Drove '01 S2K

[kristian85]

Drove an '01 S2000. I found it a very fine car, absolutely a pure sportscar by even the most stringent definition.

It was fantastically stiff, as is expected of a blank sheet roadster, and had a very appealing seating position even for my 6'1". Fit and finish to match or beat recent Porsches seen (NB: Not older ones...), and a good feeling that it is something special.

Driving it one is struck by the fine precision of the controls, extremely accurate but somewhat lifeless steering, good control weighting. GREAT gearshift!! Snick-click--perfect.

No torque. None. Good pull in lower two gears with rapidly building acceleration, but no party 'til >6KRPM. Then, like 3.5KRPM on an older 911 Turbo, you're gone, screaming madly to 9KRPM. Very balanced handling feel and good brakes, but the engine's lacking torque is irritating, particularly on the freeway when cruising with tach < 4KRPM. To get moving, knock it down 2-3 gears. Noisome. Overall, much better handling than < '89 911's by all objective measures--truly modern, near state-of-the-art. Or, easier, more accessible handling envelope than the 911.

Very quiet on freeway even top-down, very slight buffeting, very refined. Very fine car in all ways, would be fun to own.

Getting back into my perfect '78, with the big gauges staring at me, the completely purposeful blackness of the interior, the big, gnarly rasp of the flat six, the directness of the controls, the steering feel, the massive torque, all factors relating the hundreds of racing victories during its history--I again realized that this is a SPECIAL car, one that demands respect and skill, and when given it is as fast as anything out there on public streets.

By comparison the Honda simply felt like a regular but fun car--not very special. The Honda doesn't goad you to go out for a pleasure drive in the same way. Unlike the 911, it doesn't wisper Nordschleife, Targa Florio, Donington Park, Daytona, Sebring, Le Mans, Paul Ricard, Spa, etc., every time you get into it.

Wouldn't even trade straight across.

[YTNUKLR]

That's a nice piece of writing you've got there, IMHO.

[masraum]

ditto...

That call to drive is amazing. I don't do drugs, don't need to I drive a 911 6 or 7 days a week. I drive about 30 miles (about 35-45 minutes depending) and often feel dissappointed when I get home because the drive seemed too short.

[jluetjen]

Kristian; Do you ghost-write for Kalifornia Klassic's Ebay ads????

[Kmatts]

Kristain, thanks for the info and opinions. That S2000 is quite impressive indeed, 240hp from a 2 liter motor, wow!
I don't own one, but i've looked at the prices for a few used ones and they have really come down quite a bit.
you driven anything else recently we should know about?
Kyle.

[kristian85]

Originally posted by Kmatts

you driven anything else recently we should know about?
Kyle.

Yep, you should certainly get your grubby hands on a WRX. I wouldn't want to meet one of those on a curvy road with a good driver. No Sir. Really amazing little car, fast, supercomposed handling, very difficult to get out of shape. Great brakes. In the end, though, it's like so many other fast, fun, modern cars--just not all that special, and little goading to go drive just for fun.

Also recently drove an M-Coupe--the 240-HP version. Poor body panel fit, cheesy interior, poor space, nice engine, good handling, poor control feel all around. Wouldn't trade even the 300+-HP version straight across.

Recently drove a '96 Corvette. Biggest pile of junk ever--I was set to go for 1/2 hour or so, blasted down the street and felt the whole chassis squirming sideways with NO control feel. I prompthly turned it around and went back to the lot--it was a three-minute drive. I WOULD like to own two of those--so I could burn one and crap on the other.

You should also get a ride on a Kawasaki ZX-12R to see what a 180+HP motorcycle feels like. THAT will change your whole perspective. They accelerate SO hard between 100-175 MPH you just cannot believe it. From 0-185 MPH they'll kick any production vehicle's butt very badly. VERY. McLaren F-1? Pah!

[Kmatts]

Kristian,
i have riden in a 2.5 RS recently with many many mods. I could not believe how fast/quick this car was. It didn't have the HP of the WRX but handled very well (lots of suspension upgrades). I was very impressed for a car that could be purchased for 10-12K.
I've been looking at M3's recently and I'm disappointed to hear you didn't like the M coupe. I have not driven one but would really like to, but I'm thinking there is much more value in a traditional M3 vs an M coupe. What do you think of the m3? I've been looking at the 96-98 models.
I've ridden some very quick motorcyles. Never the zx-12 however, the colour is always green, what a terrible looker that bike is.
Kyle.

[kristian85]

Originally posted by Kmatts
Kristian,
What do you think of the m3? I've been looking at the 96-98 models.

That's a very fine car--a really good friend has a mint '97 4-door 5-speed that's fine to drive. Much better car overall than the M-Coupe. Space, build quality, etc. Don't forget the M-Coupe uses the old E32 3-series rear suspension--yes, the ones from the 80's.

[Elombard]

Great report

I bought my 73 911 with 3.0 from a guy who had recently bought an S2000. He really struggled with the selling the Porsche he had owned for 15 years. They are so different. I test drove an S2000 as well and I thought it was also a special car. I will probably get one one day. I kind of like the high revving thing, my daily driver is a GSR Integra 4 door and I am used to no power until the Vtec hits. Variety is the spice of life I would like to own many different sports cars over my life. I am very pleased with my 911 right now though.

I agree on the M3 4dr, can there be a better compromise, sports car reflexes and room for the family, I really like the looks too, I was a big touring car fan.

I must disagree on the Vette. I drove a 97 C5 six speed and I was in awe of the torque!! Maybe thats why I didnt notice the poor fit/finish. As a tool these would be neat. And if I wrecked it - who cares!!! theres a million more. With prices < $20K on the the 97 vettes they are quite a bargain. I think I would get alot of tickets in a vette : -))

I also drove a WRX, It felt like any other Japanese car, a fine "tool". I wasnt real impressed but I chalked it up to not enough time to explore the limits, it was raining and the salesman was real nervous.

I am curious when you drove the WRX did you hear whispers of the RAC, Monaco, or Corsica : - ))

[kristian85]

Originally posted by Elombard
Great report


I must disagree on the Vette. I drove a 97 C5

I am curious when you drove the WRX did you hear whispers of the RAC, Monaco, or Corsica : - ))

Sorry, I actually drove the last year of the old-style Vette--a '96. I'd dump the 911 in a heartbeat for a full-on '01-'02 Z-06, though-- That's a fine thing.

Actually, driving the WRX hard, it does whisper its fine heritage.

[twin plugged targa]

I agree with your account of the S2000 -Kristian.
I found it gutless and characterless but the figures do not lie.
- It is a quick car and nimble! -But a Porsche it aint!

I believe the same is true of most modern sports cars, they seem to have lost that 'feel'

I also drove an '01 vette which felt awesome with all of that torque and felt huge/wide- a good looking car!
What let it down was that behind the wheel it looked/felt like my Chevy Suburban!!!! same controls!?

I test drove an '01 996 TT when they 1st came out and even that did not have the same draw as my old 86 Cab (maybe it is a bit more reliable though!).

I have not driven the 993 but would be interested if it feels like the 996- in which case if it is, then you can keep it!.

-Ben

[racea911]

Originally posted by kristian85
That's a very fine car--a really good friend has a mint '97 4-door 5-speed that's fine to drive. Much better car overall than the M-Coupe. Space, build quality, etc. Don't forget the M-Coupe uses the old E32 3-series rear suspension--yes, the ones from the 80's.

Psst... Kristian, don't forget your Porsche uses an old suspension... thats only what, 20 to 30 years older than the suspension in the 1980's e30 3-Series BMW's? The M Coupes that I have seen seem to have a high fit and finish quality but if I'm not mistaken, they are made in the USA which may have explained why the fit and finish was off. I like the interior design of the M Coupe. There was a 240 hp M Coupe in the Drivers Ed at the PCA Club Race at California Speedway last year and the guy was absolutely spanking 911's with equal power and less weight. A friend of mine instructs with San Diego PCA and is generally regarded as a pretty damn good driver. He has a 73 RS look with a strong, fresh 3.2 and 2270 lbs. The M Coupe should have been a speck in his rear view mirror but his comment, "MAN! I have nothing for that Bimmer. I can't catch him in the straights, I can't catch him in the corners, and I can't catch him under braking."

[kristian85]

Originally posted by racea911
There was a 240 hp M Coupe in the Drivers Ed at the PCA Club Race at California Speedway last year and the guy was absolutely spanking 911's with equal power and less weight.

That's somewhat to be expected, although I leave a largish questionmark over it.

Nothing you said has anything to do with what I said. When addressing the cars from purely subjective perspectives, that is feel, fun-to-drive, character, etc., then, like I said, the 911, any 911, shreds the M Coupe into oblivion. Period.

M Coupes don't even register on my radar screen. The E36 M-3's do. IMO the M Coupe isn't anywhere near as desirable as the objectively superior and much better engineered S2000.

I remember my first track school on motorcycles 10 years ago on my Ducati 851--a deadly serious sportbike. I was also absolutely spanking every other supposedly superior bike (faster, better handling, etc.) on the track at the end of the day. I was even blasting much faster bikes down the straights.

Late in the day I was railing around a 80-90-mph sweeper, knee in the ground, etc., feeling god-like in my abilities being one of the two fastest students there. Then, three-time national superbike champion Reg Pridmore, whose school it was, passed me on the outside of the apex going 10 mph faster than me on a far INFERIOR machine, a lazy, fat, heavy, slow BMW K-75 WITH A PASSENGER ON BOARD. Like he was reading the Sunday paper.

It was then I truly understood that vehicles do not beat other vehicles. Basta.

[twin plugged targa]

My 02 VWGTI is fast comfortable but BORING!.

Sometimes I just drive the 911 with nowhere to go!

A newish A4 3.0 Quattro started playing cat and mouse with me last week on the way home to the point of irritation and so I let my 31 yr old car toast him!.
- was he shocked!

Modern day cars lack character and feel- from a bygone era!
'Belle Epoch'

-Ben

[Stuttgart951]

Good read.

Ive never driven an S2K - most of what heard about the car was from track junkies who were anything but impressed - so a fresh perspective is always welcome.

I was looking at E36 M3's about a year ago and found them to be about as perfect a balance between "sports car" and "sedan." Granted they are comprimises in both areas, but a decent car. I think they are GROSSLY underpowered, and lack "feel" but they are capable if you can trust the car enough.

The WRX is an interesting car... the AWD system is doubtlessly capable, but the lag is horrible and the suspension feels like jello - again, semi-capable car that just lacks the "spirit" of a 911, for example - nothing to write home about.