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Location: Vernon, CT
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cylinder coatings? nikasil? Alusil?

Does anyone know what the exact name is for the cylinder wall treatment of the 944/968 series engines? Is it Nikasil, or Alusil? or some other coating? I was going to call some local engine builders to see if they can refinish the block, but i wanted to have my facts straight about the cylinder finish first. I know it's NOT a plating process, i've read the factory procedure, and they mention nothing about plating, the only thing special is the final finishing with the special felt pads and etching? mixture.

Anyone know where to get cylinder bores refinished?

Anyone have a rough idea on cost per cylinder?

Thanks,

Mike

Old 11-25-2003, 08:42 AM
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Its Alusil.... if you are just freshening up the engine, and the bores are to spec then you can get away with the last process that exposes the crystals (for much of a better word) so the rings will seat properly. I went this way.....

*but I have seen a few that have just thrown in new rings and did not have much of a problem.
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Old 11-25-2003, 09:14 AM
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I was hoping to not have to touch them at all, but.....My good friend, who's a mechanic, was in town this weekend, and of course, i was showing him my new 968 project. It took him less than 10 seconds of looking at my open cylinders to point out 2 scratches, in one, and some piston slap on another, that i hadn't seen. Then again, i hadn't really looked yet. I would have eventually seen thye scratches, but untill now, i didn't know what piston slap looked like on the cylinder walls.

I have not measured anything yet, and probably won't be for a while, i was just trying to figure out how much $$$ i was in trouble for. Neither bit of damage is deep, i'm hoping to be able to re-hone, and do the last process, and use tolerance group 2 pistons (provided i can get them)
Old 11-25-2003, 10:09 AM
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There is a lacking of really good shops in CT so I hear. Make sure you find one which is very respected as a good shop. Expect to pay a couple hundred. I dont know exact amounts.

I cant wait until you finish this car. Take pictures as you go.
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Old 11-25-2003, 10:23 AM
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If you have to bore. IT WILL COST YOU BIG TIME. (Sleeves and pistons are pricey)

The surfaces on these cylinder bores look different if you are used to working on iron blocks..... THese look so smooth and have no apparent cross hatch that you get some bozo trying to hone these things using a manual hone and they end up wrecking the block. If you have a scratch? Does your nail feel it?

Are you rebuilding a 968 ?
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Old 11-25-2003, 10:48 AM
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I know pistons are pricey, $400 ea at sunset imports, but....that includes rings and wrist pin. Considering they want $108 per cylinder for rings only, that's really not all that bad. The biggest downside is 1-5 months leadtime from Germany.

I don't think i'm going to have to sleeve it, i can go to the standard overbore if necessary, just need to find a shop that can apply the special processes necessary to finish the cylinder.

there's a decent scratch in 1 cylinder, and some piston slap on another. I need a dial bore gauge and an OD mic to determine what needs to be done. The piston slap could be either wear to the cylinder, or wear to the piston. 1 would require a new piston, the other would require a cylinder refinish and new piston

Yes, i'm rebuilding a 968, do a search for posts from me within the least few months, and you'll see some pictures.

Cooler - I have used Precision Automotive in Simsbury before, in fact, i just picked up my head from being resurfaced yesterday. They're pretty well respected in the area, i've used them before on previous projects, plus they've been around for many, many years. I just don't know if they have the special equipment necessary to restore the factory cylinder finish. The original question of this message was to find out exactly what the cylinder finish was, so i could call them and speak intelligently about their capabilities. I've been slacking off a little on taking pictures, i'll have to start taking some more.

Mike
Old 11-25-2003, 12:27 PM
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I see... so you are looking at +1 oversize... and these are the mahle ones?

So you are only going to replace the damaged holes.

Here this will help you.

http://www.msi-motor-service.com/download/broschueren/alu_en.pdf
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Old 11-25-2003, 01:25 PM
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Also, you should ensure you shop has the proper machine. The Sunnen CK-10 if I remember correctly.
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Old 11-25-2003, 04:04 PM
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a more cost-effective solution, and possibly superior, might be u.s. chrome's nicom plating. as i recall, their rep said they could do my 3.0l 968 engine for $650, boring $100 extra.

http://www.uschrome.com/

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Old 11-25-2003, 05:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ae1969
I see... so you are looking at +1 oversize... and these are the mahle ones?

So you are only going to replace the damaged holes.

Here this will help you.

http://www.msi-motor-service.com/download/broschueren/alu_en.pdf


Woooo Hoooooooo, great post. Where the heck did you find THAT?? No need to reply, but very good post.

P
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Old 11-25-2003, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ..P


Woooo Hoooooooo, great post. Where the heck did you find THAT?? No need to reply, but very good post.

P
hehehe........... 99 % of my post are relatively useless, and every once in a while I actually go dig up the info I have stored up on my hard drive from previous projects.......

But seriously ........this 968 should have naaaaaaaawwwwzzzz
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Old 11-25-2003, 06:36 PM
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Awesome info. Thanks!
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Old 11-26-2003, 01:57 PM
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ditto ae1969 gets a gold star
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Old 11-26-2003, 06:45 PM
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Yep,wonderful Alex!

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Old 11-27-2003, 01:50 AM
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