ROW vin/US vin on the same car, big mess!!!

[MathieuD]

Hi,

I am writing from the other side of the pound.
Here is my introduction few month ago:

Overdue introduction


I just moved back to Switzerland in February with my 1983 US SC. The idea was to easily get the car homologated here… Easily…

For that I ordered the COA while I was in the US. It is a matching number car. So far everything was looking good.
But I did not payed close attention to the vin number.

Got my inspection this morning in Switzerland, and guess what, the stamped vin number on the chassis is a European one and is partially different from the one on the COA.

More clearly:
on the chassis:

WP0ZZZ91ZDS121593

On the COA:

WP0AA091XDS121593

So it is suggesting that the car was a European car at the beginning of its life and was imported. To support that, I was the CAR FAX which goes back to 1986 only with 20000 miles . Which means that 1986 was the importation date in the US and then they gave to it a US vin number.

Right now, the Swiss administration would like to have an official document saying that the COA vin number and the original vin number correspond to the same car.

Any input on that would be extremely helpful.
Thank you in advance

Mathieu

[realgren]

Did they look at the VIN that's stamped inside the trunk? That one doesn't match anything. It's just a body # used by the factory!

They need to look at the door jam and the A pillar.

[MathieuD]

Well, they looked exactly at the one in the trunk. And assumed that it is the original one and everything has to match that….

[dpizi]

Originally Posted by MathieuD

Hi,

I am writing from the other side of the pound.
Here is my introduction few month ago:

Overdue introduction


I just moved back to Switzerland in February with my 1983 US SC. The idea was to easily get the car homologated here… Easily…

For that I ordered the COA while I was in the US. It is a matching number car. So far everything was looking good.
But I did not payed close attention to the vin number.

Got my inspection this morning in Switzerland, and guess what, the stamped vin number on the chassis is a European one and is partially different from the one on the COA.

More clearly:
on the chassis:

WP0ZZZ91ZDS121593

On the COA:

WP0AA091XDS121593

So it is suggesting that the car was a European car at the beginning of its life and was imported. To support that, I was the CAR FAX which goes back to 1986 only with 20000 miles . Which means that 1986 was the importation date in the US and then they gave to it a US vin number.

Right now, the Swiss administration would like to have an official document saying that the COA vin number and the original vin number correspond to the same car.

Any input on that would be extremely helpful.
Thank you in advance

Mathieu

Mathieu

I looked up both VINs using the decoder on Rennlist. The ROW VIN comes back as invalid, while the USA VIN comes back as a Targa. Maybe an incorrect number or letter???

FWIW - I had an 83 SC ROW car and it kept the ROW number beginning in WP0ZZZ. Purchased in New Jersey and licensed in North Carolina many years ago. I do not remember it ever being and issue.

From the picture in your introduction I do not see European side lights. I guess that could have been changed but I'm thinking you have a US car.

Not a lot of help but good luck sorting this out.

Dave

[realgren]

I believe my PO had a similar issue when my car came into California. He ended up screwing on a piece of wood on top of the VIN so the DMV wouldn't be able to see it. It was a little "agricultural"....

You might be able to just put a piece of tape on top of that number to hide it.

[McLovin]

As posted above, that's totally normal for US model cars.

For a US car, the VIN should be on a plate on the driver's side A pillar. And on the sticker on the driver's side door jamb.


That's the official VIN number. Your car should have that, and it should match what is on the COA.

[LuftWaffle]

I ran into the same issue on an '86 930. This was the response from PCNA:

"It is common for vehicles produced by Porsche AG (Parent company of Porsche Cars North America) to have two VIN’s stamped into the body of the chassis. Porsche AG produces vehicles referred to as ‘Worldwide Chassis.’ These vehicles are produced typically before it has been decided what market the vehicle is intended. Worldwide Chassis are stamped with a VIN beginning with ‘WP0ZZZ’. If it is decided then that a car is to be shipped to the U.S. the VIN will be re-stamped on the firewall with the appropriate U.S. Market VIN, thus changing digits 4 – 6 and 9th of the VIN to reflect the model, engine type, restraint system and NHTSA code (all badges and door/dash plates will reflect the updated VIN as well). You will notice that the remaining digits pertaining to the model and serial number do not change, as they are unique to this vehicle and this vehicle only."

Hope this helps you...

John

[MathieuD]

Thanks for the input.

My theory on an european car imported in 1986 is invalid since I found a stack of receipts of the car which are going back to 1983 in TEXAS when the car had less than 10000 miles.
So it is a US car, but I did not know the fact that the chassis number in the trunk is just indicative as LuftWaffle explained it very well.

But now, they have seen the car and are assuming that They are the "experts". So they will not give me a Swiss tittle until I have a kind of official document.

I will work on that instead of trying to convince them to change their mind!!!!

[JJ 911SC]

As per LuftWaffle; Back then when the chassis were done, they did not know in advance where the car would be delivered so all cars had ZZZ in the trunk.

When the other was filled for the US/Canada the VIN on the door jam and pillar had the ZZZ replace with Alpha/Numerical in position 4, 5 & 6.

Porsche VIN numbers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Position Explanation North America notes

4 for RoW = Z (filler) Engine.[1]
5 for RoW = Z (filler) Airbags (0 = none, 2 = at least 2).
6 for RoW = Z (filler) Model year.

[evan9eleven]

Hi Mathieu,

I have a US car registered in Norway, also with the two different VIN numbers. I had the Norwegian Porsche importer order the COC document for my car from Porsche (Certificate Of Conformity) which shows all the european specifications the car conformed to when built. My guy put both the Euro VIN from the frunk and the USA VIN on the same document to avoid hassles. As this is an official document that he has authority to sign for Porsche, there was no question when registering. Talk to your local dealership, if they don't know what at COC is then talk to someone else. These documents are the original manufacturer's European conformity docs... doesn't get better then that.

By the way, the registration authority may require you change to E-headlights, E-seatbelts, E-blinker lenses (orange in back) etc. I had to.


Good luck!

[evan9eleven]

Originally Posted by JJ 911SC

As per LuftWaffle; Back then when the chassis were done, they did not know in advance where the car would be delivered so all cars had ZZZ in the trunk.

When the other was filled for the US/Canada the VIN on the door jam and pillar had the ZZZ replace with Alpha/Numerical in position 4, 5 & 6.

Porsche VIN numbers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Position Explanation North America notes

4 for RoW = Z (filler) Engine.[1]
5 for RoW = Z (filler) Airbags (0 = none, 2 = at least 2).
6 for RoW = Z (filler) Model year.

Pretty good explanation except that European Porsche VINs all start with WP0ZZZ, the Z's aren't changed out for anything over here. My Germany spec 2004 Boxster S also has a WP0ZZZ VIN number in all locations and all the registration paperwork, while my USA spec SC has both the Euro VIN in the frunk and the USA vin on the door jamb sticker.

[JJ 911SC]

Originally Posted by evan9eleven

Pretty good explanation except that European Porsche VINs all start with WP0ZZZ, the Z's aren't changed out for anything over here. My Germany spec 2004 Boxster S also has a WP0ZZZ VIN number in all locations and all the registration paperwork, while my USA spec SC has both the Euro VIN in the frunk and the USA vin on the door jamb sticker.

Correct, that is why I said "When the other was filled for the US/Canada..."

[Dan J]

every us 911 since 1980 is tagged that way Contact Porsche De for help