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951 Machine Shop work?

With the engine out of the car, and my plans for a total rebuild underway what kind of machine work do I want to perform to the top and bottom end of the engine. I was planning on doing the bearings and rings, and of course sending the head off. What else should I have done while I have the engine out of the car?

Another question is what do I want to do about the turbo? Is there a preferred company around here who will do turbo rebuilds on a 951?

Thanks again for all of the info!
~Eric

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Eric Devansky
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Old 10-13-2004, 06:12 PM
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Have the crank checked and micropolished. After that, other than having the head done, and having the cylinders measured, you should be all set.

AFJuvat
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Old 10-13-2004, 06:40 PM
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Are you just doing the Basic rebuild or performance rebuild
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1986 951, Stock for now.
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Old 10-13-2004, 09:13 PM
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I am going to rebuild the car to stock, however I would like to build the engine to handle a bigger turbo and some other goodies down the road.

~Eric
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Eric Devansky
986s - Radio Flyer
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Old 10-13-2004, 10:18 PM
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Why not get a mild port and polish and a good valve job, It would help your turbo spool faster
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Old 10-14-2004, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by fast924S
Why not get a mild port and polish and a good valve job, It would help your turbo spool faster
A ricer friend of mine was telling me that a port and polish would not help a turbo car? I've never wrenched on a 944 or a turbo car for that matter. Thoughts?

~Eric
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Old 10-15-2004, 09:18 AM
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damn, FR, that's a BFE!
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Old 10-15-2004, 09:31 AM
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Have the Crank Cross-drilled while you're at it. It's an easy way to avoid spinning a bearing. Here's some info Huntly Racing did on the subject:
Quote:
Huntley Racing had done a lot of research over the years into EXACTLY why 944 cars spin rod bearings. What we found out over several years of searching was that there is much more miss-information that actual facts. First we found that whether in a track car, streetcar or even a weekend show car all 944 based cars including the 968 can spin a rod bearing. Second this has nothing to do with HP or TQ. Third it has nothing to do with uncovering the oil pick-up (This is a common miss-conception promoted by many many shops). Fourth is that extra oil, like a half quart over the dipstick, does nothing. Fifth the Accusump and other systems don't fix this issue (other possible problems yes, but not the common rod bearing failures). Sixth no matter how many baffles you have put in your pan they will not help. I can go on and on but to get to the 'meat' of the matter....

What causes rod-bearing failures is 99% of the time centrifugal force. We found the solution to the mystery in an uncommon place, the Chevy world. It turns out a Chevy motor has the same problem, the 454 big block. Chevy 454 big blocks, which were designed for lower RPM operation, later became popular for drag racers. The drag racers started to turn more and more rpm's in search of more HP, which resulted in a 'new' problem developing, spun rod bearings. It took years to figure out why. The reason turned out to be so basic that the likes of Chevy and Porsche simply 'missed' it.

As a crankshaft rotates it has many forces acting upon it. It is obvious that the pistons push on the rods, which push on the crank and so forth and so on. What was missed was centrifugal force acting on the oil within the crank. High-pressure oil is fed thru the center of the crank to the main and rod bearings. Oil passing thru each journal is forced out of the crank onto the surface of the bearing thru the oil feed, which is nothing more than a hole in the surface of the journal. Where the 'mistake' was made was in the placement of the hole. The single oil feed hole can be drilled at any point 360 deg around on the journal, this is a decision dictated during the production of the crank. When the 944 crank design was made there was no attention given to the placement of this hole and the effect centrifugal force might have on the oil within it. Where the feed was placed just so happens to be one nearly opposite the direction centrifugal force pulls the oil when the crank is in motion. As the RPMs increase the centrifugal force goes up, eventually to the point where the oil pumps pressure simply can't overcome it. When this happens the rod bearings are starved of oil. The reason more track cars have this failure is because they are at high RPMs more often and for longer periods of time. Also track cars tend to have relatively high oil temperatures which thins the oil and causes the oil pressure to drop which lowers the RPM point where oil starvation at the rod bearings occurs. Further the high RPMs and often overfilled oil pans (to supposedly save the rod bearings) cause high windage that aerates the oil, further reducing its lubricating potential. Older motors spin rod bearings more often than newer motors since they have had more high RPM time than new motors and they usually have less oil pressure. Baffles, Accusumps, overfilling etc... do nothing to stop this failure mode.

Cross-drilling came out several years ago as a remedy for this issue but not because the problem was understood but because the idea was that a second oil feed hole would add more oil. There was a positive benefit from crossdrilling. The new oil feed opposite the original oil feed was not either hurt or helped by centrifugal force due to its position. This meant
that the oil pump could generally keep up with the oiling needs of the rod bearings. Huntley Racing however took the cross-drilling to the next level and developed the Perp drilled crank. We perpendicularly bore a new feed into the rod journal, which is actually taking the nemesis, 'centrifugal force' and working with it to help to actually scavenge oil to the rod bearing as the RPMs go up!! Since we have machined cranks with this technique we have 'NEVER' had a rod bearing failure in any car, ever! We started offering these in 1998.

This subject and its relevance to the 944 world is obvious but it is only one of many possible failures, which can and do occur to these cars. Cars that suffer rod failure generally can trace this to the above mentioned rod bearing problem as the catalyst. Main bearings generally don’t have this problem simply because they are centrally located on the centerline of the crank and have a much smaller ‘arm’ to their outer diameter which makes them far less susceptible to oil starvation from centrifugal force.

So in summary if you have your crank out have the process done. If your motor is still together and you want to avoid spinning a bearing without the Perp drilled crank, keep your oil temps down, limit your RPMs a bit (look at your HP peak and avoid revving past it), run a higher viscosity oil, avoid over filling, and keep the oil fresh.

Derrek Huntley Khajavi
Huntley Racing

Copyright (C) 01/27/2002
Here's the thread on the subject from another board:
http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforums/showthread.php?t=154715&highlight=cross+drilled
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Old 10-15-2004, 10:03 AM
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^^^
Exactly, cross-drill the crank.
If you want, you could lighten it, would help the engine rev a bit quicker, but it will cause it to be a little unstable at idle.
Just make sure that everything is checked out, and within tolerances.

Hehe, FR that's that diesel engine for a tanker that was posted on here a while ago, isn't it?
Oh man, a ladder going down into the crankcase by each cylinder, you know it's big when.....
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Old 10-15-2004, 12:27 PM
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Uhmm I wonder what the tolerances for that engine are??? measured in inches of clearance?
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Old 10-15-2004, 04:26 PM
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knife-edge that tanker crank...and be able to pull a few thousand water skiers
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Old 10-15-2004, 05:03 PM
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I've seen that before; makes you wonder what a simple oil change costs now at $60 a barrel. . .
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Old 10-16-2004, 03:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Porsche-O-Phile
makes you wonder what a simple oil change costs now at $60 a barrel. . .
and thats unrefined cost
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Old 10-16-2004, 04:33 AM
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a crank that big isn't counterbalanced? (mind boggles)

nate

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Old 10-16-2004, 04:57 AM
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