Thinking about switch to 914
 

Well where do I start. Ok, I went to an autocross about a month ago and just thought the 914's were the coolest thing. Being a non car guy but a 911 lover, I know all the 911 motors but not a clue on 914's. Anyways, I am thinking about trading/selling my 911 and getting a 914.

Since my daily car is not getting any younger, I am thinking about getting a 914 that I can use to go to and from work (approx 50/day) and maybe do 3 or 4 autocrosses a year. The 911 is Mexico blue with Carrera scripts so a bit lod to leave in a parking garage in my opinion. It just says kick me. I also want the car to be basically done as far as being turnkey that I can modify as time and money permits. Probably just suspension and braking when the time comes. Maybe an 8 out of 10 for looks. I guess I mean a rust free body that can have some stratches and paint fade.

Any suggestions or thoughts for something like this would run me. Any years/models to avoid? Again, being a non car guy, I haven't a clue on 914's.

Thanks,

David

They are so old that none ARE BAD cars unless they have rust. The high end concours cars are not good racer/AX cars.....find one that has TLC and mods.

Don't discount the early ones as they can be upgraded....all it takes is money....remember....RUST=BAD......

There are quite a few resources on HOW TO BUY a 914....check the site here and the www.914club.com

They are cheap as they were but still a bargain compared to some 911s and 356s....

Thanks Mike.

Yeah, I don't want a concours car but just a solid one that is dependable.

I wonder how they drive in the snow?

Are you saying that since they are old, chance are that most of the known problems have been addressed?

David

Snow? Not if you want it to last...they will handle ok but rot after awhile.

Known problems....do a search on this site and the club.....all the answers and question have been asked before.

David,
This is a switch, a 911 guy looking to go to a 914. Doesn't happen all that often, but I share your appreciation of a long ago auto that has a place in the scheme of things.
My 914 is away in the garage for the winter about now.I'll get it out in Nov. on nice dry days, but If you want a winter car, this isn't it, in my opinion.
Maybe others reading this may suggest a fun, safe auto, but a 914 , in my opinion, isn't it.

Mine is a great winter car but then I live in florida.

Run! Run, while you still have a chance. Whatever you do, don't drive one of these cars!!! Because then you'll be hooked--there is no going back. ;)

Seriously, they're not the greatest daily drivers in the world but the driving experience is simply out of this world! You'll usually find most of them to be underpowered, under-braked, very rust-prone, not too reliable, often fairly uncomfortable, loud and obnoxious... But when the roads get twisty, or you're dodging cones, there is nothing better IMHO. Very nearly telepathic response in one that's even half-decently set up, tons of road feel, excellent balance, and a very pure driving experience.

It's tough to go back. I know that I miss my 914 every time I drive my GF's 911SC.

--DD

Thanks everyone for your responses. I have a lot of thinking to do before I do anything but this all certainly helps.

David

I have owned a few of each... come dancing!

911s are fluffy, and have that nasty throttle-off oversteer.. 914s allow you to press harder, until all the wheels let go... and then it's too late!

:)


M

I went through a similar thought process about a year ago and decided to buy a 914 (and keep my 911) for the very same reasons! I have a triple black 911 Cab with polished Fuchs that I cannot leave unattended in a parking lot and wanted something I could drive more often. So far, so good! I am in the process of restoring cosmetically - just enough to be drivable - then I want to dig into it mechanically. It is almost there. I just need someone to help me weld the floorborad and I can get it back together.

What I started with ...
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1130853684.jpg

And what I have now ...

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1130853753.jpg

You may consider purchasing a six conversion 914, you will be familiar with the mechanics of the engine and have the same feel of the 911s power.

What is more dependable. A 911 3.0 or a 914 4 cyclinder. Sorry I don't know all the engine types yet.

David

both unmolested engines? i'm going for the 3.0L because i read in some articles that the 3.0 can go 250K+ (based upon bruce andersons statements and others) but i read in upfixin' that roger chaney stated that the type IV's easily go 100k. both are basically quotes from porsche club magazines.

What car is easier to work on? How hard is to drop a 914 motor in comparison to a 911?

Are part cheaper for 914's?

David

in my opinion, unless you have some reason for getting into typeIV or 914's, you'd be happier with the 911 (or 944) with more creature comforts; ie, a/c, electric windows and sunroof. my estimate with 914's is that the "first" question asked by 85% of new 914 owners is "can i get more power". this is a 30 yr old car that, 30 yrs ago, was "average" on power. in 2005, every ricer has bolt on turbos and 3x the hp of our 914s. the cost for a -6 conversion is ~$10k (after you buy the car) which may not be recovered upon resale.

don't get me wrong. i love mine (2).

The 914 is much easier to work on. First, there is quite simply less car to work on! The 914 motor doesn't have anywhere near as many parts as the 911 one, and much of the 914 is simpler than even an early 911. There are very few "convenience" and "comfort" features that we take for granted in newer cars, which means you don't have to work on those systems or work around them to get to other things.

Engine drops, for example, are approximately 30-minute exercises for someone with a good amount of experience. Even for me--who works very slowly--it's still just a couple of hours from the time I drive into the garage to the time I put the drivetrain up on blocks.

Parts are cheaper for 914s than 911s. But not that much in most cases, sadly. We always b*tch and moan about paying Porsche prices for parts with the VW logo, which is almost but not usually quite true. You'll find most 914 parts are somewhat cheaper than the equivalent 911
parts (except for systems the 914 doesn't have), but that the prices are much closer to 911 prices than Bug ones, for instance.

Some of my engineer friends (including some 914 folks) feel that the 914 is less well-engineered than the 911 overall. However, it still rewards with a much "purer" driving experience. And the handling and responsiveness is usually downright astonishing.

There are 914 people and 911 people. Most of the 914 people I know that have bought 911s are still 914 people at heart. Most of them (but not all!) regret selling their 914s, or if they own both the 914 is the "fun" car while the 911 is the "daily driver".

They're both awesome cars. Drive a 914, and you may get hooked. You'll wind up with rust in your bloodstream... You have been warned!! :)

--DD

Argeo, Come on up to Burlington and take my car out for a drive for awhile. A friend in Wakefield has a 1.7L so you can compair these two.

I second Dave on the "simple statment" and Econopa on the winter AKA snow car bit It SUCKS big time...trust me I love snow but not in my car.

Get one you'll love it I have had mine for almost 10 years and will keep till I am DEAD.........AND I REPEAT NEVER LET IT GO!

my 2 cents

I read the original question about using a 914 for a daily driver in the winter in the NorthEast.
I mean no disrespect to " Dave at Pelican Parts", but , really, it isn't anyones first choice in a slushy,snowy, icy environment.
If you want a fun, really fun car to take out on a dry, warm evening, the 914 can't be beat. But why succomb this old auto to the environs which tests the latest rust preventative measures. Keep what you have. The 914 may be acquired at a price you can afford for the "good" days & beat the other. My ..02.

I've had two 914s. One was a 2.0 and the other-1.7 that had a tweaked tricked engine. I have ridden in a 6 conversion and a 350 v8 conversion.

I wouldn't be snooping around this BB if I didn't like them greatly. It was very cool to have 2 silver Porsches in the garage. My 914 1.7 and 78 911sc.

Get one without rust and wreck free. The hunt will be fun.

I dream about that car and an old Triumph Spitfire that I have tucked away in a U-store-It and I go out and drive them. Oh it's great. Then I wake up.

Thanks everyone for the responses. My thinking is that since I don't drive the 911 much and am also thinking that next year I would like to get more into auto crosses that a 914 might make a wise choice. My thinking is why not switch to a car that is better suited. I also think, though I could be wrong; that with the money I get for the 911, I should be able to pick up a really nice 914 and still have some money left over incase anything catastrophic happens.

Now this might sound really stupid and not to disrespect 914's but my other concern is the kick me factor a 911 has. I think if you parked a 914 and a 911 next to each other in a parking lot for an extended period of time, there is a good chance somebody will kick, punch or do something destructive to the 911. My car first being a 911 and secondly mexico blue I just don't feel safe parking it at a T station while I go to work for the day, it sticks out way too much. As a result, it sits in my garage for extended periods of time, sometimes weeks. I think the 914 would be much better suited for the occasional nice day drives to work, they just don't say kick me as much in my opinion.

Oh David, thanks for the offer. I will probably take you up on it.

Thanks,

David

"I think the 914 would be much better suited for the occasional nice day drives to work, they just don't say kick me as much in my opinion."

Exactly my thoughts, and one of the main reasons I bought a 914 instead of a 911. I really like being able to go to the store and not have to worry about putting the top back on or locking the doors.

Now I just have to get my butt into a 914 to see if I like it.

David

The heater in the 914 is terrible. Almost worthless.

The weather sealing didn't work all that well when it was new, and it works less well now. Most 914's, even good looking ones, leak at least a little when it rains.

The windshield wipers are toys, on "high" they're barely better than intermittant on modern cars.

The shifter is very vague, even on the later side-shift transaxles (though a short-shift kit and new bushings can do wonders).

The 914 is loud, the radio isn't all that useful over engine and road noise.

The 914 is a scary experience on a crowded freeway, a lot of other drivers don't see you.

The 914 is incredibly rust-prone. The line goes that they will rust if you drive them past a box of saltine crackers.

I love mine, and selling it was the biggest mistake I've made (but I bought her back, so it's all good now). But it's not a great daily driver, and definitely not a winter car.

YOU'LL LOVE IT.

it's like driving a street legal go kart.

Aaron is right.

But I really enjoy daily driving my 914 all year. :)
It depends on how much you like your creature comforts.

I'm not sure I agree about the heater being worthless though. Mine will roast me out quickly on the coldest PNW days. If yours doesn't, it probably needs some work.

Let me start by going on record as saying if you haven't dipped your tub in POR 15, any winter driving would be sacrilige.

Having said that I must confess that way back when I drove mine through 2 Ontario winters. Once in college, then once again 10 years later when we returned from BC. While on Vancouver Island I used it as a daily driver. Rarely snowed there but lots of rain (yeah I know, I know and I have a big hole in my floor to punish me for it). I have no memories at all of poor winter driving. Mind you I was young then and didn't know squat. But those big wheels and great balance just ate through the snow - just like a beatle - better really. The heating system, if intact, was 'sufficient' but nothing to write home about. I can believe that in the PNW the heater sucks. Toughest job a heater has to do is keep the fog off the windscreen in near freezing rain.

Where I agree with Aaron is the noise and the sucky radio. No question - this is an air cooled pushrod 4. Ain't no way to make it purr like a kitten. But with a modern sound system you can just crank it up and blow your hearing. Then the noise won't bother you.

Funny - I don't remember anything about the wipers being inefficient nor do I remember any leaks. But then again I have trouble remembering what I had for breakfast.

I'm really looking forward to driving this beast again and see just how distorted my memories are. If I could only get the fricken thing to start!

Great daily driver.

The only time my current car has been down, is for engine swaps, coming up on three years, two more til a record.


M

In five years of ownership, this is the first time I've had a problem bad enough I can't drive the car.

Seattle doesn't get "winter". It's just one long Autumn/Spring here.

I'm thinking of Ohio winters where the high for a day is 30 or lower. The 914's heater just doesn't keep up with that very well. It's fine for the 45 to 50 degree days that make up a Seattle "winter" but still not good for an Eastern cold snap.

I've been in Seattle two years now and have needed any but my lightest jackets. By this time back East one is usually starting to break out the long underwear and goosedown parka. You really can't make any comment on the 914's heat from experiences in Seattle's very mild climate.

Mine only leaked when sitting still. Water would "weep" in along the front and rear seals for the door windows. I would assume that a daily driver would be subjected to outdoor parking on a not-infrequent basis so I mentioned the leaking.

As for the wipers, for me I thought the maximum speed was pretty slow. The "low" setting on my daily driver ('95 Lincoln) has the wipers moving faster than the "high" setting on the 'teener. Then again, I noticed that even on the 924 so maybe it's a period thing and common to cars of that era.

I hear you. I'm so glad we don't have harsh winters. I'm especially glad we don't get our roads salted. Our mild climate makes it possible to drive my 914 all year long.

The night I bought my 914 and drove it home, it was 28 degrees in Lynnwood. Being new to the 914, I didn't yet know about the heater blower lever being located between the seats instead of on the dash with the other air controls... I had to roll the window down because it was too hot.
:D

It didn't rain so hard when I was a kid, and the colors were different, before that last 300 hits of acid.


M

I think it is a great daily driver. I've been driving mine for 11 years every day...I have a great commute over a windy two lane road (hwy 92) and our winters are very tame here in northern california...heater is fine for 40deg coldest days, wipers are horrible , but rainx makes it livable...the thing I miss the most is modern headlights...the brights on my honda pilot light are amazing.

...but there is nothing like blasting over 92 with the top off after a tough day at work...

Easy fix for that. Replace the sealed beam units with Hella E-Code H4 lenses. These are NOT the same as the cheap H4 conversions often seen on E-Bay and they aren't the same as Hella's own US DOT H4 lenses.

My 951 uses the same headlights as my 914, only difference is that I've put the Hella E-Code lenses in the 951. The difference is night and day and because of the crisp horizontal cut-off of the Hella E-Code lights they don't cause problems for oncoming drivers.

Expect to pay $100-$200 for a set of Hella H4 lenses but they're worth it. Best headlights I've ever had on any car, new or old.

Thanks for the tip...I'll look into it. I have the cheap conversion now and it is definitely better than stock (which is just scary on mountain roads at night), but still not "good" by any stretch.

Heat- ya have to switch to the early style SSI Heat Exchangers to get "real heat" that will cook you out even at 25 degrees, mine does.

Headlites- H4's are nice but the Pilot driving lites instead of the Fog lites is the way to really lite up the road.

New seals are nice but everything must fit right to make the car watertight! The windows must be adjusted, the doors adjusted and the Targa top fit tight.

Geoff

(10 years of driving a 914 in Seattle rain)

I've enjoyed both 914 and 911 ownership. I bought my 911 because my 914 (with a 2.1l) wasn't cutting it anymore. SO I bought an SC. Then I spent $$$ making it handle like a 914. Now I miss my 914 and am thinking of selling for a 914. What I REALLY wanted, in hindsight, was 911 power in my 914.

I drove my 914 year round. Lousy heat. Lousy A/C (lol!).. Even with 4 snows and some sand in the trunk the car struggled for traction. I wouldn't recommend one for DD in NE winters.

911 DO handle well, they just need the right amount of $$$ thrown at them. 911's DO tell you sooner when the traction is gone and an irreversable slide may ensue. I use to be intimidated by the 911. Now I find it a bit tame(oooo oversteer. HA!)

The 914 had a natural directness in its cornering. Quick. Higher effort than the 911. Higher limit but a quick punishment when abused.