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Question HELP!!!Replacing a RR suspension console!!!

I am currently replacing a broken suspension console on a 73' 914 2L. I have a complete cut out RR chassis piece (everything between the firewalls). I am going to seperate the inner and outer console as well as the bottom piece which attaches both. Phew! Anyway, the console on the 73' is pretty rusted out, and to top it off, the po welded in some 1/4 iron pieces to "fix" the problem. I will cut out the "repairs" and attempt to weld in the pieces from the donor car. I have a few questions, and any help would be greatly appreciated!

1)Does anyone have or know where to find an exploded diagram of the RR suspension console installation?

2)Is it possible to complete this repair without disturbing the fender?

3)Has anyone out there done this repair? Any advice?

4)Are there any websites I should check out?

I will post some pictures later on...
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75' 914 2.0
81' VW Rabbit Truck "Hetzer"
07' Mercedes 350 CLK
08' Honda CRV (Turbo soon)
Old 08-03-2002, 07:31 PM
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Pic

Here is a picture of the broken console.

The red lines show the break
the green shows the welded in Iron stock
Attached Images
File Type: jpg s4.jpg (49.3 KB, 531 views)
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75' 914 2.0
81' VW Rabbit Truck "Hetzer"
07' Mercedes 350 CLK
08' Honda CRV (Turbo soon)
Old 08-03-2002, 07:55 PM
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There have been several of these replaced in the San Diego area and I talked to a body shop man a couple of years ago and he said the "best" way to do the replacement was with the car blocked level as on a frame bench or something similar. He also said to take as many measurements of the existing setup as possible and try to make some jig plates to help locate the new piece. I would also add, make sure you have the fuel lines capped and everything covered with a welding blanket so nothing gets burned. I would also tack weld the parts in, then put the rear suspension together,see how it aligns, then disassemble and final weld which would prevent having to cut full welds. Good luck, quite a job you've got.
Old 08-03-2002, 08:12 PM
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Corey,

Had some thoughts on this if I was ever in that predicament. Us midwesterners (I'm in Cinci), don't have access to those California Clevite (sp?) jigs.

At my place of employment, we have a model shop that can make just about anything from machined parts to molded parts from prototype dies (made overnight). One of the tricks that the model makers use is to align parts with a form of bondo before they work on them. They spray the parts with mold release, mix up this thin poyester form of bondo and press the part part way into it. After it sets, they machine the heck out of it and pop the part out when finished. Can't remember the name of the bondo stuff but it is a thin polyester material that is designed to to cover minor defects in primer and comes in a round plastic container with a bellows on top so it can squirt out. It is made by Everglass in Cincinnati.

Using this principle, place a 3/4 sheet of plywood under the car so that it is positioned mostly under the under the floor pan and extends rearwards under the console area. The plywood will be the frame for your alignment jig. Cut out areas as required for clearance and access. Attach 2x4's under the plywood (long length extending down) for additional stiffness if needed. This will form your "alignment jig". Spray mold release in selected areas on the bottom pan of the car (under the seats). Mix and apply the bondo onto the plywood in selected areas that are under the sprayed corrugated or dimpled features on the bottom of the floor pan. With a pair of jacks strategically placed under the plywood, raise the plywood into contact with the bottom of the car and the wheels off the ground. When the bondo sets, you will have aligned the plywood to the pan of the car. If you want, you can drop the jacks and make sure that the alignment jig can detach the plywood from the pan. Might want to do this in several steps to ensure that you can remove the "alignment jig". If done right ( at least 2 points spaced apart) the bondo alignment features will assure you that you can accurately raise and realign the "alignment jig" to the pan of the car. Since the bondo is soft, I would hazard a guess that large areas of bondo will be needed.

You now want to extend your "alignment jig" up to the the console using bondo to capture key features on the areas you will cut out. If you are lucky, you can remove the trailing arm and use the trailing arm mounting holes in the console as the key alignment feature. Place an appropriately sized (snug) dowel or steel rod through the mounting holes. Using wood ( or other materials), build up to close to the ends of the rod hanging in space. Once close, use the bondo trick under 1/2 of the diameter of the rod to create a "U" shaped alignment fixture for the rod. Use large areas (inch or 2 per side) for the rod and spray mold release. Cut back excess material with a knife. Build up bondo to capture where the ears are located side to side (ears have the trailing arm mounting holes). Continue capturing features in this manner: spray mold release on the part you will build to, build up rigid material towards an alignment feature, apply bondo to capture feature location.

When you drop the plywood "alignment jig" down, you have made a mold of the bottom of the car that aligns the trailing arm to the pan of the car. Haven't thought out if the section under the trailing arm needs to be built up on a second piece of plywood that that part of the mold can be attached and detached to allow removal of the cut section and placement of the repair section. If that section is removable, then the plywood sheet under the pan doesn't need to be removed. Just make sure that pins or someting are used to realign the removeable section to the plywood alignment jig.

When you weld, use lots of small tack welds, lots of weld blankets, a fire extingiusher and be careful. Also , I would use MIG welding rather than gas. Wood and bondo IS flammible.

Looked in the body book (#8) in the factory manuals. There is an exploded view of the parts of the rear half of the car. It only shows inner and outer rear fenders- no suspension pickup parts are visible.

Ken




Old 08-04-2002, 08:41 AM
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The pics from the body book can be found at this link:
http://www.dgi.net/914/914body/914body.html

As for fire extinguishers, I would suggest CO2 or Halon. Dry chem extinguishers are not good for aluminum, for wiring, and possibly other stuff as well.

CO2 is cheaper than Halon, and if it's a garage extinguisher you can make it plenty large.

--DD
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Old 08-04-2002, 09:28 AM
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Thumbs up Alignment

Hey thanks, that was VERY helpful. Truthfully, I had not thought much about the alignment...

I am replacing the longitudinals as well, so those should help with alignment. Your description of an alignment jig set off the old brain clicker. I will now redirect my efforts towards getting a good picture of the pieces in their current position. I have already removed the trailing arm, so there is no problem there.

The longi repair pieces have a tie-in to the rear console(see pic), so they should force align the outer console anyway.

I am using a mig welder. Thanks for the tip on the extinguisher Dave!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg longi2.jpg (42.9 KB, 437 views)
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07' Mercedes 350 CLK
08' Honda CRV (Turbo soon)
Old 08-04-2002, 10:18 AM
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Holy cow.

Come get a chassis from me for free and save yourself the headache.

I have a silver 75 chassis that is rust free and complete.

We do rust repair with the Cellete bench but only on really valuable cars like 914/6's and cherry 73 2.0's.

The fender is undisturbed during our process.

I applaud your effort, but I also suggest finding a another chassis. I would hate for your console to RE-brake under load because you didnt have something done correctly.

This is a major safety concern.

B << Palo Alto Ca. with chassis'
Old 08-04-2002, 12:46 PM
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I agree with brad (like Iwould ever be dumb enough to disagree with him :-) The work involved in bringing that car back to spec is not really justified unless it is some sort of personal challenge or the car has severe sentimental value. There are just too many rust free rollers out there. granted most of them are in california and not Indiana, but for the amount of time and work involved in fixing your car you could get one shipped and be done with it.

I see virtually rust free 914s getting cut up or sent to the crusher all the time, we should be able to snag one for you.
Old 08-04-2002, 03:33 PM
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He is in trouble.

90% of my relatives live in Indianapolis.

I *could* deliver one to him and call it a family visit.

I hear Wyoming and Nebraska are great this time of year.

Hum.. maybe even set it up so I could attend a race at IRP.

B
Old 08-04-2002, 04:11 PM
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In your first post you said you were using "1/4" iron". I hope this is not the case. You really can't be welding 1/4" of anything much less "iron" to the sheetmetal of a 914.

Take thier advice and find a rust free car on Ebay and ask someone here to go look a it for you before you buy it.

Driving a 914 is much more fun than fixing a rusted 914.
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Old 08-04-2002, 04:44 PM
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Could I be dreaming or did you just say...

BRM9148: Was I dreaming, or did you say you might be interested in delivering a 914 roller? What do I have to do to make that happen? Man, that would advance my schedule by 20 months! I don't have the big bucks (my thing is to SLOWLY get together the stuff (parts, tools etc...) ,so my progress has been depressingly slow. If you're interested, you can see what I have done already at:

www.pelicanparts.com/motorcity/balthazar/73_914.html

You are probably swimming in parts so I don't know if you would be interested but...

I could trade you one or several of the following:

*Left and right longitudinal reinforcement pieces
*2 left and 1 right rear complete suspension assemblies
*one 73', one 74' front end
*various 73' FI parts
*complete 74' FI
*Taillight assemblies, front turn signal assemblies etc...
*All gauges (except tac)from 74' with appearance group
*74' 1.7l (with or without FI
*83' 2.0 bus motor (other various 83' bus parts)
*newly rebuilt (<1k) 68' Ford 300 truck motor (see link below)
*86' Ford econoline van (I could even install the 300 as planned)

Lots of stuff not mentioned...

I have two complete cars (minus rust of course) so as long as I have one (or two as the case my be) of everything, you can have whatever you want!

You can email me at cdfriel@yahoo.com if you are interested...
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Last edited by balthazar; 08-05-2002 at 03:48 PM..
Old 08-05-2002, 03:46 PM
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A pic of the other car...

A pic of the other car (by the way, that's not my shop in the background)(I wish!!!)
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75' 914 2.0
81' VW Rabbit Truck "Hetzer"
07' Mercedes 350 CLK
08' Honda CRV (Turbo soon)
Old 08-05-2002, 03:50 PM
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1/4 inch Iron

URY914: The previous owner had welded in 1/4 Iron barstock to "fix" the problem that I am now attempting to deal with. Soooo, I will have to cut out the barstock before I can replace the console!
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81' VW Rabbit Truck "Hetzer"
07' Mercedes 350 CLK
08' Honda CRV (Turbo soon)
Old 08-05-2002, 03:54 PM
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I give you credit, you are adventurous! sometimes I don't even think my '73 project is worth it (needs right side engine shelf and corners of firewall replaced), then I see how bad rust can be. like others have said, you might be better off importing a roller from CA or AZ, unless you want to tackle the project for other reasons.
Old 08-07-2002, 11:59 AM
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I would consider delivering a roller.

Most of my relatives live in Indy.

You'll have to pay for my gas and obviously the car.

Your looking at a Oct. delivery date from me.. if we can find you a decent chassis.

The 75 I have would have to be smogged before it left the state of Ca. I'll cut it up before that happens. I have already been through this with the state of Indiana on another silver 75 we sent to a guy in Gary, Ind.

B
Old 08-07-2002, 02:50 PM
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Porsche Crest Now we're talkin!

If you can't already tell, I am very interested. I guess I don't really know where to go from here...I take it you own a mechanics shop? Maybe I should give you a call? If you give me your e-mail I will send you my PH#...

Let me know...cdfriel@yahoo.com
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75' 914 2.0
81' VW Rabbit Truck "Hetzer"
07' Mercedes 350 CLK
08' Honda CRV (Turbo soon)
Old 08-07-2002, 04:28 PM
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