My Suspension (Plus) Project

[rollandburn]

Hi, I'm in the process of upgrading my suspension and thought I'd document what has stood out for me as the project moves along, perhaps others may find it helpful. I started another thread in August asking for input on what other repairs to consider 'while i'm in there' and as expected a few extra tasks were added to the list. This all came about after a trip around Cape Breton's Cabot Trail in my dad's 87' 911 with new rubber, fresh brakes, turbo tie rods, steve wong chip, and a basic alignment. Compared to my car it felt awesome. Tighter in the turns, more stable at speed, softer over the bumps, and peppy with the chip. That's what you get for continuously improving your ride over time.

Background...
- 1985 911, mostly stock save exhaust and fabspeed bypass.
- I'm a computer nerd not a mechanic.
- Work takes place 1.5hr drive away at dads, a newly built garage intended for word working. I have a tool chest and a good selection of hand tools but nothing like parts cleaners or hydraulic presses, air tools etc
- This was made entirely possible by being able to sponge just enough confidence-inspiring info from this forum, so thanks!

Never having done a job like this before I've been taking it slow to make sure I understand exactly what's going on, and to give myself the best chance at getting things back together properly. When it comes time to reassemble I'll no doubt be thankful of the little extra effort put into methodically bagging and tagging everything.

Most of the suspension parts have arrived from Elephant and I'm waiting on shipments from Pelican.

- ER polybronze bearings, adjustable spring plates, monoballs
- 22/29 torsion bars
- Tarett adj. sway bars front and rear
- Wevo rear sway bar mounts
- Bilsteins front and rear
- Brakes (new rotors, braided lines, caliper rebuild kit, diy refinish)
- Wevo shifter, gate, and psj
- Rennline 4-piece pedal set and floor boards
- Pedal rebuild bushings
- Steve Wong chip
- Ultimate Engine Sound Pad (or 'Utimate' as our host calls it =])
- Valve job kit
- Fuel filter, distributor, rotor, plugs, oil filter, air filter
- Momo Prototipo wheel and hub adapter
- Steering column bushing

Looking at this list after almost 10 years of ownership and only performing regular maintenance, I'm reeeeeeally looking forward to getting back on the road next spring let me tell you.

Current status...

- all front suspension and brakes out
- front strut mounts removed
- steering rack out
- nearly all rear suspension out... tackling one last bolt on the inner drivers side trailing arm tomorrow. Unfortunately there's a small cooler and cables getting in the way of any tools I try to fit up there so it looks like more dismantling. =\

Have to say, one of the most rewarding aspects of this project (so far) has been that I finally understand 'how' the suspension works... admittedly I don't know much in the grand scheme of things but there wasn't anything I took apart that didn't make logical sense. The second best part is realizing I probably will never have to pay for this type of mechanical work again... it's been a breeze with zero frustration.

Ok maybe I'm exaggerating zero frustration. The toughest tasks have been...

1. Trailing arms... Because the car is only 24" off the ground it was hard to get leverage to crack the inner trailing arm bolt. With the trailing arm all the way down, the right body position under the car, and the right length hollow pipe over the wrench I was able to just get it cracked and the bolt out. The driver side not so much... more disassembly, grrr.

2. Rear shock install... after searching I found where the rear shocks come through in the engine compartment. Forgot how inaccessible they are. It's pretty tight to get one hand with two tools back there but I eventually got it with some help from the old man (who'd done his the year before).

3. Ball joint castle nut... jeezus, one is still stuck in the now-removed A-arm after lots of upside down hammering. Gonna to try to get that off this weekend with a recently-acquired 66.5mm x 80mm lockout socket that fits the castle, although it might be too chewed up already. Maybe heat and a chisel will do, although that's just a guess. It's times like this where experience goes a long way I'm sure.

4. Dust cap removal. Without the correct tool this is actually pain in the ass unless you don't mind beating on the cap, and I didn't have the correct tool. I walked the cap out with gently prying using the u-bolt for leverage and a flat something-or-other (can't remember flat screwdriver, pry bar, chisel).

Other than that it's surprisingly been a piece of cake. Learn, look, learn again, remove, bag, tag, next... I'm realizing this is not a big project, it's lots of little ones.

Now I'm in cleaning and refinishing mode, wishing I had done a full and proper clean of the wheel wells etc before ripping everything out since I'm not inclined to powerwash and degrease in the garage. Oh well, hand scrub it is.

Things to do...

- rebuild calipers
- drill holes for through-body Tarrett front sway bars. Unfortunately I couldn't see the impression where these mounts are supposed to go under the shutz... i'll start picking it off and see what's underneath. Not chuffed to have to do this =[
- scrub, por-15, prime, paint any old rusty parts such as the A-arms, brake rotor shields, underbody pan, trailing arms, wheel wells, calipers. I have a load of Por-15 and Wurth chemicals in the mail.
- remove and refinish gas tank (slight rust and peeling shutz/rock guard around the drain hole on the bottom, and it'll be easier to install new sway bar mounts)

And that's the list for this weekend so not such a big deal many parts have yet to arrive.

I'll probably save a few items for when I have the engine out anyway... however the more I think about it, the only reason the engine isn't out already is because I can't settle on an easy way to get the car 32"+ off the ground (could do the ole 'jack and stack' with wood). I wonder how much easier it will be for the mobile welder I hire to install the Wevo sway bar mounts with the engine out... hmmm. Apparently I'm looking for reasons to make the job bigger. =] Bilstein's are off to Chuck for spindle raising, I'll have time to think about it.

I also had a poke at the only real rust I could see around the sugar scoops... ugh. Screwdriver went right through. Another addition to the project. I'm considering pulling the quarter panel right off the car and having a go at it myself, or at least prepping it as much as possible for a pro to weld in fresh metal.

Heading back out for a few days of work this weekend, I'll try to figure out how to post a few pics in the mean time.

New garage, dad built cabinets for wood working... didn't stay clean for long =]


sirmixalot approved...


How I managed to get the dust cap off...


How I managed to get the torsion bars out....
slight outward pulling on the rope (i used the claw of a hammer in the loop) while giving the bar a rotational jiggle and voila, 30 seconds later it popped right out.


Stock sway bar, a-arms, steering rack


Tarett Adjustable Sway Bar... i guess this means i have ocd? I never understood why people did this with their parts and took photos then posted them online... then I looked down at about 2am one night and saw this haha...now i know. =]

[Trakrat]

any updates on this thread???

[Jeff Jagusch]

You should change the control arm bushings while you have it that far apart, and also you need to modify the swaybar mount

Pm me as I have a good option for you!

Jeff

[RichardNew]

I would replace the bushings with rubber ones. The OEM bushing hold up really well.

I used Rebel Racing bushings and would never use them again. I got no customer support during the installation. They are really a work of art but I would have appreciated some help during the installation.





Richard Newton
A 26-Year Project

[Kraftwerk]

Turns out there is a lot of ' while you are in there ' stuff... like rebuilding the steering rack for instance, now that you have it out, etc.

[rollandburn]

Yep, time for an update. Without a strict plan and having lots of time available it was easy to stray into side projects; a bit of pondering is all it takes to come up with another item for the To-Do List.

Gas Tank
I looked too long at the gas tank while taking a break one day and noticed a bit of rust peeking through the grey coating, decided to pull it out. 5 minutes with a flathead screwdriver and it was clear I’d made the right decision… uncovered quite a bit of surface rust along the seam sure to cause a problem down the road. My guess is the foam seal holds moisture from exposure to the road below and over time the inevitable happens. To remove the shutz without resorting to chemicals I tried wire wheels (terrible), 3M coarse stripper discs which (not bad), and a cordless multi-tool (best)… and it still took me 6hours to get it to bare metal. Even with all the time in the world I would still never do this job again if I could help it. Someone else can have my money and I’ll play with my navel for however long it takes. Loud, boring, monotonous, no skill job. Blech. Once it was finished though, I’d grown quite fond of my nice shiny gas tank haha… it was a shame to have to por-15 it immediately. After that I sprayed on the Wurth under coating, I can’t remember exactly which one it was. I should find out though because I recommend NOT using it. I underestimated its sound deadening qualities compared to the original coating so my finished gas tank now sounds like an empty sea container rather than a rubberized chunk of metal. Hopefully it doesn’t have too much negative effect.



Front Sway Bar
Deciding to cut holes in the wheel wells for the Tarett sway bar install was a mildly uncomfortable experience. Once I cleaned off the grime and got a light shining at the right angle I was able to see enough of a depression in the shutz to locate the factory mount location. After a quick wire brush of the area and seeing the obvious design accepting of a through-the-body sway bar, any reservations I had about drilling holes disappeared. And then I spent an hour burning through a handful of cheap bits. Ended up getting a nice stepped bit to make the job go smoother. My meticulous dad helped with this one, getting the holes aligned and drilled dead center… which I’m grateful for because having those holes aligned super straight keeps the sway bar from binding when travelling through its range. I didn’t quite get it so the sway bar has no binding, and spent a few hours dry-run assembling everything and then gently criss-cross torquing the mounting bolts in hopes of keeping everything straight. But, after seeing how flexible and easy to warp the wheel well sheetmetal is I realized, a) the mounts would probably be flexing with the body anyway (so I should not expect zero binding) and, b) I can see why folks would want to reinforce the area around the sway bar mount (the wall of the wheel well basically). “Like rubber” would be an accurate description… I was astounded at how flexible it is. Of course, I was testing the metal in an unnatural way by having the most leverage possible (with the sway bar inserted halfway through the mount hole and a hand applying pressure to the end). Still, it was not confidence inspiring. Also, I used silicone gasket maker around the new sway bar mounts to prevent water ingress and would assume not doing so you’d have water in the trunk for sure. I could be wrong, but am okay with not knowing for sure.




RARB Console
Speaking of reinforcement, I had a mobile welder come over and weld on the Wevo Rear Anti Roll Bar Consoles/mounts. I chopped off the old mounts with a grinder then used a hammer/chisel on the remains still welded to the body. I crawled under after the guy finished welding and it looked like he blew through the side of the Wevo mount slightly, in a couple of spots. He didn’t deny and said something about high current, thin metal… but it’s solid. In my ignorance I had to agreed. I etched and por-15’d everything then used black spray sealer. Hopefully I got the mounts installed in the correct location. =]

I also had the guy weld 'U' tabs on the control arms for the ER adjustable drop links. This was after grinding off the original sway bar mounts of course.



Por-15 and Paint
After taking out the suspension and removing the camber plates I felt something had to be done about the area around the front struts. Again with the wire brush and sandpaper to metal (mostly) then por-15 and Guards Red spray can. Turned out not too bad.






Powder Coating
Also powder coated a few front suspension components red. The control arms and mounts, belly pan, cross member. Unfortunately I’m thinking it could get a little too Christmassy down there with the green Bilsteins… we’ll see.





ER bushings
With a torch in hand and the ER instructions it was no problem getting the old bushings off the control arms. Using epoxy glue to install the new bushings was a dirty job, I probably used too much glue but was able to keep the right parts moving and clean. The ER bushing for the rear trailing arms slid right in after sitting in the freezer overnight which was kind of nice.

Zinc Plating
Of course while I’m doing all these little jobs the zinc plating bug has crept under the covers and literally stalled the project. I’ve pulled as many little bits and pieces off for replating as I felt could easily be accessed. Should be fun trying to put all those nuts and bolts back in the right place. I’ve been taking pictures of each on paper with a short written description. I decided to replate all the old parts coming off the car too, it’ll be nice to have a bucket of old parts that look brand new if I ever sell it. Like that’s ever going to happen.

Rebuild/Pack CVs
Still have to inspect and repack the CVs. I considered just biting the bullet and buying new axel assemblies but thats just lazy, and I hear the new ones aren’t the same quality. I have a feeling a bent housing I’ve found on one of the axels is from too much downward pressure while disconnected from the wheel (when it’s range of motion is greater, ie. during an engine drop). Anyway, gotta take a look at that, assess, repack.

Rebuild Calipers
Learned a lot about brakes so far and am glad to be doing this. They definitely needed rebuilding, certainly crusty after 3 years of inactivity. Some of the pistons were stuck so I used compressed air for the first time in the project. Getting the pistons out of the first caliper took a long while; set up the bench clamp, make the right size pieces of wood, develop a strategy to get both pistons out at the same time, etc… by the time I got to the last caliper it took just a few minutes to walk the rusted pistons out with air and layers of plywood. Thankfully the pistons cleaned up perfectly, as did all caliper bores (except for some slight indentations from the first piston removal… the piston kept angling on its way out =[ ).

Steering Rack
The steering rack was another fun job, pretty easy after all was said an done but I must admit I wasn’t too sure about a few things. For instance just how much resistance the freshly greased rack should have when sliding back and forth on the bench. The rack was in great shape, just dry… so after greasing, disassembling and reassembling several times I settled on “smooth but stiff”. Quite a bit more resistance, but still I could turn the ’T’ steering shaft with one fist. I really packed it with grease, heavy duty grease I believe. And probably in places it doesn’t need to be, like the sides of the rack that don’t touch the puck or gear… thinking about it now that grease will probably soak up dirt and create even more resistance. I may pull it apart and redo… you know what they say about repetition. =] Oh yes and I also put on the turbo tie rods at this point. Not much to it… although I feel like I’m going to need a couple of band clamps for the boot, especially since I knicked one with the tool I was using and it started split a bit right where a clamp could go anyway. Or, just get a new boot. Sigh, gotta be more careful.

Next….
I still haven’t touched other sizeable tasks… the Wevo Shifter, PSJ, and gate need to go in along with the Rennline pedals and cluster bushings. The 915 tranny is a little clunky in 1st and 2nd and I’m going to have to pull it to install the gate anyway so maybe it’s time for a rebuild. Now I just need to figure out how to get the engine out by myself, and then find a rebuilder who’ll let me watch. =]

[rollandburn]

Well, after 10 months I've got everything buttoned back together. Between work, travel, add-on projects and the multi-hours drive to the shop it's been slow going. This week it's off to Hunter Motorsports in Toronto for a corner balance and alignment.

I think my favourite part of this past weekend was putting the battery in and firing it up... on the first turn of the crank. This car is relentless, always amazes me how easy it is to start after extended periods of sitting.

One quick question, while putting the wheels back on i noticed the small square weights on the front wheels are hitting the castle nut on the bottom of the ball joint when the wheels rotates which never happened before. I'm wondering if this is due to all the components (ie. a-arms) being relaxed so far down that the angle has been reduced between the bottom of the strut/balljoint and the inside of the rim to the point of contact. I tried compressing the front suspension by jacking everything up and reinserting the torsion bar somewhere neutral near where the wheel would sit while on the ground... didn't seem to affect anything (the a-arms relaxed all the way back down when the jack was removed). If anyone has an idea how I can solve this it'd be much appreciated.

Thanks!

[will hung]

How much did you raise the spindles? I raised mine 30mm and had the same issue.

It was frustrating because the bottom of the ball joint just grazed the wheel weights. I also already had low profile wheel weights. I ended up having the wheel balance guys move the wheel weights more towards the center of the wheel to clear the ball joints. Worked out find.

[Fabspeed Motorsport]

Looks like an awesome build! Subscribed for more - very detailed thread

Let me know if you need anything!

[Tremelune]

Where did you get the Guards Red spray can...?

[rollandburn]

Doh, yes it was the 30mm spindle raising that did it. I've been told if you raise spindles 30mm you should be using bigger wheels... if using stock only raise 25mm to avoid this problem. Great. lol... the guys at the shop will have to move the weights and re-balance the front wheels, ok no problem. I'm really surprised I never realized I have 15" wheels in the back, 16" up front... a bit of a mismatch from the PO it seems.

The Guards red can came from a shop who does just that, putting OEM colours into generic spray cans...

Call Kumar @ Latsi Enterprise
320 Hanlan Rd, Toronto
1 (905) 264-5672

Found Guards Red Aerosol in Toronto

Thanks Fabspeed! You've already helped with a cat bypass... maybe when the coffers refill I'll be back for more goodies. =]

[will hung]

30mm is the limit of what can fit in a 16" Fuchs wheel. I kind of wish I had raised mine 25mm now, but there is a work around.

Don't forget that you have a 15" spare wheel/tire. You'll need to upgrade that by either carrying a can of fix-a-flat, or buy an aluminum 16" spare. I got one a red one from a 944 cheap on eBay.

[rollandburn]

Well, got the weights moved and decided to put new rubber put on (Potenza re71r). Hunter Motorsports of Toronto set up the suspension in no time and I have to say, Brent Hunter is quite a guy... super glad I have access to someone who is an obvious porsche fanatic, and not a dick about the state of my car when it showed up at his shop. I'm sure there are a lot of mechanics that wouldn't have been too happy having to search and destroy novice errors. (apparently i had the front calipers on the wrong sides... im not even sure how that's possible =). Unfortunately my maiden voyage was straight into bumper to bumper traffic for 2 hours in 35 degree weather. Overall the car feels pretty good... remarkably similar to how my dad's '87 feels and all he did was shocks and turbo tie rods (stock bushings). After getting more seat time I may change my tune on that particular point.

One thing that struck me right away was the lack of zip my car has compared to my dads. He has a steve wong chip... I have one but it hasn't been put in yet. Really looking forward to putting it in to see if it really does make that much of a difference (hoping so).

I thought my next big job was going to be a transmission rebuild but I've been advised the clutch is going going almost gone. =\. It's possible the transmission is fine and the grumpyness when shifting could be a clutch issue... will find that out when I get the Wevo shifter, psj, gate put in along with the pedal cluster bushing and rennline pedal set.

Since the point of this thread was to help others not make the same mistakes I did here's a tip... hang on let me turn on caps lock...

DON'T USE THE STOCK JACK UNLESS YOU ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO.

When i put the car down after buttoning everything up it was so low I could barely turn the front wheel before it started scraping. Arg, ok jack it back up and reindex the all torsion bars to raise the height. The problem? Car settled after pulling the hydraulic jack out and I couldn't get it back under. Wtf haha... only option was to give the stock jack a shot because it can get almost to the ground. I could see how unstable it was as I was cranking it up and was trying to be very gentle but whatever I did wasn't enough... before I knew it the car started slightly moving backwards, the jack snapped in half and the car dropped to the ground from about a foot up. I made sure there was nothing around or under the car while doing this out of general common sense and was happy I did. Luckily not a hint of damage anywhere on the car, just the mangled jack. Lesson learned... block your wheels really good, and use the stock jack in an emergency, and only when there are no other options.

[Edoyle]

Nice job on the strut towers and great documentation of what was done.

[911 Rod]

It's all old hat now!

[will hung]

I had the same issue as you regarding jack clearance, so I used to deadlift the front of the car while my wife slid the jack underneath. After a few years of doing that, not to sound like the sales guys that pop up on threads lately, but I bought one of the low profile jacks offered by our host.

Here's the link.
Low Profile High-Lift Floor Jack - PelicanParts.com

I bought it a few years ago when I got one of those 10% off coupons. But looking at the link for the first time in a couple years, my god are they more expensive than when I bought mine! I think they were 350 2 or 3 years ago. But it's the greatest jack I've ever used. Super low profile, but lifts super high. No more deadlifting and makes removing the drivetrain a breeze.

[Flojo]

I like your project and work but...

this looks like calssic spray can left overs and people cant resist to do an "all red" style... do yourself a favour and blacken these parts.

Originally Posted by rollandburn

[rollandburn]

Haha, I'm too old to dead lift anything heavier than a case of beer. =] I do have a low profile jack... the problem was that the car was pretty well sitting on the ground, even your jack wouldn't have fit I don't think. I had to reach down to open the door lol.

As for the red parts... that's not spray can leftovers but rather a well done powdercoating job. I hear you though, when I saw them for the first time I though 'oh gawd what have i done' but now that it's all buttoned up A.) you can't see **** and B.) when you can see **** it looks good!

Anyone else who put in ER poly bronze bushing witness a noticeable volume increase? Last night I had her out for a drive, the first since getting back from the shop... feels good. Doesn't sound too good though... I'm a little surprised at the creaking and clunking, mostly in the back, especially when slow over crumby roads. Going over bumps its pretty rattly now. I figure either that's what comes what you get with poly bronze all around... or something is loose. It would be hard to imagine Hunter Motorsports having made a mistake so I'm leaning towards the creaks being part of the deal with PB. Thoughts?

[Tremelune]

I'm interested to hear a response to that. I had polygraphite bushings on my spring plates, and they were horrendous with the creaking and squeaking. From all I've read, the Elephant polybronze bushings should be dead silent if greased regularly, though removing a rubber bushing from the system will introduce more vibration from the road into the chassis.

[911 Rod]

I've had the ER polybronze bushing with the grease nipples for years and they are totally silent.
Did Brent use the spacers and give them a good grease?
Or are these the spherical ones that don't require grease?