Pull the motor out the top or through the bottom?

[speedracing944]

I pushed the 944S into the garage yesturday with the help on my wife and the F-150. I cut the wiring harness away, drained the coolant, unhooked the coolent hoses, removed the hood, cruise, coolant tank and a bunch of other useless junk. I am to the point of hooking up the motor hoist to remove the engine. If I pull it out the top it looks like I will have to remove the exhaust manifold which doesn't look to hard. The nuts and studs look like they are in good shape. If I drop the motor out the bottom it looks like I need to have 30" of clearence between the bottom of the car and the floor. As of now I don't have anything in the garage which would be able to hold the car that high. I know I can lift it no problem using the engine hoist but how to keep it there?

What is the easier method? What are the road blocks of each?
Here's a pic


Thanks in advance!

[bryanthompson]

Awesome, what's your plan for this car? Fix & sell? Fix & give to the wife? AutoX monster? Inquiring minds want to know!

[SoCal Driver]

I'm not a fan of lifting the car any higher that a regular jack stand. I prefer the top even if there is some challenge in getting the hood back on straight. Either way, top or bottom, you have to lower (for the top -- remove for the bottom) the cross member to get the engine to clear the oil plan.

Disconnect the exhaust at the headers not at the engine. Unbolt the engine mounts from the engine stand offs. Pull the fans and the radiator. Attach an engine hoist to the engine. Drop the cross member. Leave the struts and spindles on the car and the stearing rack on the tie rods. You will have to disconnect the steering link at the rack. And take the rack off of the cross member.

Disconnect the four bolts at the torq tube and heave away.

[yieldsign2]

I just did both ways.. I think out the top is easiest.. As long as you take out the headlight bar. You have to take the transmission out though, but that's pretty quick. IMO the transmission is easier to take out then to disassembel the crossmember/steering.

[yieldsign2]

Originally posted by SoCal Driver
I'm not a fan of lifting the car any higher that a regular jack stand. I prefer the top even if there is some challenge in getting the hood back on straight. Either way, top or bottom, you have to lower (for the top -- remove for the bottom) the cross member to get the engine to clear the oil plan.

Disconnect the exhaust at the headers not at the engine. Unbolt the engine mounts from the engine stand offs. Pull the fans and the radiator. Attach an engine hoist to the engine. Drop the cross member. Leave the struts and spindles on the car and the stearing rack on the tie rods. You will have to disconnect the steering link at the rack. And take the rack off of the cross member.

Disconnect the four bolts at the torq tube and heave away.

A lot of this is unnecessary if you just pull the tranny, which IMO is easier. Remove the tranny, unbolt TT, pull it until the shaft comes out of the bellhousing, then you can lift the engine just about straight up, so you don't need to worry about clearing the xmember.

[speedracing944]

Originally posted by bryanthompson
Awesome, what's your plan for this car? Fix & sell? Fix & give to the wife? AutoX monster? Inquiring minds want to know!

The plan for the S? I was going to keep it under wraps for a little longer but here it is. Keep in mind that the plan is subject to change at anytime without notice and I here by reserve this right.

To fix the S and then sell it would cost me more than I could recover out of the sale. So this is not even an option. You are correct about the car belonging to my wife and that it is getting fixed up for her to drive. The nature of the rebuild has been 80% decided. The route we are planning on taking includes pulling the S motor out, repainting the engine bay and the interior firewall (if needed), and installing a Camaro or Firebird LT-1 V-8 engine. I am shooting for a weight to power ratio of 10:1 at the wheels including the weight of the driver. So that would put me at about 350 HP at the crank. So what I will be building is called a 948. After taking a ride in a nicely done LT-1 swapped car during 944fest and then being asked if I wanted to drive it I have to say this is the best solution for my S to get back on the road. Some people may not agree with this solution but the way I look at it is this... The car is in bad shape motor and electronics wise. Everything under the hood is completely gone. The car was either going to be sold to me or a person who was going to part it out. I would like to see it back on the road and the thought of replacing the entire wire harness along with all the sensors and everything else that is melted makes me nervous. The V8 swap includes the computer, and everything. All you have to hook up is a ground, 12 Volts, and the signal from the ignition switch.

I would like to keep you guys posted on my progress and i thank you for any advice.

Speedy

OH and I want a car that can take ilikemy944 's 951 supercar at the Dragon.
LOL

[speedracing944]

http://www.560sec.com/bulletinboard/viewtopic.php?t=654

This is a quick review of what it was like to drive the 948 at 944fest.

[SoCal Driver]

Originally posted by yieldsign2
A lot of this is unnecessary if you just pull the tranny, which IMO is easier. Remove the tranny, unbolt TT, pull it until the shaft comes out of the bellhousing, then you can lift the engine just about straight up, so you don't need to worry about clearing the xmember.

I can bolt the crossmember back in -- two bolts -- hooking up the spidles -- 2 bolts -- and attaching the steering rack -- 2 bolts -- and push the car around.

Lots easier than pulling the trans, drive shaft and axles.

[speedracing944]

Originally posted by SoCal Driver
I'm not a fan of lifting the car any higher that a regular jack stand. I prefer the top even if there is some challenge in getting the hood back on straight. Either way, top or bottom, you have to lower (for the top -- remove for the bottom) the cross member to get the engine to clear the oil plan.

Disconnect the exhaust at the headers not at the engine. Unbolt the engine mounts from the engine stand offs. Pull the fans and the radiator. Attach an engine hoist to the engine. Drop the cross member. Leave the struts and spindles on the car and the stearing rack on the tie rods. You will have to disconnect the steering link at the rack. And take the rack off of the cross member.

Disconnect the four bolts at the torq tube and heave away.

So I pull the motor with the belhousing on?

[carsonmx114]

you don't have the take anything off the steering rack or the brakes or anything to lower the crossmember. just take out the four big bolts and the steering universal joint. i didn't even take the front tires off my car the last time i took my motor out. also i've taken my motor out of the top without removing the hood, i just hooked the hoist as close to the motor as i could and it just barely cleared. i had the tranny out that time though.

[SoCal Driver]

Clutch fork and TO bearing.

[bryanthompson]

Sweet, excited to hear how that comes out. Be sure to post pics & whatnot. And, don't feel guilty about it--if it weren't a v8 going in, the car might rust in a junk yard, right? At least now it'll be on the road.

[Slam]

You'll also give yourself more clearance by pulling the power steering and alternator pulleys off the crank end. The bellhousing can stay in place. I agree about yanking the rad and fans. The last thing you wnat is to have that motor swing into the delicate cooling fins in the rad.

I've also found a Ford Bronco to be very useful for dragging a hoist that's sunk into the ground... It could also be used to drag the car off the motor if you went out the bottom...

[Ohtori]

I've pulled the 944S engine 3 times now from above. The car was on regular jacks when it was done so I could work underneath, and also to allow the engine hoist to roll under the front suspension. A balancer is needed to tilt the engine while removing it.

Disconnect engine wiring harness (starter wiring you can leave on, but disconnect battery/harness grounds on bellhousing), and vacuum lines. Remove power steering (move reservoir out of way) and a/c from brackets and suspend with wire; also remove clutch slave cyl. and starter from bellhousing; clutch tubing also secures to block. Remove altenator, cooling fans, rad, rad hoses (don't forget the two heater hoses at back!!), CO tube from exhaust, coolant tube over exhaust manifold and heater valve, heat shields from right engine mount and oil cooler (to access right eng. mount bolts), exhaust heatshield, rear (not front) body stiffener (catalytic heat shield attaches to them). Remove the front pulleys to gain extra clearance (you need flywheel lock or impact gun to remove), and the headlight motor so that the mechanism drops to give more clearance.

The trans. comes out and driveaxles (Saranwrap and elastic band the axle ends to prevent contamination), as well as the shifter and shift rod: they must be removed to allow the torque tube to disengage from clutch disk and move backwards. Put the hoist on and take up the slack, then disconnect 4 torque tube bolts. The engine's at the right level/tension when the bolts turn easily. Pull TT back slightly, rotate it 180 degrees to clear the rear tangs on TT and torsion tube carrier (for collision protection), and disengage from the clutch. Use a small piece of 2"x4" ontop of the front body stiffener to support the TT.

Unbolt motor mounts and slowly hoist the engine up; there's a bit of resistance until they come off the mounts, then raise and tilt the engine until the oil pan clears the crossmember. Also the engine will come out turned to the left, as you also have to clear the steering shaft and brake master cyl. It's a snug fit and it might just graze the rear a/c lines/firewall, but it'll come. It's just a matter of hoist, tilt, and pulling on the engine to guide it out. Each time I've done it, I've done it alone.

[speedracing944]

Thanks guys for your advice. I should have the motor out this weekend. I was laughing while I was preping the motor to come out. Usually one has to be carefull about disconnecting everything so as to not damage it. In my case I was armed with a big shears cuting all the wiring and hoses. It was all melted and ruined anyways.

Thanks,
Speedy

[thekidd]

no, an engine fire!!! had one too, good luck with the swap.

[speedracing944]

Thanks thekid. I will be making further progress on it here shorty. I am trying to get my shop equiped with a mill and lathe to make the needed parts for the conversion. I just removed all the junk out of my shop to make room for the equipment.

Speedy