I just dropped a washer in my Weber!

Touque · 12-20-2002, 01:44 PM

ARGHHHHHH!

wasn't sure where it went but started it up, and a couple of seconds later there was knocking/clunking - RACED to shut the engine off

Removed the carb, but what do I do next - please don't say take I gotta take everything apart ...

adot · 12-20-2002, 02:49 PM

Murphy at his best !!!

Sorry to here about that . Maybe you can fish it out the plug hole.

Just kick back tonight and Dont worry about it. Dont give up or become 912 shy. Tommorrow WILL be a better day.

GoodLuck

Brett

Touque · 12-20-2002, 03:03 PM

yes, Mr. Murphy is a wonderful guy....

well, I AM stressing over it - now I think i may have to drop the engine and start pulling the heads off... hell no, i'm not going to become 912 shy, but i really didn't need this...

problem with getting it out of the plug hole, but I don't know which plug (3 or 4), plus I don't know how to get to it unless I drop the engine

think I did some damage in there? it was only a few seconds of running time? hopefully a bent plug will be the only problem (that will tell me which cylinder i suppose)

thanks for the encouraging words though Brett!

C. Clark · C. Clark's Garage

Pull the carb, get a magnet the appropriate size to fit down the manifold, I used one purchased at a auto/ hardware oulet. They come on a aluminium rod and are adjustable, mine is very strong, lower the magnet down the holes in the manifold and hope you get lucky, it happened to me once but I knew where the washer went so I never started the engine.
Best of luck,
Chas.
69/912

Touque · 12-20-2002, 05:59 PM

good idea - i'll do that first thing tomorrow and cross my fingers

i think i bent a valve though - guess i'll be dropping the engine

adot · 12-21-2002, 05:28 AM

Can the head be pulled with the motor in the car?

Brett

C. Clark · C. Clark's Garage

It's really easy to pull the engine, with proper tools and a transmission jack I can do it in less than an hour. A floor jack will work, I just like a transmission jack because I ususally do it alone. I still like the magnet trick, give it a shot.
Chas.
69/912

Touque · 12-21-2002, 08:43 AM

It's time to run out and buy a lottery ticket with the numbers 9 1 2 in it...

I was able to get a magnetic rod into #3 spark-plug hole, and fish out the offending (now squished) washer.

I put the carb back on, put the oil filter and coil back - hooked everything else back up, held my breath and started it up.........

no more clunking, and no sign of a bent valve!!!

all's well for Christmas! phew!

C. Clark · C. Clark's Garage

When I'm messing with my engine I generally cover any open hole with a rag. Next time you may not be so lucky. I'm glad it worked out.
Chas.
69/912

Green 912 · 12-21-2002, 11:08 AM

Glad you got it out. I had a K&N spring clip go in #1 and it wiped out the cyl, piston and head. My luck, it gets sucked in at 7000 RPM on the uphill at VIR.

Have someone borescope the cyl! Inspect the piston and check the edges carefully. The washer can crush the edge of the piston and it will rub against the cyl and trash it in short time. The crush will also pin the top ring in the piston and cause damage.

It is real easy to pull the motor. All you need are the usual tools, one person, one full size floor jack, a 4 foot tie down strap, one 4 foot 2X4 and 2 jack stands.
1 Disconnect the battery and only then disconnect all wiring to the motor from the body. Senders, ignition, generator and such. No need to disconnect the starter.

2 Disconnect the fuel lines at the fuel pump.

3 Remove the rear pan.

4 Disconnect the shift linkage connector that is under the cover between the rear seats. Don’t forget this part or you will really damage things later.

5 Loosen the rear wheel lugs. I like to remove the rear wheels as it makes it easer to move around under the car but it isn’t required.

6 Lift the car. To do so, jack the car up as high as you can with a floor jack using the tranny center at the differential box as a lifting point. I use a disk of plywood and a patch of old carpet in the jack cup to protect the cases. Use 2 jack stands and a 2X4 as long as the car is wide support the car by putting the 2X4 under the rear floor pan seam. (The seam NOT the pan. The point where the rear seat pan ends) Now remove the floor jack from the transmission and jack the car higher using the center of the 2X4. You will be able to get the car nice and high this way. Raise the floor stands up to meet the 2X4 and remove the floor jack. The car is stable, high enough, you only need one jack and never had to get under the car while lifting it.

7 Remove the rear wheels.

8 Remove the sheet metal that the license plate is on. You will need to remove the rear chrome bumpers to do this.

9 Loosen the front transmission bolts. Do not remove them; just back them out 3 turns or so.

10 Disconnect all the heater stuff, hoses, control wires and anything else you see that runs from the car to the motor. Check to see if there are any mounting straps to the tail pipes ect. (Remove nothing off the transmission, as it will stay. No need to remove the CV joints or starter ether)

11 Put the floor jack under the center of the motor case and put a little upward pressure on it, then remove the rear motor mount bolts.

12 Lower the motor about 3 inches. (You remembered to disconnect the transmission didn’t you?)

13 Remove the front most piece of motor tin. This is the one that sticks up over the top of the transmission. It is held in place with 4 cheese heads.

14 Get a flat cargo strap that is about 1 inch wide, run it under the transmission right behind the bell housing. Tie it off on the top of the rear strut towers inside the motor compartment and cinch it up tight. This will support the transmission after you remove the motor.

15 Lower the motor until SOME of the weight is off the jack. The strap will stretch some thus giving you some more room to work with. Now slide under the car and remove the 2 lower motor/trans nuts. Then remove the 2 bolts on top. One is a starter-mounting bolt as well.

16 Jack the motor up or down until the motor isn’t lifting the trans and the trans isn’t lifting the motor.

16 Now you can pull the motor gently off the trans and lower it to the floor and then roll it right out the back. Use the tail pipes as handles. Bolt on the motor stand bracket and only now do you need to get a friend to help you lift the bugger into the stand.

One jack, one person and the second time you do it you can do it in about 40 min.

C. Clark · C. Clark's Garage

Kurt,
I'm glad you wrote all that down about pulling the engine, I think we can all use a check list like yours. Thanks for taking the time.
Chas.
69/912

Touque · 12-22-2002, 03:48 PM

great write-up and thank you as well for taking the time!

i'm going to cut and paste this in a word doc for later - i have some books that talk about it, but they always require more than one person...

Troy

craign · craign's Garage

Just to add to Green912's list. I found that a motorcyle/ATV jack worked perfectly for dropping a 912 engine. It sits just right and all you will need a couple of 2 x 4 pieces under the engine to get it back in place, to make up for the shocks which now have little to no compression on them. No strap required either

I also found that if you jack the side of the car and have someone push down on the front fender you can get set of tire ramps under the tires. Much more secure than jack stands and you don't have to remove the tires.

Mine sat like this for 3 weeks while I replaced engine padding, rebuilt CV joints, replaced motor mounts and dust boots.

Craig
www.bay912.org

C. Clark · C. Clark's Garage

Where did you get the motorcyle/ATV jack? What was the cost? I've seen them in tool/equipment catalogs, "Northern" I think was the company I looked into.
Chas.
69/912

craign · craign's Garage

I have seen them at Kragen on sale for $59.00. I borrowed one to see how it would work and am hoping there is one under the Christmas tree.

The one I borrowed was a Crafstman from Sears, here is a pic.

http://www.hillmanimages.com/912/021019_1391.html

Craig

C. Clark · C. Clark's Garage

Craig,
Thanks for the info, I've seen that Sears jack too. The photo sold me.
Happy Holidays,
Chas.
69/912

Green 912 · 01:43 PM

I got mine from Costco. Think it was $70 or so. It is real good for type 4 pulls and when I want to pull/put the motor and trans together. When I pull/put a type 4, I bolt on 2X4s about 2 feet long to the jacks flat arms to extend them. I have found that, for me at least, it is easer to use the floor jack when I pull/put a 912 or 356 motor. I can wiggle things around better and line the splines up with ease. On the other hand it is more likely to fall off and break something when I use the floor jack rather than the ATV jack. Got real close once. Turned the handle the wrong way and almost jumped under the thing to keep it from hitting the pavement when it started to come off the jack on the way down.

True. ramps are safer and if I had a set tall enough I would use them too. I had a set and with the car on them it was still too low so gave up on them. I also have oil lines, thermostat and filter running in the fender well and I guess that is one of the reasons I pull the wheels. Getting ready to pull mine for the winter refresh, too cold and too much other stuff to do.