Re11, ra1, r888

[cashman]

Looking for advise from people that have direct experience with the following tires. I just purchased track rims (BBS 7 and 9). Going with the 225 / 245 set up. I am an experienced DE driver (now race driver since Chump Car Road Atlanta ) and like to drive 9.5/10ths. I will be using these as track tires and driving to and from the track. Tracks are CMP 60 miles away, VIR 120 Miles away, RA 120 Miles away and possibly Summit Point 300 Miles away. Car is 1989, 3.2L. Front camber -1.3, Rear camber -2.5. I do not plan on changing these setting.

My questions:
Are the Toyo's that much better than the RE11? - Like "oh my God different".
Will the Toyo's wear out driving the road miles?
I hear the RA1 need more negative camber, is that really an issue?
I currently run 205/225 set up, will the 225/245 RE11 be that much better already?

Price points:
RE11
Toyo R888 = RE11 +$100
Toyo RA1 = RE11 + $150

I have experience with the RE11 but not the Toyo's.

I have read most of the threads regarding this topic but nothing really addresses this topic directly.

Thank you.

[Elombard]

I will throw this out there. For a while now I have been buying used ra1s with 3/4 tread for $400 shipped a set. these are 225/50 15s. I drive them on the street 2, 3 times a week. Have not been getting to the track much lately. They last suprisingly well on the street, i have not played much with camber. The place I buy from I think has 16s some times? Might be worth a try at that price?

[cashman]

Source? Is this the guy I see advertising used tires on this forum and RL from time to time?

[ginot912]

I went trough 3 sets of RA1's 205/225/15 they wore real good, used on street and track events. aprox. same camber as you got.
no experience with the others. I'm using 225/245/15 Hoosiers on track now and can never go back

Gino

[Elombard]

I hear the hoosiers make you feel like a super hero! :-)

Yeah I think its like JPH? I will have to look back through some e-mail. They pop up on Ebay too. Also there is several folks in Grassroots Motorsports Classifieds that sell these.

[IROC]

Unfortunately I only have experience with the RA-1s, but also lots of track miles on street tires. I ran the RA-1s on the street/track for a long time. They work fine on the street and IMHO are much better than a "street" tire on the track. Mostly in steering response/sidewall stiffness/etc., but also in total grip. The RA-1s don't need a lot of camber. I was only at about -1.3 to -1.5 front and rear and wore evenly. They also wear well with lots of street miles. BTDT.

For driving at 9.5 tenths (my habit also) I think the RA-1s are probably a better choice.

Welcome to ChumpCar!! We missed Road Atlanta due to a "racing incident" with a Subaru at AMP last November that required a lot of repairs...

[Lyle O]

FWIW, I tried 225 on 7" (16) on the front of my '87 3.2 (not wide body) with Yokohama and got rubbing on the fender lip on hard cornering. I'd be interested if any of these tire options are less likely to rub (not trying to hijack the thread, though. Sorry.) Thanks in advance.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by Lyle O

FWIW, I tried 225 on 7" (16) on the front of my '87 3.2 (not wide body) with Yokohama and got rubbing on the fender lip on hard cornering. I'd be interested if any of these tire options are less likely to rub (not trying to hijack the thread, though. Sorry.) Thanks in advance.

Thanks for the info. I have standard flares but the underneath has been rolled. I will have to take that into consideration as the 205 is not listed as an option for the RA1.

If anyone else has noticed this issue please post. All feedback so far is appreciated.

[nineball]

have you considered hankook ventus rs-3 tires? i have a set and love them on the track, and they work just as well on the street. only problem they have, which i think all the ones you listed would have as well, is that they are not for use when it's 40 or less outside.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by nineball

have you considered hankook ventus rs-3 tires? i have a set and love them on the track, and they work just as well on the street. only problem they have, which i think all the ones you listed would have as well, is that they are not for use when it's 40 or less outside.

To my knowledge the 225/245 combo does not exist in the rs-3.

[michael lang]

Originally Posted by cashman

Looking for advise from people that have direct experience with the following tires. I just purchased track rims (BBS 7 and 9). Going with the 225 / 245 set up. I am an experienced DE driver (now race driver since Chump Car Road Atlanta ) and like to drive 9.5/10ths. I will be using these as track tires and driving to and from the track. Tracks are CMP 60 miles away, VIR 120 Miles away, RA 120 Miles away and possibly Summit Point 300 Miles away. Car is 1989, 3.2L. Front camber -1.3, Rear camber -2.5. I do not plan on changing these setting.

My questions:
Are the Toyo's that much better than the RE11? - Like "oh my God different".Incredibly
Will the Toyo's wear out driving the road miles?Like you wouldn't believe
I hear the RA1 need more negative camber, is that really an issue?Not as most people claim for street/track
I currently run 205/225 set up, will the 225/245 RE11 be that much better already?Not enough to notice a difference

With you being an experienced DE driver, you will appreciate the Toyos for their abilities for what they are. You will wear them out with all the street miles you will be putting on them traveling to & from the track.

My first set of RA1s lasted for only about 5000 and the two seasons I had them on my car I only drove Summit Point Main & Shenandoah. SPR is only 40 miles from my home so naturally I just drove there for an event and was home every night during a DE weekend.
When those were done, I went back to street tires. I had a set of RE11s on my car. They lasted about four seasons and compared to the RA1s, the rubber was like iron. For driving around town or on the highway, those things were great. They were really smooth, they were quiet and they were really durable. When my car is finished and ready to go back on the road, I really think that's what I will put on my freshly restored Fuchs. Having said that, I do not think I would use them again as my track tires. They became very slippery especially in the wet and did not meet the expectations that all the literature claimed in my opinion. They were very noisy in the tight sections (which never bothered me because I learned to listen to the tires) and there was a lot of understeer. I will say this, to their credit, they were incredibly predictable. Overall they acted just like a street tire. But again, they are my number 1 candidate as my next street tire.
The R888 were my last track tire and I like them, a lot. They were very grippy, we're really quiet for a track tire on the street especially when driving on the highway. They also were wearing a lot better than the RA1s and probably could have gotten atleast another season from them before I sold them when my car was hit while at a DE. That may have been partly due to the fact that they were mounted on a set of track wheels and when not being used, we're bagged and stored.
All in all, if I had to choose on one tire to do everything I would go with the triple 8s. For some reason, Toyo really seems to have it dialed in with Porsches and the characteristics of these cars. Although my favorite is the RA1, all three are really good choices and will serve you just fine. Given your experience level and what you're doing with it, go with the R888s.

[Jesse16]

Sounds like sticky toyos for you track rims. Quiet anything but less costly for streeters. I' jealous of your "dilemma". Either toyos will be nice.

[cashman]

Thanks for the responses. Ordered a set of RA1's. Looks like in general the RA's get more overall positive responses while the R888's still have a few naysayers. Unfortunately my next DE on new tires will be CMP which is BRUTAL on tires.

[BFT3.2]

Originally Posted by cashman

Thanks for the responses. Ordered a set of RA1's. Looks like in general the RA's get more overall positive responses while the R888's still have a few naysayers. Unfortunately my next DE on new tires will be CMP which is BRUTAL on tires.

Let us know how the 225's with 7's work up front with your rolled fenders. Considering the same set up.

[cashman]

^^^ I had no issues with the 225/245 set up. It fit and looked really good, no rubbing and I'm pretty low. Almost like it was meant to be.

So now I can answer some of my original questions:

My questions:
Are the Toyo's that much better than the RE11? - Like "oh my God different". They definetly were more confidence inspiring and I really liked the balance feel. I was still able to break them loose but they were very predictable. They were about 3 seconds faster than my Star Specs on a 1:58 course. They felt faster than only 3 seconds.
Will the Toyo's wear out driving the road miles? Haven't driven enough street miles to really comment but my guess is I will wear them out on the track before any street miles would wear them out. They will only commute to the track
I hear the RA1 need more negative camber, is that really an issue? I may have to agree with this. See my pictures below
I currently run 205/225 set up, will the 225/245 RE11 be that much better already? OK, I can't answer this because I went with the larger size and the Toyos so I can't compare only Toyos of equal size

The track is BRUTAL on tires and brakes. A lot of heavy braking and some really hard right turns (hence the wear on the left): Here's 3 laps if anyone is interested: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IKIGPIB6bM

Tires were not shaved: Go ahead and flame away.
Here are my "brand new" front tires viewed from the front - So the front left (worn) is actually on the right side. This is with -1.3 Camber. Guess I will have to compromise and find a way to get more camber. The outside is toast. I will run backwards next time at the track and then flip them on the rims. Will hopefully get 4 DE's out of them on this track. While my other tires see abuse on the outside non were ever worn like this:



Here are the rears with -2.5 camber. They look respectable and probably what I would have expected. You can even see where the inside right tire has some wear from the negative camber:


I'm guessing the R888 may have been a better choice for this track due to the heavier tread block pattern. Less flex in the rubber section.

Thanks for all previous responses.

[Driven97]

Originally Posted by BFT3.2

Let us know how the 225's with 7's work up front with your rolled fenders. Considering the same set up.

Kind of off topic, but test fit of 255/40 on 17x9" et35 equivalent up front. Offset camber plates maxed out, rolled fenders, and large green dust cans removed. All three are needed for sure to make this work.

I have <5mm to the strut housing. It turned ok with an et40 equivalent, but audibly rubbed on that green boot. Clears the fenders with a little to spare. Rubs inside of the tub at full lock. Test was successful enough that I'm going to give it a shot.





Test wheel has a pretty standard street Michelin, but measured out as wide section wise as my same size Dunlop Z2 also on a 9". Going to try a 245/40 Hankook RS3 most likely when I get my wheels back, just to give me a little more margin for error.

[Jesse16]

Is OK to put big camber on only the front left leaving right where it is? Seems that side wore nicely. Why not?