Rethinking the "944 for the 16 yr old"

[gt350mike]

Life is such a witch......My son bought and paid for his own car (87 944) that started out life with our family (two years ago) in GREAT condition and ONLY after having his license for 3 weeks, he has managed to hit two parked cars in the driveway.
The first time he hit my car and it left a yellow streak down the side of my white car (which he promptly removed with "Soft Scrub"). It only left a small dimple on his fender.
But today I guess he wanted to insure that his mom wasn't left out and he hit her car tonight. Again, it only left a yellow streak down the side of her Expedition, but this time his car is "dinked" up! It torn the lower valance away from the fender and my initial assessment is that he'll need to replace both valance and fender.
After his mom (my beautiful wife of almost 18 yrs) finished ripping his head off, I decided I needed to jump in and give him my two cents worth. I told him a) He is driving with his head up his butt and b) if he did it again I would pull his license for a month and c) I would sell his 944 and d) replace it with a truck.

The car is a fine example of an automobile but I hate the idea of my son “dinking” it up. The more I think about this, an F-150 or F-250 is looking better but I hate to take the car away from him since he paid for it out of his own pocket. Do y’all think I'm on the right track by giving him one more chance???

[livewirevoodoo]

spring for something for him to drive in the meantime. turn the 944 into a project car for you two to work on for when he's "ready" for it.

I'd think the time invested would make him more careful in how he drives (or parks) it.

[gtroth]

You know, of course, there are much better reasons to keep a 16 yr old away from a 944 than dinging it up. Too fast, and too tempting to drive too fast. Little mistakes in the driveway are one thing, little mistakes at 85mph...

[bryanthompson]

You need to direct your boy to this board for a proper initiation into the 944 world.

I don't think a 944 driver person is going to respect the car until a) receiving a proper newbie flaming and b) realizing exactly what they have and how much work it is to keep it that way.

[gt350mike]

Originally posted by bryanthompson
You need to direct your boy to this board for a proper initiation into the 944 world.

I don't think a 944 driver person is going to respect the car until a) receiving a proper newbie flaming and b) realizing exactly what they have and how much work it is to keep it that way.

I think the flaming that he got from his mom was pretty good but it wouldn't hurt for him to be "extra" crispy after a post from the Fraternal Order of the Pelican Board!

Regarding the comment on the father/son project, that is exactly how the whole thing started two years ago. He bought the car off ebay and we worked on it (with mucho helpo from SoCal Driver and AFJuvat) for several months. We had it in storage (loooooong story) until this past spring and we've (my wife and I) been driving the car for the past 6 months. So the boy has "earned" his strips in regard to ownwership of the car, but I think until tonight he didn't truely appreciate his car until he saw the sheetmetal damaged. I don't know what was worse.....my wife chewing his butt out or the faint "I'm about to puke" expression on his face while he was looking over the damage.

[Dan in Pasadena]

Let me chime in as a father who has also raised a car nut son. Mine is 23 now and he was/is a very responsible driver. He was when he was 17 too, but it didn't keep him from trying to keep up with his buddy on a winding mountain road, losing traction to some pretty severe understeer in his '88 Camaro IROC and plowing it up through some bushes.

Now, he is anal about his cars and damaging it hurt him badly. It was new to him and we had taken pains to find an awsomely clean car. Plus, we're close and he had to call me and tell me to come get him from his buddy's where he had managed to limp to. I appraised the situation and relatively calmly told him this just demonstrated what I was afriad of: that he didn't have the maturity to be driving at all. I was under no illusion that he wouldn't have given in to the same impulse if he'd have been driving a truck...he would have.

When you're inexperienced - not just "young" - you are subject to the same impulses you are when you are older and hopefully more experienced. But hopefully there is just a half second of momentary hesitation before giving in. Oh, I still DO give in to the occasional blast up the freeway or winding mountain road. We (mostly) all do or we wouldn't be on this web board.

But your son has to truly "get it" that a mostly (95 out of a 100) times harmless impulse can lead to some awful AND IRREVERSIBLE damage...to him, his car, his passengers and innocent others. It won't matter WHAT he is driving. If you don't think he "gets it"...and you really DO KNOW deep down if he does, you know you do - then pull the car. Isn't it better to have him pissed at you and for a long time, than to cry over his grave or his conviction for hurting someone?

[AFJuvat]

I'd pull the car for a bit - He needs to learn some situational awareness. Perhaps by hoofing it for a few weeks, the lesson would sink in.

But perhaps he needs to learn a harsher lesson - I would have him pay to fix your or your wifes car in addition to his own.

Or you could just point out to him that fenders cost $900 each new, and the valance panels cost $350 new - That is not including installation or paint.. and since he is such a young driver, he certainly would NOT want this reported to his insurance.

AFJuvat

[ae1969]

Yes pull the car for a while..........
Yes make sure he has a curfew (car not out while dark)...
Yes make him work for the damages...

We were all young once and did/do many careless things. To be honest a sports car to a 16 year old is a LOADED GUN.

Yes I know of all the young males out there who are 'wonderful' drivers.... not a ticket........obey the laws.... and drive like there grandmother.

Kids will make mistakes......we all did/do. The thing is he should learn to drive with a slow ass/safe/ beater. As kids we lacked experience.

These cars are not fast but they make you think you are a better driver than you are. Forgiving around corners. Excellent brakes.....etc.

A truck would be a nice change of pace. I would make sure its something gutless as well (6 cyl). I begged my father to buy me a Mach I mustang as young kid..... but my all knowing father gave me a Mercury Bobcat. Smartest thing ever. I tried to make that thing go fast......but with a 0-60 of 2 days it was not going to happen. I drove this death trap for a long time without any problems.

[gt350mike]

Originally posted by AFJuvat
I'd pull the car for a bit - He needs to learn some situational awareness. Perhaps by hoofing it for a few weeks, the lesson would sink in.

But perhaps he needs to learn a harsher lesson - I would have him pay to fix your or your wifes car in addition to his own.

Or you could just point out to him that fenders cost $900 each new, and the valance panels cost $350 new - That is not including installation or paint.. and since he is such a young driver, he certainly would NOT want this reported to his insurance.

AFJuvat

He's already handed over his Christmas cash so that I can take the Expo to the repair shop. When he gets back from his friends house, I will point out the potential cost of replacing the damaged parts and I'll ask him how many hours he will need to work to cover the damages from tonight.

In regard to insurance, we had an interesting conversation two weeks ago. To have comp & collision, it was going to cost $200 PER MONTH! So we dropped the collison and now the insurance is only $100 per month. I told him if he gets a ticket OR he has an accident, I would drop him from my policy and he would have to get his own. That got his attention, but he is still having a problem with his brain shutting down in the driveway.

[Brando]

I have a better idea.

Don't take the car. He will do stupid things in spite of you. Besides the fact that it is his in all respects (not including your time vested into the restoration) you will cross many boundaries most parents dont want to. and being as young as he is, it may lead to catastrophic events. Don't drive angry!

Have him learn defensive driving. Make him learn some (as AFJuvat put it) situational awareness. Obtain a few of the pamphlets and brochures they (DMV) give to commercial drivers about being aware and safe while driving. It should teach him a few things about being safe on the road.

I'm a kid. When I got my license (at 18) i made some mistakes. A lot. If i had learned to drive right and to be aware when I was younger, i may have saved a few cars and not been in the hospital a few times.

...and OMFG, do you know why california revoked the licenses to 16 year old drivers idea?!

[scheistermeiste]

i say pull the car for a bit too. when i was 15 with my learners(and for brando i got my learners from CA!) i got my first car. 2 weeks after i got it i got into an accident. next car i hated 1 month later i hit a curb and bent a rim. a few months later i backed out and rubbed my drivers side door on my friends rear bumper. next car backed into another car and cracked my fiberglass rear bumper. this doesnt include all the minor "DOH!"s or thing that were in no way under my control. when i was that age i thought i was a great driver, i thought i could handle any situation... my current car ive had for over a year and the only thing that has happened has been the tread sepparating from the tire which, since i have learned, didnt cause any problems because i realized something was wrong and pulled over.

one thing you could do would be act like you sold it and put it away in storage. in the mean time getting him an ugly car with body damage. once you see how much it cost to fix and remember what you had you suddenly become very protective of good things.

[speedracing944]

If a 944 did some damage to your cars imagine what a f-150 or f-250 would do.

[Clowd]

If you think he's doing damage with a little 944, what do you think he will do with a big truck? I wouldn't let him drive untill I taught him a thing or two.. If you don't, he's going to end up backing over a pedestrian instead of your ford explorer.

Here's my advice on speeding tickets - if you are going to speed, make sure you are 35 or more over.. then you have to go to court and can get out of it with a clean record.. just have to do some community service... ask me how I know.

Either way, I'm 16, payed for my 944 myself, and besides an accident that was in no way my fault, I've been pretty damn careful with it.. I regularly back it out of the garage around another car with maybe a couple of inches of clearance.. and I've never had a problem with it.. so basically, I think this kid just needs some lessons...

edit: by the way, the 944 is NOT fast.

[Mike(dat's me)]

Clowd was right on in my point of view. If he is scraping vehicles with a "little" 944, why put him behind a F-150 or 250? Thats asking for worse damage if happens again.

I think i would be looking at why is he hitting parked cars? Does he try to turn in to fast? Or does he actually have a problem with depth perception? When was his last full eye exam? I am just looking at "other" ideas because happening twice is just odd.

Doesw the 944 just have too much power for him, touchy gas pedal? Was the scolding is done maybe you can have a heart to heart and find out why this is happening...

[sasquatch]

Can I give a little different perspective to this? Everyone that has responded all have good points. There is one other option as well. Get you and your son involved in auto-x, drivers ed or even you local go-cart track.

I learned to drive in a 120" Chenoworth chassis running in Class 2 unlimited off road racing that my dad was a racer in. We spent alot of time out in the desert "setting up" the race cars. From as soon as I could reach the pedals and see over the wheel with harnesses on, I was driving it. I never actually raced untill I was 16, but I was airborne at 10.

By the time I got my drivers licence at 14 (legal age in Idaho at the time) I was already a very good driver and to this date at 37, have NEVER been in an accident. Of course, growing up in a racing family I did have to provide my own insurance because I could not seem to avoid speeding tickets. But my father was never worried about my skill level or judgment about speed/conditions, even if it was well above the "posted" limit though.

So, join PCA and take him auto crossing. If your local PCA chapter does not have auto cross, join SCCA, or both. If neither has any around your area, find a local go cart track that rents the go carts and start learning to go fast with skill.

All this will not give him a licence to go fast, but it will give him a level of skill not taugt on public roads about car controll etc.

[gt350mike]

When we first got the car I smiled when I told him "The greatest thing about this car is that its the ONLY yellow 944 in town". It took about two seconds for him to figure out what I meant. Two weeks ago I got a phonecall from a buddy of mine and he told me to pass on to Justin that you can see that car "a mile away". The comforting thing about the call was that my friend told me that he was driving the speedlimit! He hates to part with his money so the thought of paying his own insurance is minimizing the urge to drive like his dad (when he was 16).
The truck idea takes the same angle as the insurance.....he hates it! I told him that he would have to park out on the street (which will pi$$ off the neighbors) but it doesn't do anygood for the rest of the community.

Thanks for all of the post! He has looked at all of them and I think it has helped him realize how bad he has "dinked-up"!

[FlaCarrera]

Originally posted by speedracing944
If a 944 did some damage to your cars imagine what a f-150 or f-250 would do.

That was the first thing that struck me too.

What about spending some quality bonding and tutoring time riding around with him so you can observe and hone his skills up close?

If he's old enough, share the car with him at a local autocross.

Ted in Ft. Lauderdale 87 944
Gold Coast Region PCA

[strath44]

Yeah I reckon the idea of making it a project car and getting him a 'hack' meantime till he becomes more aware of what going on around him (ie other cars). If he can't park it in the drive way what chance does he have on the road. Coming from the UK its so funny to hear of people driving (let alone cars like a 944) at 16 (18 here). Hate to think how I would have driven my 944 at that age.

[Mike(dat's me)]

I tell ya what. This is gonna hurt me more than it will him...

but for a fellow board member... I guess... I could sacrifice myself to drive his 944 for a year or so to teach him a lesson.
I just want the best for him... -whistles innocently-

[BananaClip]

Originally posted by Clowd
If you think he's doing damage with a little 944, what do you think he will do with a big truck? I wouldn't let him drive untill I taught him a thing or two.. If you don't, he's going to end up backing over a pedestrian instead of your ford explorer.

...

Either way, I'm 16, payed for my 944 myself, and besides an accident that was in no way my fault, I've been pretty damn careful with it.. I regularly back it out of the garage around another car with maybe a couple of inches of clearance.. and I've never had a problem with it.. so basically, I think this kid just needs some lessons...

edit: by the way, the 944 is NOT fast.

ok in response to the edit, the 944 is fast, just not in a straight line. i fell into that trap for a while myself. you'll figure it out.

no "oops OH SHI-" yet? hehe it'll come for you. everyone backs into something before they turn 18.

ok to the OP now: seconded on the "dont take his car" and on the "dont give him a truck". make him put a thousand or two miles on it right away with you in the passenger seat. well maybe not that much, but teach him to look before backing up. teach him for a long time. is this his only real problem? if so that would not warrant taking his car, in my opinion. it is his car and your taking it would be in his eyes an unforgivable sin. oh yeah do make him pay for the damage to your cars. if he doesn't fix his, it is his car. oh yeah if you're into that sort of thing ground him for like a month, then threaten a year next time.