Steering Column U-joints

[patkeefe]

SC is apart for some front end maintenance and fuel line change. I pulled the steering rack out so I could get to the fuel lines, and I rebuilt the rack while I was in there. I figured I'd lube the column u-joints also, since they'be been there for 37 years.

I decided I'd just get some new joints, but they are hard to find. I really don't want to pay $355 for a new shaft and two jointed couplings, when all I need is two u-joints.

Does anyone know of a replacement u-joint (the actual cross with four caps, which are Nardella 1009? Those litte buggers are hard to find.

TIA,
Pat

[Reiver]

Are they loose? The movement of that joint is minimal and with little stress...it is not spinning like a u joint on a drive shaft and I've had some of those in place for over 50 years and they were still serviceable.

[boyt911sc]

Pat,

I have saved a couple of these u-joint but never had the chance to need one. I know there would be a time that I would use it someday. PM me your email and will send you some pictures.

Tony

[patkeefe]

The joints were probably OK. I just think it's a good idea to lubricate them after a long period of time.

[Otter74]

boyt911SC,

If pat doesn't claim one, I'll raise my hand for one if you're willing. I'll send you something for it if you like. I have a bit of play in the smuggler's box U-joint in my SC, and I'd like to address it in the semi-near-term future, and I, too, don't want to pat $350+ for a whole new shaft, etc. when I only need a joint.

[patkeefe]

I ordered two joints from a VW supplier, which are EMPI 3149.
I also found that the joints are what is know as 16mm x 40mm, and are fairly common. They can be sourced from jason@theujointstore.com, although I have not verified that these are identical replacements.

[Ferrino]

Originally Posted by patkeefe

I ordered two joints from a VW supplier, which are EMPI 3149.
I also found that the joints are what is know as 16mm x 40mm, and are fairly common. They can be sourced from jason@theujointstore.com, although I have not verified that these are identical replacements.

That would be a great find if it's a true equivalent: please report back on the EMPI product!

[boyt911sc]

Pat,

These are the U-joints I've been saving for more than a decade and never had a need for them. But I would be keeping one in case one of my cars would need one someday. Make sure you stake the U-joint to keep it in place. Personally, I would not use a rebuilt U-joint for the fear of having a mishap while driving. Same with a steering ball joint.



Tony

[tdw28210]

There was another thread recently and believe lubrication of this joint specifically with Kroil Oil was the consensus on improving the joint's feel. Now, these joints felt "stiff", not loose.

And yeah, please confirm the EMPI part. Makes me want to start hunting EMPI and other VW sights for similar Porsche-friendly parts.

[sugarwood]

Is this part right in the smuggler's box? I will coat mine with Kroil.
Besides this one, can anyone identify which/where other joints in the steering system should be lubed?

[tdw28210]

Originally Posted by sugarwood

Is this part right in the smuggler's box? I will coat mine with Kroil.
Besides this one, can anyone identify which/where other joints in the steering system should be lubed?

Yes.,in the smug box. More details here.

1984 911 Carrera Heavy Steering

[patkeefe]

There are two of these joints. I use Aero Kroil for penetrating oil, I don't think it is of the 30 year lubricant grade. I will advise on the EMPI parts when they arrive. BTW, there are a lot of these 5/8 36 spline joints at speed shops. Evidently, it is what was used in the old Chevy Vega, and a lot of drag racers used those steering mechanisms, as they were compact and lightweight.
Pat

[tdw28210]

Originally Posted by patkeefe

There are two of these joints. I use Aero Kroil for penetrating oil, I don't think it is of the 30 year lubricant grade. I will advise on the EMPI parts when they arrive. BTW, there are a lot of these 5/8 36 spline joints at speed shops. Evidently, it is what was used in the old Chevy Vega, and a lot of drag racers used those steering mechanisms, as they were compact and lightweight.
Pat

Good info and thanks in advance. That joint was probably the ONLY part that didn't rust away in a Vega. I told my Dad when I was in 3rd grade that I'd rather walk home than have him pick me up at school driving that rusty POS Vega.

[patkeefe]

The EMPI joints don't work. They are a bit short on overall length, and restrict the steering. I suppose I could modify the splined shaft to get them to work, but...not worth it.

[boyt911sc]

Pat,

PM me if you still need the steering universal joint. Once you removed it from its mounting you are compromising the integrity of the universal joint unless you could stake it as good as the original set up. You don't want it to collapse while taking a curve at the track or driving at the New Jersey turnpike. There are critical parts like a steering ball joint you don't want to mess around. If they are bad or worn out don't try to fix it. Simply get a good replacement unit. If you value your time, you are not saving at all after all the effort and time spent. As a typical DIYer, we all enjoy doing all this mini project or maintenance ourselves. As you have experience, wisdom prevails.

Tony

[patkeefe]

Thanks Tony,
I will re-evaluate this tomorrow. I am thinking about what a PITA this shaft is, as I have raisec the steering rack with the bump steer spacers. I appreciate the offer.
Pat

[patkeefe]

Today, I took one of the old joints and tried to drill a small hole in the cap to lube it. I could drill one cap, the other caps, no. They are hard as a rock, and I do not have a small enough carbide drill bit to drill the really hard caps. The action of the joints varies...the new EMPI joints glide smoothly throughout their range of travel. The old SC joints are smooth on one axis, and quite lumpy feeling in the other axis. This can be felt not only in the joint itself, but also in the steering (with the rack disconnected from the wheels). Removal of the actual Cardan (cross and caps) joint destroys the joint, but the yokes remain OK. The crosses are solid steel, and the caps are needle bearings with no thrust washers in them.

So, my guess is that the rollers just wear a little flat spot in the cap and cross, over time. The joints were obviously not designed to have maintenance done on them.

New forged joints from Flaming River do not appear to have enough angular travel to work, much like the EMPI joints. The OE Porsche joints travel through about 75 degrees, which is quite substantial. Since two new joints will cost up to $700, I will continue to explore other options. New 16mm x 40mm caps and cross are $25 each, but replacement is tricky.

[patkeefe]

I found a 914 steering column in the garage with the joints attached. They were in surprisingly good condition, so I used them. They are practically identical to the 911 joints. I'll try the new cross and caps down the road.

[Ferrino]

I'm surprised none of the remanufacturing companies are making these at $200 a pop (or whatever they cost).

[brp914]

About 7 yrs ago I bought a new steering u-joint from Porsche thru Sunset. It was ~$100 at that time. I also bought a rblt steering rack thru Sunset at the same time. After putting everything together, steering effort was awful. I thought maybe I hadn't put this joint 90 degrees out of phase with the other u-joint in the linkage. But it turns out Porsche designed it so there's only one way to put everything together. I put the old joint back in and steering was back to normal. I still have this shiny new joint laying around in case anyone wants it.

More info: I bought a shift linkage kit from Patrick MS. It contained 2 of these u-joints. They looked new so it seems they have a source for these things.