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944 R S?

leafing through the newest EXCELLENCE ("911 Rennsport") gave me an idea; now we all know there have been 911RS/CS cars, and the only comparable cars in the 944 range were the Europe-only 968 CS.

As we all know, many many 911 owners make their 911s into Carrera RS replicas; some are identical, some are exterior-only to concede to modern comforts.

My question is (and I'm sure I'll get flamed for this): why has no-one ever made a 944 version of the 911 RS? Is it because of the 944's relative non-exclusivity that makes such a conversion non-costworthy? Or is it the simple fact that there was no actual 944 RS car from the factory?

What I mean to say is, people do all sorts of customizing to their 944s: turbo-looks, fiberwerks bumpers, 924 CGT conversions... why not a 944 in the spirit of the RS 911 cars?

Here's how it would be done:
-Take one early 944 (for the reason they lack all the heavy power everything options), preferably in white (to match the old 2.7 RS)
-Eliminate any unneeded weight; rear seats, spare, floor mats, electric window motors, maybe bumperettes
-Replace standard door inserts with simple, lightweight, pullstrap items
-Replace stock seats with recaro items
-Replace steering wheel with simple momo item
-Wheels would have to be Fuchs
-Upgrade suspension to KONI adjustables all around; stiffer, shorter springs; thicker sway bars; strut tower brace
-Upgrade brakes to turbo/968 system
-Alter "944" and "Carrera RS" badges to read "944 RS"

If you want to be more extreme:
-Lightweight (carbon fiber? fiberglass?) doors, hood, fenders
-968-style rear spoiler; 951-style rear splitter
-FRWilk chip?
-Graphics reminiscent of 911 Carrera RS?

Do you guys think this is sacriledge? Or would it be a good project? Most of this stuff are things a lot of us have done anyhow.

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Old 09-28-2004, 07:55 PM
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I like that idea, but we would need to do something about HP, maybe a supercharger with intercooler
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Old 09-28-2004, 09:23 PM
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entertaining the idea
 
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Sounds like a very interesting idea. I agree, an early model would be best to begin with.
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Old 09-28-2004, 09:26 PM
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i think a supercharger would not be in the spirit of the project
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Old 09-28-2004, 10:12 PM
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CJ, I've had thoughts along similar lines. I agree such a car should be grand prix white with black interior, but I see it as having the old school small straight Porsche script along the sides instead in red or blue, with Fuchs painted to match the decal.

Remove the rear seats, change to sport seats up front, make a lightweight Perlon carpet kit and cut some RS-style panels. I agree that the front valence with fog lights would have to go, and I'd likely go for fiberglass bumpers front and rear without rubber and front fenders to add lightness. I don't know about dropping the window motors - is there any sort of retrofit for winders available, like from a 924? The 931 header panel would add to the performance look.

Performance-wise, I'd settle for lowering it a bit, stiffening the suspension, and maybe freeing up the breathing (headers, exhaust, intake) and adding a chip.

Emanuel
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Last edited by epbrown; 09-29-2004 at 05:17 AM..
Old 09-29-2004, 05:14 AM
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One girl who races an ITS 944 like mine has a 944RS badge on the back of her car. She says it stands for "really slow".

Her other car is a GT-3 RSR.
Old 09-29-2004, 07:29 AM
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Hmm. Yeah, the only thing that even came close was the 924 GT, and I've actually seen some darn good replicas done on that one.

Take an otherwise stock 944, strip it of weight where applicable, and give it a 500% price increase.

Twenty five years later, watch all the wanna-bes come out of the woodwork trying to clone the car. (Oddly enough, these are generally the same folks who are snobby with what a "real" porsche is).

But I'm not mentioning any particular group of model owner
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Old 09-29-2004, 08:31 AM
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Less weight = more speed

What is that equation now??.. ______lbs = ____1__HP ...? (25?)

Might not have to do too much more performance-wise



I think an RS or CS conversion would be nice. It would have to be done right though.
Just think of all the money we would save if we didn't have to fix all of those heavy 'non-essentials'!



Someone.....Photoschopp quick!
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Old 09-29-2004, 08:41 AM
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Sounds like an awesome idea! Man...now you've got me thinking on another 944.....will this obsession ever go away????

I agree...lets see some photoshop work
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Old 09-29-2004, 09:26 AM
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CJ,
I'm surprised at you. This sounds like little more than a stealthy argument for more folks to build 944-Spec Cars (stripped down interior, tuned suspension, and stock motor), albiet with a copy-cat paint scheme. Still it does sound like a cool project.
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Old 09-29-2004, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by TCMdocs944
Less weight = more speed

What is that equation now??.. ______lbs = ____1__HP ...? (25?)

I think it's 15 lbs = 1 hp. I'd think getting the car down the 2200 lbs and up to 180 hp should be possible.

Emanuel
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Old 09-29-2004, 03:30 PM
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A 944 RS would need a 210 hp 3.0 n/a engine as opposed to a 143 hp 2.5 or 188 hp 2.5 16v.

Remember, 73 911 Carrera RS had a 210 hp 2.7 whereas the 911T, E and S had 120, 140, and 160 hp respectively; ranging in sizes 2.2-2.4.
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Old 09-29-2004, 04:20 PM
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what if one were to bore the stock engine to 2.8 liters, add the wilk chip, and upgrade the ignition and exhaust systems?
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Old 09-30-2004, 08:08 AM
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2.8 16v varocam head with a high CR like 11.1, performance cams, chip, exhaust system, igntion, ohh and a MAF KIT, then it woule be sweeeeeeet. Im thinking like 230-240hp
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Old 09-30-2004, 02:17 PM
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don't forget, this would be a RS project, not just a tuning project. Light weight should be the focus, I think, followed by suspension and brakes
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Old 09-30-2004, 09:21 PM
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Why would you want to use an early 944 when the 1986 was the lightest year? Simply throw a manual rack and delete the a/c...youre set!
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Old 09-30-2004, 10:54 PM
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whoever said 1986 was the lightest year?!? this is news to me.

In the earliest cars, you have no power steering, no cruise control, no power sunroof, no power locks, no airbags, no power seats, no LSD -- hence, lighter weight.
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Old 10-01-2004, 07:15 AM
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From the 944 FAQ

The 944

Model Year HP @ RPM (DIN) Weight (lb.)
1983 150 @ 5500 2675
1984 150 @ 5500 2675
1985- 150 @ 5500 2675
1985+ 150 @ 5500 2637
1986 150 @ 5500 2637
1987 158 @ 5900 2637
944S 188 @ 6000 2637
1988 158 @ 5900 2637
944S 188 @ 6000 2637
1989 162 @ 5800 2637
S2 208 @ 5800 2637
1990 208 @ 5800 2857*
1991 208 @ 5800 2857*


Based on this, the ideal model to use would be the '89 S2?
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Old 10-01-2004, 09:26 AM
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This is a great thread!

What about a 944 Club Sport ala the 968CS?
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Old 10-01-2004, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by lousailor
From the 944 FAQ

The 944

Model Year HP @ RPM (DIN) Weight (lb.)
1983 150 @ 5500 2675
1984 150 @ 5500 2675
1985- 150 @ 5500 2675
1985+ 150 @ 5500 2637
1986 150 @ 5500 2637
1987 158 @ 5900 2637
944S 188 @ 6000 2637
1988 158 @ 5900 2637
944S 188 @ 6000 2637
1989 162 @ 5800 2637
S2 208 @ 5800 2637
1990 208 @ 5800 2857*
1991 208 @ 5800 2857*


Based on this, the ideal model to use would be the '89 S2?
The weight of the "s2" listed here is incorrect, as well as 1/2 of those figures. The s2 weighs closer to 3k. The 1986 was the lighest year as it didnt have the ABS and/or airbags that the following years had.

Oh, and the 1987 944 still had the lower compression...about 150 hp. Who compiled this list??

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Old 10-01-2004, 12:20 PM
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