couple of 911T questions from a newb

[Python14]

Okay, last month I drove my first Porsche(and first European car for that matter). It belonged to one my dad's friends and he let me use it to drive my date to Homecoming. Well, needless to say it was the nicest experience one can have in a car(well, almost ). It handled great. Had excellent throttle response. Rode very comfortably. And on top of all that, when I pulled up, all eyes were on us. Well, to say the least, I am addicted to it. I cannot stop wanting to have it. So to solve my addiction I think I'm gonna try and get my hands on an older 911. I did some researching and found a few 911Ts for sale. I figure if I can sell my poor Jeep(I'll miss it, NOT!), I'll have more than enough to get one of them, provided they don't sell before I can get to them. But I have a few questions. I've never driven a T before(2 are 1972, the other is a 71), Is it similar to a mid-eighties 911 Carerra as far as handling goes? I will test drive the all ofcoarse, but it'd be nice to know ahead so I won't possibly be shattered emotionally if it sucks. Also,I know they don't have the power that a later model has, but they still can get into the upper 130s-140s without too much hassle or modification, right? I know speed doesn't matter too much when the speed limit is 65, but I'd be a liar if I said I'd never see what it could do(Just as a note, a '90 cherokee can do 98mph before it gets to quittin time ). Second, Comfort matters alot to me because A. I spend 30 minutes driving to school and another 30 coming back everyday B. I do alot of driving for fun on the weekends because I am young and don't have a ull C. I've been driving a Jeep with what feels like a shop stool for a drivers seat. I know the T came before the era of heated seats and personal seat settings, but for a porsche, it isn't too hard to expect comfy seats in a 911T, ya know Finally, one of the 72s is a "wide body". I can figure what that means, but is it really something worth having? It's price is about $1000 more than the others. Thanks in advance.


BTW,This will be the second Porsche in the family. My dad had a 356 when he was my age and wants to buy another one in the next few years.

[911tmaster]

you have a very good taste in cars . i would much rather have a "S'' but thats not in the buget for me. i love my 70' T. i think the older 911's have more personality then the late 70's and 80's 911's. if i were to buy another 911 (that i could afford) i'd buy another 1970 911t. if you want to get more power you can use a 2.4L crank with 2.2L p/c's and get a higher compression 2.4L T engine. all early 911's are great. 912's aren't that bad either. I say you should get a T! don't get the widebody if it's a T engine it will pretty much be all show no go. i drive 25 minutes to school and when i drove my porsche(before the engine came out) it was fine on the drive. its kindof fun showing up to school in a nice old porsche and everyone looks at you. and after a *****ty day at school the drive home gets your mind off everything.

[kcope]

I love my T. Even a stock T still goes fairly fast and handles well. Its a comfortable car. I can drive for a couple of hours without any problem.

[Python14]

I might want to add a stereo eventually, especially for those long trips to the beach and up to Wintergreen. Is there room in the dash somewhere for a small CD player and a Delphi XM system? Also, on long mountain climbs(like up wintergreen for example), how does it do as far as power goes? The carerra didn't have any problems, but the T isn't a carrera now is it?

The early 'T's are definitely no match performance-wise for a mid eighties Carrera. I think you'll find that they would max out at around 125-130 mph, but would need a very generous stretch of road to achieve this! The early cars do sound faster though. In terms of handling they are somewhat similar- less overall grip (narrower rubber) and probably not as balanced (no swaybars as standard equipment) but at least as much fun. I started off looking for a 911T and ended up buying a 1982 911SC basically because I was unable to find a truly rust-free early 'T' for a decent price (& this is in CA). Even though there was only 5 years separating the discontinuation of the 'T' & the introduction of the SC it seems more like a generational difference. The SC is a much more modern car in a lot of ways, which is both good & bad.

Looking for a daily driver these would be my criteria, in order of importance:
1/rust
2/rust
3/rust
4/mechanical condition
5/paint
6/interior

good luck!

Oh yeah, I would also avoid the "widebody" '72. This was not a factory option, it simply means that somewhere along the line someone decided to weld on wheel flares to make it look like a newer car. It could be a complete hack job which may be hiding all kinds of accident damage- I'd probably stick to cars that are original & unmolested.

Andrew

Python14-

I am on my 4th Porsche, but my heart is still with the '73 T I had a few years ago. It had enough power and good torque, so the engine was quite flexible. It was lowered, had Koni's and it was really fun. Go for it, but get a prepurchase inspection and make sure there's no rust. I repeat, make sure there's no rust! Also, you'll hear good and bad about the mechanical fuel injection, but a well tuned MFI, and it's not that hard to tune, is very responsive and gives great power.

-CKrause

[Python14]

okay, looks like a may be going in the right direction. But one hitch up, I just got off the phone with the owner of the non-wide body '72 and he said he already had two offers for it. I haven't talked to owner of the '71 yet so I don't know about it yet. I've only seen pics of it and the pics don't show anything bad. The wide-body '72 though is a different story. My dad dropped by and took a look at it because it's nearby and said it was in good condition. I know yall have been telling me to steer away from it, but if it gets down to my only choice, and sadly it might be, should I go for it or just try and scratch a deal for another Porsche? My dad said it looked fine, no rust or repair marks. It will still be a while before I can even get to selling my Jeep so another deal may pop up, who knows? But either way, if it got down to either the widebody, or no Porsche at all, what should I do? Thanks for all the help on this.

[911tmaster]

THERE ARE ALWAYS GREAT DEALS!!!NEVER JUMP AT A CAR!!

[Python14]

So the widebody isn't really worth jack?

[adamred]

Just thought I'd chime in as someone who fairly recently finished the "search" of a lifetime....Patience my man, patience.....There's plenty of P-cars in the sea...if I took the first one that caused my heart to leap out of my chest I'd be a hurtin' unit right now, that thing sat for months afterwards, it was a POS.....but that first drive and the feel behind the wheel, even in a POS makes you want to throw caution to the wind and write a check on the spot.

Cruise the online resources, here and at Rennlist and find the one that matches your criteria...

just my .02

Adam

[Red911t]

Don't buy any 911 with out first having it inspected by a reputible mechanic. The early cars love rust so be careful, I love driving my 73T it has alot of get up and go. I still dream though of owning a 72-72 S. When I bought my T 6yrs ago it was a process of almost 6 months to find one in great shape and no rust. In your process of looking you will find alot of people that don't treat their cars with much care. Good luck.

[Jim Richards]

Python, if you don't like the look of the widebody T, don't buy it. Conversely, if you like it...

Patience will serve you well. Cars come up for sale all the time. If you see one that you sort of like, wait a while and you'll see one you sort of like in a different way. Wait a while longer and you'll see one you like a lot more. In between, you'll see a lot of junk. It's a real test of your patience. I've been looking since early summer and I'm still looking. Some interesting cars have come and gone, more are just waiting to arrive on the scene. Have faith!

Good hunting,

[jeff m]

A 72T is great fun, but keep the jeep!
Be prepared to do a lot of the maint yourself, not only will it make
ownership very affordable, it can be very satisfying.

Don't rush into anything, it's a buyers market.

Look at a few, drive a few.

You might find the 911 & 912 book by DR B Johnson useful ,it covers '65 to '73.

Jeff
911T

[Python14]

I'm fine waiting if it means a better deal. I just want to get rid of this excuse for an auto that my dad calls a Jeep more than anything.
BTW, Personally, I thought the wider look of the wide-body was nicer. My main query is whether is has any mechanical consequences related to it? I want the most information I can get on it before I even start talking to owners about writting checks.

[LeRoux Strydom]

Young man

Your choice of future automobile is admirable, and so is your enthusiasm to get out there and find a good one.

HOWEVER, I advise that you exercise caution and patience unless you have buckets of money to burn. First of all, find yourself a few good books (Paul Frere, etc, search Amazon) to read up on the history and development of these cars, there you will find all the explanations of the different models, engines, trim, performance etc., in order to make a more informed choice. For instance, you will learn that before 1978 the bodyshells were not galvanised or only partly, and therefore very susceptible to rust. You will also learn that the 2.7l engine produced between 1974 and 1977 has some real expensive case design limitations to fix in order to remain reliable. Carreras have weak rod bolts and valve guides (SCWDP rules, OK). Excuse me if I am preaching to the converted here. The point is that you should almost be more knowledgable about the car you are looking at than the seller!

Then you are ready to set yourself a budget, and to go out and look at a few cars, drive them, take them for pre-purchase inspections etc.etc. Especially in an older car, look for rust and mechanical condition as paramount factors, since these will eat your wallet alive if serious problems crop up. Remember, buy in haste, repent at leisure!

Good luck in finding a car that suits you! Let us know how the search goes, there are lots of cars available where you live.

My rantings here reminds me of the story of the two bulls looking at the herd of cows over the fence. The young bull impatiently says: "Let's jump over and do two !!". The old bull replies: " Nah, let's walk around and do them all." The point is: patience rewards!.

Regards

LeRoux

[twin plugged targa]

Excellent post 'leroux'
Good advice from just about all posters.
I had an 86 Carrera and have just purchased a 71 T so feel fairly qualified to compare.
Handlingwise- I felt more confident in the Carrera in cornering- wheels roll bars etc.
Comfort- the same as I have SC seats (I believe)
pride- The T gets soooo much respect and 'thumbs up' it's unreal! People seem to dig chrome!
Power- well my T has had a magic wand waive over it my 'Butch Stokes' and now puts out about 20-30 more HP than the Carrera in a lighter body!.

However, if i was a newbie looking for a 1st Porsche I might tend to look for a good galv. 911 SC.
Either way get a good PPI

PS welcome aboard!
Ben

[RoninLB]

Python... how much you have to spend?? ..................Ron

[billwagnon]

Before I bought my car I spent at least 3 hours on the phone with the owner. Other cars I looked at (long distance) were a similar experience. If the owner doesn't want to talk, you don't want the car. Another incredible resource is this board - find someone near the car who can look at it. I continue to be amazed by how helpful the Pelican community is! Learn all you can from the board. My feeling was if the current owner knew less about these cars than me, I wasn't interested in buying it.

The funny one I had was an ad in Hemmings that I responded to with email - I sent my list of 23 questions and the owner responded "I'm not going to spend my time answering 23 questions this is a $10,000 Porsche!" (like oh wow). Four months later his ad was still out there and every time I saw it I had to chuckle.

Conversely, you have to realize that if you buy and then decide to sell it's going to take you some time and effort to unload it.

Give it time. The first (and still only) 911 I have ever been in was the one I bought, and it was worth the wait!

[Chuck Moreland]

It sounds like you want a later car with extra creature comforts and modern amenities. You are "settling" for an early car due to price.

Early cars have a lightweight feel and provide driver feedback that the later cars lack. They weigh less and with performance mods can be faster than a later car. They have slender styling that some feel is better looking. And they have a nostalgia factor that the later cars don't have, yet.

In a nutshell, those are the reasons most people drive an early car. Few people "settle" for early cars due to price, they seek them out despite the financial resources to buy later cars.

You will likely spend more money on repair and maintenance. It may not be the bargain it appears.


You may do better to check out a mid-70s car. They have the lowest prices of any 911. And they tend to require less repair and maintenance than an early car.

They have more of the creature comforts you seem to want and the styling is nearly identical to carreras through '89, save for rear flares. Look for a 2.7 liter that has had a proper engine rebuild.

You haven't talked about budget. You should know that keeping a 911 on the road requires substantial ongoing investment. Purchase price is just the beginning. If you do all work yourself and just maintain the car, plan on $1k-$2k per year. Unplanned breakdowns, performance upgrades, restoration work or hiring a mechanic to do your labor will quickly multiply those numbers many times over.

Not to discourage you, but be sure you know what your are getting into.