How much do you guys pay for headers?

[Makenzie71]

I can't find headers for the 944...or not many...which intrigues me.

Why does this intrigue me?

Because I am the owner of Shattered Glass Works. Amongst a couple other things, I make headers for the RX-7 community...the N/A 12A and 13B in particular. My products are equal-length and I tend to design them to suppliment the top end of the powerband. My products are also "no-frills" products. They're made entirely of mild or aluminized mandrel steel tubing and flanges...it's how I keep my prices low. My RX-7 parts are 25~50% less than equivelant current market parts. No stainles or iconnel. I make them to fit as direct bolt in replacements for stock components...I try to alsways retain the stock emmisions setup and offer mid-pipes for those people who don't care about the dolphins.

So, beings I'm trying to trade off my Bimmer for a 944, I'm considering undertaking a 944 header project. So who would be interested? What would you guys like to see implented? Would a couple long-time members here be willing to buy a set for cost-of-materials and shipping to give their opinions?

Just curious...mostly bored...but curious, all the same...

[Makenzie71]

Well...just found out why you don't see headers for the 944...lol. the cast manifold is basically a tubular header...but I think I can make something better than that...

[s928s]

I believe the cast manifolds were on the turbo models, the later n/a and i am not sure about the turbo has a tube style manifold. With the mid 80"s versions having a tendency to crack under stress. the later tube versions had an acordian section built in for heat expansion to eliminate the cracking.

the most common out their are BURSH and MSDS. i believe on adverage the n/a ones are in the $200-$300. range, the BURSH are sold here on pelican. I would be intersted

I have just started to look into headers fo my 87 944 N/A and would be interested in your product.

[CJFusco]

Bursch and MSDS might be the best, but what I hear is that B&B (Billy Boat) makes the highest-quality product. Most expensive, too.

[nize]

Originally posted by CJFusco
Bursch and MSDS might be the best, but what I hear is that B&B (Billy Boat) makes the highest-quality product. Most expensive, too.

what's the difference between a high-quality one, a cheapo one, and the stock one? material? design? what makes for better design?

[ae1969]

Speed force racing makes these in Stainless 304 and 321. These are on my wish list for my turbo...........

[s928s]

..WOW......nice headers...

[rammstein]

I need some bling for my engine compartment. Those headers sure would be a good start.

[CJFusco]

i would need to see cold, hard data before i ever invested in something like that

i would bet you would see more of a difference if you already had the FRWilk chip installed and then did the headers/exhaust upgrade

[nize]

i'm a total newbie about this stuff, but i agree with CJFusco. i can't see how headers can be made 'better' than stock. i mean sure they can be made of higher quality material and polished or whatnot, but does that really improve your performance? i'd say not.

i've read some writeups about 'higher flow' performance headers, but how can you get higher flow? if the exhaust ports are say, 2inches wide it's not like you can stick on headers that have 3inch diameters or something. and if you can't increase diameter, how do you get higher flow? i guess you could decrease total length of the pipes but doesn't that upset other things?

can someone please explain this?

[Makenzie71]

Originally posted by ae1969
Speed force racing makes these in Stainless 304 and 321. These are on my wish list for my turbo...........

those are shiney but they have the ugliest joints I've EVER seen on a professional product. There's no way those seams are flush on the inside. They're also NOT equal length. How much do they cost? I've seen "shiney" pacesetter products that were at lease seam-less...

[Taz's Master]

Pull off one of the stock tube type manifolds, and see if they look as impressive on the inside as they do from the outside. Mine was not clean inside with pretty big obstructions where the pipes come together. The cast iron manifolds look to my eye to be a more efficient design. I would guess that a well-designed header would offer a performance improvement, but I doubt it would knock your socks off.

[ae1969]

interesting comments from the exhaust guru's on this board.....

The previous header was only meant as a stock replacement with only subtle improvements....

The following one provides you some interesting benefits..... can you guess what they could be?

[Makenzie71]

much longer runners, and equal-length. Single 2.5" (I'm assuming, it's what it looks like) collector. That header is designed to drop the powerband (not very much, though) down...it'll bring peak down a little and the power will start building faster. The biggest thing is going to be torque...torque range will be dropped signifficantly. I would believe that if someone purchased it for a purpose and not for "I have a header" factor, they did so for tight track autoX/racing.

[Makenzie71]

That header is also along the same lines ads what I would build.

[CJFusco]

this is all extremely interesting. Keep it coming, guys!

[Blackfoot]

When doing mods to our cars, it sees like headers are down on the priority list, way down, kinda like Alex wanting to get them...someday (and he has a fairly modded car, putting it modestly) .

Before you go into machining parts, you might want to do some kind of marketing survey, to see if the market for 944 headers really exists. My educated guess is that aftermarket headers may give only a modest improvement on turbo cars, but on n/a cars, I'd guess not much at all. Bang for the buck, it may not be there. For them, rather invest in the FRWilk chip, as previously mentioned.

________________________
Cars

[Ohtori]

I can't remember where, but a couple months ago I came across a post from some racer who said he tested the 944 aftermarket headers against the stock tube header, and said the aftermarket piece made no power improvements. Just costs you more $$$.

[SlowToady]

Would you believe that not everyone buys headers for extra power? IMO, driving around with a car that doesn't actually go anywhere until at LEAST 3K is a little bit of a pain in the ass. I'd like more go more down low. If I have to pay $250 for a header that drops the torque curve into a more usable range, then so be it. As was mentioned a Wilk chip would compliment that nicely.

I'm thinking about the Bursch header this winter, but if you dream something up, I'd probably be game. As long as it makes for a bit mroe useable power curve, that is.

Sounds almost like a ricer board where numbers are all that matters.

[nize]

Originally posted by SlowToady
Sounds almost like a ricer board where numbers are all that matters.

actually, riceboys, by definition, do not modify their cars in such a way as to actually increase performance. installing shiny polished components that don't really do much is precisely what riceboys do.

of course they later brag about how their new custom exhaust tip just added 15hp and their new polished headers just gave an extra 20hp but those numbers really don't mean anything as they're purely fictional.

http://www.riceboypage.com/what_is_riceboy/

also, if the purpose of installing aftermarket headers is NOT to gain more power, then why is it that every aftermarket header manufacturer claims increased power as the top reason you should buy their product?