all the way to the bank.
And...Laser units?
The beams are only about 1/4" wide (at a mile) so the police can choose which side of your licence plate to hit (using the scope attached to the gun).
Any vertical surface...metal...or plastic will bounce the beam (because of the paint I think).
Once again...laughter at the factory.
Bob

Does anyone actually buy Beltronics garbage?

[Reddy Kilowatt]

Originally Posted by HawgRyder

I used to work for Beltronics as a tech...testing and improving the radar detectors and other pieces we made.
Several of the designs were just too good...so they got "detuned".
The reason...too many "hits" per mile...some from legitimate sources...but also from microwave towers...police relay units...ambulance IFF units...Fire engine traffic light triggers...and who knows what (there was one street in Mississauga that triggered every time I tested) ... so...is the unit good?
Maybe...but considering the frequencies used...there are dozens of things also on that area of the spectrum.
At Beltronics...we knew this...and sold the detectors anyway...laughing all the way to the bank.
And...Laser units?
The beams are only about 1/4" wide (at a mile) so the police can choose which side of your licence plate to hit (using the scope attached to the gun).
Any vertical surface...metal...or plastic will bounce the beam (because of the paint I think).
Once again...laughter at the factory.
Bob

Being too sensitive w/ the inability to filter false positives is hardly what I would consider "too good."

Your point in your other post about reacting at the speed of light is nonsensical at best.

---------------------------------------------------------

OP, ask people in your area. Those who generalize based on their local experiences are likely not providing information useful to you. For example, those who say "it's all laser (or ball bearings) now" are wrong. It's laser where it's laser, and it's Ka in most of the other places. Laser has NOT been universally adopted.