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How much more power,from Carbs

If I build the 2.0 a little wild the 2056 with maybe bigger cylinders..how much more pwr/trq can I get from carbs over FI system,..I dont like messing with carbs BUT if it is a BIG advantage I may very well deal with it ???? Thanks FM
Old 05-15-2014, 04:36 PM
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If you stay with the stock cam, the difference will be just about zero.

If you go with a more aggressive cam, you can get more power out of the carbs.

--DD
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Old 05-15-2014, 06:53 PM
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And, at no extra charge, you'll get poor fuel mileage.

The Cap'n
Old 05-15-2014, 09:00 PM
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is the power gain worth the trouble,..????
Old 05-16-2014, 01:13 PM
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Depends on you... Not for me, but it is for a number of others.

--DD
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Old 05-16-2014, 01:20 PM
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Look, a stock rebuild, professionally done, is gonna set you back $5-7K. A properly done 2056 with carbs will probably be a bit more than that. A well prepared high performance engine is gonna be $2-4 K more. Are you ready to spend $6-7K to get 10-15 HP if that)? $10-12K to double your horsepower? And with each of those options, you're gonna get more noise, reduced fuel economy, and less reliability and a shorter life span. And, since you're gonna have to ditch the heat exchangers, no heat, so you can't really drive the car in the winter or in the rain.

The Cap'n
Old 05-16-2014, 01:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The cap'n View Post
Look, a stock rebuild, professionally done, is gonna set you back $5-7K. A properly done 2056 with carbs will probably be a bit more than that. A well prepared high performance engine is gonna be $2-4 K more. Are you ready to spend $6-7K to get 10-15 HP if that)? $10-12K to double your horsepower? And with each of those options, you're gonna get more noise, reduced fuel economy, and less reliability and a shorter life span. And, since you're gonna have to ditch the heat exchangers, no heat, so you can't really drive the car in the winter or in the rain.

The Cap'n
Its a double edges sword really,great comments by the way and then there is tuning issues ,carb linkage balance, chinese carbs or genuine webers or dellorto,yep it adds up..... and more.
No wonder the six conversion is so popular before motor/parts prices went to the moon and back.
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Old 05-16-2014, 11:35 PM
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I have a 2 L type 4, bursch exhaust, scat cam, those cheap piston and cylinder kits from
china and 40 mm webers. That's it. The little car is fast! It's much faster than any of the
5 other 914's I have owned. My next project is a 914 with a 2.5 liter type 4 built engine
and I know it's going to be scary.
Old 05-17-2014, 02:48 PM
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I built my 914 2 L from scratch. I had nothing. I bought the case and crank off eBay
and sourced everything else from a bug shop. For $20 I bought that red volkswagon
bus manual and built the engine myself. It cost me total $2000 and 4 years later it
runs as good as the day I started it.
Old 05-17-2014, 02:53 PM
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Considering cylinder head repairs on a well used but not beaten 2 liter engine can often cost $1500 and up, that number is a bit surprising. I suppose if you're an accomplished TIG welder, that number can come WAY down.

The Cap'n
Old 05-17-2014, 03:05 PM
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I am an accomplished tig welder, as well as arc, mig and acetylene. Learned that
trade in the military after being a M60 tank driver. Why would anyone buy 2L
heads that are cracked?
Old 05-18-2014, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jess p View Post
I am an accomplished tig welder, as well as arc, mig and acetylene. Learned that
trade in the military after being a M60 tank driver. Why would anyone buy 2L
heads that are cracked?
because they are all over 40 years old, some with hundreds of thousands of miles, so it's very hard to find them in good condition.
Old 05-18-2014, 02:53 PM
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Ever try to find uncracked 2 liter heads?

The Cap'n
Old 05-18-2014, 03:09 PM
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If you have heads that are cracked or need seat or plug hole repairs, there is more to it than just welding. The heads need to be heated, welded and then stress relieved so the repairs will stick and due to the alloy that VW/Porsche used there are only a few places in the country that can do weld repairs and make them stick. After I blew my 2.8L big four for the last time (broken crank shaft) I sold/traded the parts and got a 2.2L racing six for the heads that were worth about $10,000 with the titanium valves, triple springs, Pauter rockers and relocated spark plug holes. The intake and exhaust ports has been flowed by Jerry Branch back around 2002 or so. The Crower cam, lightened type one lifters and steel push rods went for another $3500 and the dry sump system and three stage front mounted oil pump and 911 type cooling fan went for $2500 or so. As you can see making a type 4 go fast is big bucks and in the end a six is a much better route to take.
Old 05-18-2014, 04:19 PM
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I have no problem finding good 2L type 4 heads. I have 3 sets and that includes
the set I got for $200 that had a complete valve job already done and looked
like new.

To answer the original posters question regarding FI versus carbs. The AFC and
MPC types of fuel injection on the 914 are rigid and can't be altered for more
hp. Those systems are old, hard to get parts and at this point not too reliable.

My bursch exhaust bolts right up to the heat exchangers. Once you go carbs
on a 914 you will never want to go back to the fuel injection.

914 case 2L eBay $300
2L crank. eBay. $75.00
Scat cam and gear $145.00
Bursch exhaust $135.00
2L pistons and cylinders new eBay $299.00
2L rods eBay. $75.00
Weber 40.00 twin carbs new in box $395.00
Intakes $75.00
2L heads. $200.00
914 2L rebuild kit , gaskets etc $75.00
Engine tin and heat exchangers $150.00 20th street auto
High volume oil pump $45.00
Rockers,pushrods and oil return tubes $75.00 eBay
Bearings 75.00 ebay
Old 05-18-2014, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jess p View Post
I have no problem finding good 2L type 4 heads. I have 3 sets and that includes
the set I got for $200 that had a complete valve job already done and looked
like new.
Where the heck do you find 2.0 914 heads redone with no cracks for $200 a pair? I'd love to know! (Note that the 914 2.0 heads are rather different than the Bus 2.0 heads, even though both could be called "2L type 4 heads".)

I figured I had made a super score by getting a pair of bare heads to use as cores for only $350. And those might have cracks that are not obvious at first glance.

I haven't even seen GEX rebuilt heads for under $1000 each in close to a couple of decades. And I wouldn't wish GEX parts on my worst enemy...

The 2.0 914 heads love to crack across the spark plug holes, and on the short radius bend of the exhaust port. They can also crack behind the seats, which can lead to tons of fun--if your definition of "fun" involves expensive parts exiting your engine at a high rate of speed. By now, most of the ones you find available currently have cracks, or have had them repaired. We know machinists who won't even touch old Type IV heads any more, because most of them have been heat-cycled just about to death.

If you can find a steady supply of those "ready to run" heads at $100 each, I am all ears.

--DD
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Old 05-18-2014, 09:34 PM
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