Anybody Try Increasing MPG with an Hydrogen Generator
 

Just wanted to know if i was the only one out there that was interested in getting better MPG and a little Boost in Power by using a hho Generator (hydrogen). I've installed a single cell. and 1 week later installed a 2 cell in my car at around the half tank makr and i get about 230-250 if i probly hit the reserve on a full tank. I just installed a new O2 Sensor wich increased responce but how sure how much MPG increase i got. I'll Post my Results as Soon as i do my next fill up

On a side note. Anyone know about Electronic Fuel Injection Enhancers? This is one of the optional components that is used to increase MPG fooling the engine to take advantage of the HHO and using less gas

THanks
JSmileWavy

yes, but it messed with the flux capacitor, which in turn caused my turbonator to spin backwards

it also rusted out my muffler bearings and chrome kinaedor valve

did u get the stainless steel muffler bearings? or only coated mild steel?

i cheaped out and got the ones coated in WAMMO - clearly i spend too much time watching late night tv

i see....which type are u using? are u filling in with DHMO dihydrogen monoxide? or MHHO monohydrogen hydroxide?

:eek:

You must have the early version of "Mr. Fusion" if you had this problem. The Flux Capacitors without the Fusion option, or the later "Fusion-II" will work just fine with excess hydrogen.

All seriousness aside, when I want to get better gas mileage, I drive the 944. My full-size pick-up gets 13 mpg.

i'm kind of stuck with Mr Fusion - i get too much EMI with Fusion-II and my 8-track keeps skipping

nothing's perfect, right?

Bummer.

I'd rehash the myriad of scientific reasons that the "HHO" generators cannot work, but it's much easier to simply link it.

http://www.aardvark.co.nz/hho.shtml

Short answer: No, I am not using an HHO generator for the simple reason that I am not a moron.

Keep your halogen fluid topped off and you'll see a lot better improvement.



On a more serious note, the only way it would work is by violating the second law of thermodynamics.

Can I HHO my NA???????

Not a problem. I violate laws all the time.

In fact, I have a carburetor that I can bolt on to my 924S that actually makes gas! I have to pull over and siphon some out every few miles or the tank overflows.

moore, u need to reverse the wires on your fuel pump. it should be sucking gas out of the carb and putting it in the tank. not the other way around.

Wow. not the kind of responses i was looking for. It's been a while since i've posted so you must think i was joking and i wasen't. The setup does work there are dyno run expierements that one the universities did on a turbo diesel tractor i belive. I've been using it on my car for about 1 week maybe more and it has made a difference in the willingness of the motor to pick up. Like I said in my post above i' still have 1/3 or more of the tank to go so we will see what the results will be. I understand that there are those that think it is imposible but there are people that are getting great results and others decent results. I have provided a link below for those who are open mided enough to read and click the following link

First link is the post on the forum
http://www.hydrogengenerator.cc/viewtopic.php?t=2460&highlight=proof

Second is a direct link to the data of the test
http://www.hydrogen-boost.com/raw%20data.html

My knowledge of what the sheet means in not vast but it does show less fuel being used with hydrogen from what i can see.

I posted this to be helpfull to the forum. It would be awfull if this turned into another one of the "alina944" posts that go no where. the old school guys know what i mean

However factual you think what you are reading may be, it is all still just pseudoscience hype.

First law of thermodynamics confirms that you will not be able to generate more energy by combusting the separated hydrogen and oxygen in your engine than the amount of energy it took to separate the water into hydrogen gas and oxygen gas. This is a fundamental law of the universe and nothing violates it. If there were exceptions to this rule, then most everything you know of would not work the way it does. So don't try to argue with this.

Now, can injecting hydrogen and oxygen into your engine make more horsepower? Sure. It's fuel and oxidizer, just like adding more gasoline and nitrous. But what we are saying is the electricity to make that hydrogen and oxygen gas is going to take more power than it produces.

Now I am not aware of your setup and I don't care much more to read into it. But if you are drawing current from your alternator to power the electrolysis process that turns the water into hydrogen and oxygen, then the amount of power that the alternator sucks from your belt drive is going to be, at 100% efficiency, the amount of power the hydrogen and oxygen burning in the combustion chamber will make. And no device such as this is 100% efficient. So in reality you are drawing more current from your alternator and thus more horsepower from your engine (this is how alternators work- if you do not understand this, then this is all a loss) than the hydrogen/oxygen combustion will make up for.

Now if the hydrogen/oxygen are made in your garage, bottled up, and put in your car, then yes, your can can make more net power than it did before. But your electric bill from the power you used in your garage will be slightly more- and guess what- the amount of kilowatts it took to do that conversion is going to be higher than the amount of horsepower you gained and thus gasoline you didn't use on the way to work every morning.

You replaced your O2 sensor? That could very well be the only reason you are thinking you feel more power and are seeing better gas mileage. A bad O2 sensor on these cars can cause the DME to trim fuel maps wrong and result in poor mileage. But you think because you strapped this jank equipment to your car, that it's doing as claimed. Way to not separate the variables in testing there jack.

I had four engineering chemistry classes combined with three engineering thermodynamics courses and an electrical engineering course, all of which together back this up.

If you still believe this somehow works, then, as we say in Missouri, SHOW ME the HAND CALCULATIONS using the applied thermodynamics to back it up. Because I could definitely show you.


You're welcome,

Mike Eckert
Mechanical Engineer

Schumi, excellent (and concise) post.

I have a perpetual motion machine I need to sell. Any takers? I promise it will solve all your energy needs.

Speedy:)

I used to have a perpetual motion machine. The damn thing ran all night and I couldn't get any sleep so I sold it on Craigslist.

Piping hydrogen into the motor will increase output, that is true. The issue has always been the process of getting the hydrogen.

And to add to Schumis posts, you cannot have 100% efficiency in converting water to hydrogen, burning it in fuel and using that extra HP on the alternator to make power to convert water (perpetual motion machine). That violates the second law of thermodynamics - the system, just like all other systems, increase entropy (lower energy level) as it operates. So after one cycling one time it will have lower energy level as before.

OK, results?
It does sound silly, but I'm open minded.

The English arrested the first guy who produced a Platypus carcass, said it had to be fake because it defied all the laws of nature. I've heard that according to the laws of physics, bees can't fly. But I'm not a "physician";)

HOLY SHIAT,
I haven't seen that cat-toast paradox in years. AMAZING!!

there's a reason why you THINK it works. but it's not because of the HHO apparatus. not the generation of energy anyway

the reason is: running lean => better gas mileage.

a car's ECU/DME/ECM tries to aim for 14.7:1 AF ratio for gasoline stoichiometric burn. It creates least emissions and makes the cat work. 14.7:1 doesn't mean it's most gas economic. if the engine runs at 17.0:1 AF, it means the cylinder temp is hotter and has more NOx emissions, but at the same time it's also getting better fuel economy.

so if all that you're doing is leaning out the mixture by introducing a second oxygen source...then yea..it "works". it'd be equiv to having a nitrous bottle hooked up and the solenoid has a minute leak in it and its constantly leaking out just the smallest tiniest amoutn of nitrous in all the time. but it'd be the same thing as just changing the fuel map to run leaner.

i have my daily driver cruising at 17:1 AF and i'm getting better gas mileage than factory rated. i'm not making HHO. i'm just using less gas...

oh and to properly test gas mileage, you need to do a blind test that involves:

find a gas station that's on the highway out in the boonies. find an exit that at least 50miles away in a direction where there isn't traffic jams.

1) fill up at the gas station to full
2) get on the highway, get to 60mph and hit cruise. do nothing for next 50 miles until you get to that exit
3) get off the exit, turn around and get right back on the highway going back to the gas station
4) get to the gas station and fill up at the same pump you filled up before.
5) note the number of gallons it took to fill up.

now turn on yer HHO thing and repeat the test. post up the results.

don't forget that you have to do this on a day with no wind, and on a road with no slope

You have heard wrong. The idea that bees can't fly according to the laws or aerodynamics is nothing more than a myth perpetuated by the scientifically ignorant.

http://www.ftexploring.com/askdrg/askdrgalapagos.html

You can read the link I provided earlier to understand why "HHO" generators can't work. You can read Schumi's post to understand the same thing. You can read Halik's posts to understand the same thing.

What it all comes down to is that people want to believe in these things. We like to believe that we're "in" on something that even engineers and physicists don't understand. It makes us feel good. Instead of looking at engineers and saying, "wow, I wish I were as smart as they are", we get to say, "haha, they think they're so smart, but they don't even know about HHO generators". That's appealing on a fundamental psychological level and it helps to keep these asinine beliefs in circulation.

I was joking with my thermo/fluids Professor today abotu how I was going to start a company after graduation called 2nd Law Busters INC. Maybe I can take on the manufacturing of the 100 MPG carb and the HHO generator. Maybe I can even do cat and buttered toast kits for the home consumer.

Speedy:)

yea butter toast on cat would make moving furniture so much easier. even more than 100mpg carb.

sigh, I guess "tounge in cheek" doesn't translate to text.

ditto to the 2nd law, but isn't the HHO more of a catalyst effect that makes the gasoline combust more efficiently instead of a direct energy conversion of electricity to HHO fuel.

So you guys are saying I should take the four tornado devices out of my webers? And remove the magnets from my fuel lines? Ron Popiel and Billy Mays and Shamwow guy all said they were the bomb.

HHO only works if your Blinker Fluid is topped off and you have good Mufler Bearings packed in fresh Elbow grease