OK, cyl head this close to being out, but problems...

yellowline · 10-01-2005, 07:27 PM

If there were 2 things I'd want to curse on this car, it'd be the 2 Allen bolts at the front of the head by the DME temp switch.

Everything else came out smoothly, I could even remove the headers using a wrench.

I "woke up" the bolts, heated them, used a 3/8" Allen socket, used vise-grips with the socket too. I broke one, and the other simply won't budge. If it weren't for this, I'd have the gaskets and seals redone, the internals cleaned up, and the head loosely attached.

What do I do to get them out and make sure I don't crack the casting of the head or block?

scheistermeiste · 10-01-2005, 08:05 PM

you soak it in penetrating oil over night? id try that then heat. if that doesnt work then id pray...

fast924S · fast924S's Garage

I just had the same problem, Thos 2 bolts by the temp sensor are just a *****, I thought I was gonna brake it, I just socket in in PB blasterput the allen socket in and taped it with a hammer and slowly worked it back and forth till it came out, Im gonna retap the hole to clean it out and when it goes back together Im gonna put never seize on those suckers

Granite 944 · 10-01-2005, 10:12 PM

Yep, they can be really, really corroded and hard to get out! I just went ahead and twisted the the bolts till they broke off on the last head I did. Then it was real easy to put a pipe wrench on the remaining bolt sticking above the top of block when head was off, and I used my actelyne torch to heat the area around the bolt, then remove it. But, if it breaks off below the top of block, then its drill out time. Ya might even consider just cutting the head of the bolt off, instead of trying to break it off. That way, there will be bolt sticking above the block, when you take the head off. Then you can easily get the heat to where its needed.......after the head is off. The chances of getting PB blaster down to those threads enough to do any real good, would take a lot of time, and may not work anyway. Use brand new bolts, and use anti-seize on the new ones you install. Good luck.

scheistermeiste · 10-01-2005, 10:47 PM

i never pulled the head on my 924S when i had it but since have pulled the heads on another car. i was wondering why the bolts on these heads are so corroded? i know on my SBC the head bolts actually go into the waterjacket, which can cause corrosion, but with the SBC you have to use either teflon paste or tape on the threads to that coolant doesnt leak threw the threads. are these engines set up the same? if so if you just used antiseize wouldnt the coolant leak out? or do the head bolts not go into the waterjacket on these engines?

yellowline · 10-02-2005, 09:10 AM

I have to use new bolts. One I snapped off, almost flush with the block. The other was seized to the head also. It took 2 hours of prying with a crowbar, spraying PB Blaster, hacksawing the head off the bolt, drilling out part of the bolt, etc... It's still stuck in the block, but it has about 2 inches sticking out.

The HG was really ready to go. #2 was indeed clean, with about an ounce of water in the cylinder. No ridge on the cylinder walls, so I guess it's OK there. It would also explain the running on 3 cylinders at a cold start. There was major holes everywhere. #4 had probably 1/4" of material halfway around it, the rest was gone. Good thing I got to it, I can't wait to see how many problems I fix with the new turbo HG and all the other little odds and ends I can change now.

944 Ecology · 10-02-2005, 09:32 AM

Use a soft flame from an oxyacetylene torch to heat the block prior to attempting to remove those bolts. Even with that technique, I break about half the ones I try to remove.

gb

fast924S · fast924S's Garage

Not to get off topic but 944 Ecology why did they ban you from rennlist?

Granite 944 · 10-02-2005, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by scheistermeiste
i never pulled the head on my 924S when i had it but since have pulled the heads on another car. i was wondering why the bolts on these heads are so corroded? i know on my SBC the head bolts actually go into the waterjacket, which can cause corrosion, but with the SBC you have to use either teflon paste or tape on the threads to that coolant doesnt leak threw the threads. are these engines set up the same? if so if you just used antiseize wouldnt the coolant leak out? or do the head bolts not go into the waterjacket on these engines?

These bolts are in blind holes adjacent to, but not into the water jacket. There is approx. a 1/4" of gasket material seperating the bolts from the jacket, so my guess is, that as the gasket deteriorates, a little seepage gets in there, and thats why they get so nasty. At least, this is my thought on it. Anti-seize compound is surely a good thing to use here, just try not to get it on the gasket mating surfaces, just the bolt threads, after they have been cleaned up good (run a bottom tap into it). Now I've only had experience with a couple of these situations on these heads, so I'm no expert by any means.

brianc944 · 10-02-2005, 01:12 PM

cool, a banning.

where are you at in upstate? near albany at all?

944 Ecology · 10-02-2005, 01:27 PM

Banned for not wanting to become a Rennlist Sponsor at $1500 per year in order to sell Rennlist members $1000 worth of stuff.

My mortal sin was telling people that I had what they wanted when they asked.

I was having a tough time trying to find threads that were worth posting to, mostly the same old stuff and more and more street racer kids who don't know how to use the archive search, and, "Should I turbocharge my NA?" kind of threads.

Of course, I could register under another ID, but the Rennlist bylaws deem a $5000 penalty for doing such a thing.

Not worth $1500, not worth $5000, not worth $18.

gb

BananaClip · 10-02-2005, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 944 Ecology

Not worth $1500, not worth $5000, not worth $18.

gb

not to get off topic, but that $5,000 penalty is the craziest thing I have ever heard of.

Now I'm pretty new to all of this, but wouldn't it make sense to use air tools to get those bolts out?

Granite 944 · 10-02-2005, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BananaClip
not to get off topic, but that $5,000 penalty is the craziest thing I have ever heard of.

Now I'm pretty new to all of this, but wouldn't it make sense to use air tools to get those bolts out?

Instantly break em, no control..........bolts that is....errr.....maybe both!

Sorry to hear about the banning problem George.

fast924S · fast924S's Garage

Yea air tools will just destroy the bolts, its better to go really easy by hand back and forth and spray pb blaster ( I love this stuff)

Yea Rennlist has gotten totally crazy with their rules, You have to be a member to sell stuff and other stupid things like that. For them its all about the MONEY.

HUUURAAAAAAYYY PELICAN PARTS!!

scheistermeiste · 10-02-2005, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Granite 944
These bolts are in blind holes adjacent to, but not into the water jacket. There is approx. a 1/4" of gasket material seperating the bolts from the jacket, so my guess is, that as the gasket deteriorates, a little seepage gets in there, and thats why they get so nasty. At least, this is my thought on it. Anti-seize compound is surely a good thing to use here, just try not to get it on the gasket mating surfaces, just the bolt threads, after they have been cleaned up good (run a bottom tap into it). Now I've only had experience with a couple of these situations on these heads, so I'm no expert by any means.

well if thats true, if you did use teflon paste thread sealant on the threads instead of anti-seize wouldnt the sealant stop and seapage and protect the bolt entirely, thus solving the problem of corroded bolts?

Granite 944 · 10-03-2005, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by scheistermeiste
well if thats true, if you did use teflon paste thread sealant on the threads instead of anti-seize wouldnt the sealant stop and seapage and protect the bolt entirely, thus solving the problem of corroded bolts?

I suppose it would. Anti-seize used on clean threads would be my choice, but, I'm sure teflon paste probably work just fine.