Duh!!! When should I shift???
 

This may B the most daft question ever asked on this forum..... but I just started driving my 944S and found it wayyyyy different than any other standard car I've driven, mind U, I have only owned a TR7 (that was an adventure) and a BMW 528E.

I find most of the power in my car starts around 4000 RPM. When upshifting, I'm shifting around 2500/3000 RPM because it feel like the normal time 2 shift, but the car jumps and jackrabbits like I'm shifting 2 early. I tried shifting around 4000 RPM and found it a better place, but is this 2 high?? I know these cars should B "driven hard", but I want 2 baby it, yet still get some performance. I have the owners manual and the "shift graph" only really gives me the max RPM and min RPM I should B shifting at. I guess I'm looking 4 some input from experienced drivers as 2 when I should B shifting 2 get the best performance out of the car without wearing her down 2 much.

Told U it was a stupid question, but a question none the less.

Is it really THAT much more effort to actually type words like be out? Anyway, your car shouldn't be giving you any trouble when you shift it in the 2000-3000 range, assuming you're not going from like first to fourth. I'd say a good shift point of light driving is around 3500 and a good shift point when your driving hard, is redline. :D

I think the reason I am bucking the car is just plain lack of driving experience - I have been driving a Suzuki Sidekick (automatic) 4 the last few years and that is like driving a go-cart....it's very effortless and takes about 1 brain cell. I'll get better with the clutch and such over time I guess, just new 2 me.

So, around 2000-3000 is a good spot? What about 4000 RPM? Is this 2 high??

Also, as 4 my "shorthand" (i.e. - my using "U's" and "2's") - well, I've been typing and writing like this 4 about 10-12 years now and just can't break the habit. I have 2 use spellcheck constantly when doing reports at my work. If I type "you", instead of "U", it throws me all off - I get in a typing groove and that groove involves my "shorthand". Sorry if this is annoying, but my spelling and grammer will B very exceptable - hopefully, this will make up 4 my annoying shorthand. I find it hard 2 read stuff people type when they don't use capitals at the start of sentences - but I don't complain about it. 2 each his/her own I say.

Thanks 4 the input though.

There really isn't a point in the RPM (that you can hit without the rev limiter) which is too high, feel free to redline it. Common sense would dictate that if you drive it at redline all the time you will wear things down quicker, but don't be afraid to do it often.

Really??? Redline??? R U just saying that so my engine will blow-up and U won't have 2 put up with my "U's" and "2's" anymore (lol)?

I've never had the RPM's over 5500! I just can't bring myself 2 run the engine that hard. As soon as it hits like 5000, I feel like it's gonna snap or something. Must just B my "Suzuki Sidekick" driving mentality still taking over.

So, seriously.....I can push this car well above 5000 RPM without any fear? Remember, I just got it and have never driven one of these B4, so please pardon my inexperience.

The 944S was Porsche's first venture into the 16V 4 cyl. world. Great engine, good power, but the only downside is that it comes on high in the RPM band, as you have noticed.

It will not hurt the engine if you change your shift-points to 4-5k rpm, when you're driving the car hard. If you drive the car hard 'properly,' you'll be ok. These cars are interesting: it seems the 'harder' you push them, the smoother they perform.

I've had my S2 on the track, for a driver's ed event with PCA. There, you're usually pushing your engine at 6000 rpm for about 20 minutes STEADY. My car didn't flinch a bit at that abuse. (I baby my car on the street, and spank it on the track: the way it should be!!!)

So, bottom line: move your shift points up to around 4000 rpm: your shifts will be a lot smoother.

-Z.
------------------
PCA NNJR
Click for more:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/ultimate...ds/Zslalom.JPG

Do the 16Vs not have the CASIS? (Computer Assisted Shift Indicator System.) When the light comes on, shift. I've found that it seems to really baby the car shifting that soon, but....that's what the system says. I go by feel/sound but that's just me.

Sorry to sound chessey but.....driving stick shift is something like a artistic performance; everyone has their own and unique style. Some shift early, some shift late, some start off in second gear (very bad), some pop the clutch and chirp their tires (very, very bad). Find the middle ground and shift at 3-3.5k rpm when city driving to save gas and engine life. Pushing the car to 4-4.5k won't hurt it but I try to do that only in more spirited driving. I drive the speed limit in town so I see no need to rev the 944 hard. But be sure to push the car to redline occationally, I think it sort of cleans out carbon build up on the valves or something (right? anyone......?). These engines are strong and can hold up to a beating but I still baby mine for the most part. But I'm not afraid to push it to the limits now and then. **Important** Make sure your t-belt is fresh, when they snap, engine and or valves can be mortally wounded. T-belts must be changed no later than every 50k miles, but some folks do it at 30k to be safe.

The belts were done about 15,000 KMS ago (that's about 8/9000 miles ago), so I should B safe right???

My 944S is one of only a few that were "Canadianized". It was imported into Canada and has all gauges in Metric (i.e. my milage is in Kilometres and my speed is all in Kilometres). I don't even have miles/per/hours, just Kilometres. Makes the gauge less "cluttery" only have one number 2 look at. It doesn't have that shift assist thang, does anyone know if the S should have that - perhaps the Canadian version doesn't???

Apparently, there R only 16 true "Canadian" S's out there. I was very lucky 2 find this one - has 122,000 Kms (about 75,000 miles) on her and is an 88' - I have really enjoyed having it so far (only a week now). I live in a one-porsche-town and I'm "that guy" now - lovely!!!!

Glad to hear that your 944S puts a grin on your face...the way it should be. Yours is a pretty low-mile (low-klick?) car, but as you approach 90,000-100,000 miles you should replace the cam chain tensioner (for the roller chain than links the intake and exhaust cams in the middle of the head). If its plastic rubbing block fails, it can take out the entire valvetrain ($$$$$$$$, U.S. or Canadian!). The tensioner costs about $250 U.S., takes the DIYer 2 hours max to replace, and is money well spent for real peace of mind. (Did mine at 108,000).

Good luck!!

--Doug

I have heard of this tensioner thing a couple of times B4. I'm about 25,000 miles away from the scary 100,000 mile mark.

I have heard that it's a HUGE job, but U say only like a couple of hours labour?? I'll take U'R answer, seeing as U have had this done.

I've also heard that U can just replace the lil' plastic rails and the hoses that pump the oil 2 the tensioner and not actually the tensioner itself - does that sound right at all???

Any other things I should look 4 on the S?? I chose the S over the N/A due 2 the fact that I got a good deal (at least I think so - I paid $12,000 Canadian - about $7500 American - it's an 88 and I found the milage pretty low 4 the year - it has absolutely no rips, cracks or anything inside - everything looks brand new - there isn't a paint chip or a drop of dirt on the engine), also, it was close - I found some pretty good deals on some 944 N/A's, but they were all in the USA and the cost of shipping would mean my budget 4 a 944 would have 2 have been around $4-5000 American - instead, I found one locally (still don't know how) and put that transportation/border fee's money into this car.

So far, I'm very, very, very, very happy with it. My girlfriend is not though. She is very, very, very upset because other girls R now smiling at me and saying "Hi". I don't want an insecure girlfriend or some floosy who would only go out with me cause of my car - I'll have 2 dump the girlfriend if she keeps up with this "I hate that car" attitude. I can always find another, more secure, girlfriend - I don't think I'll B able 2 find another Porsche like this one!!!!

Wow, shifting at 3000rpm huh? I don't think I've never shifted a car that early... I usually shift at over 5500 rpm in the city, quite often at redline. Sometimes I will shift at around 4500 if I'm in traffic or behind another car, in a low speed zone etc. Basically I like to cruize with the rpms around 3k. And as for engine life, well mine's got 150k miles, did the timing belt once in the last 4 years/60k+ miles, it's still got factory spec compression, doesn't use any oil, idles very smooth, and pulls harder than any other 8v NA I have yet to drive.

CASIS is only an indicator, signifying the next gear will provide the same amount of power, keeping the engine rpm at above 1200 (or was it 1500). It means nothing more nothing less. The harder you're accelerating, the longer the light will stay off. Mine's disconnected...
Ahmet

If I have to put up with anymore B4s, or u2s, I will not respond to any of your posts. Can't speak for everybody, but it's about the most annoying thing I can imagine at a message board. Stop if you value the information I just gave, or would ever give.
Ahmet

Thats a snotty thing to say...way to welcome the new guy.

Do you shift at 5500 or redline when the car is cold?

Hey, welcome to the board, I think that the fact you dont have CASIS, is because you have a canadian guage cluster, they probably neglected to put it in there, my US spec 87 944S has a the little light, but i find it anoying, speaking of annoying, i have to say the "U2s" are a bit vexing, they remind me of girls when i was in the 5th grade, dont worry about shifting higher, i "baby" my car, but if the road is a nice empty curvy one, you can keep the needle over 5K and every shift is going to be sweet, the S is much easier to shift right if you rev higher, i have never missed a shift in the high rpms, if you try and baby it too much you will shift to quick and bog down the engine performance, which i dont think is good for the car either. Anyways, enjoy it, its a great car!
Maciek

Hi guys. i am new to the 944 as well (having driven a Toyota Celica before this). it seems to me that this Casis is so lame, it feels like im lugging the engine when i follow its guidance. it wants the car to get into 4th so soon! i wish i could disable it so i dont have to see its mean, economical, orange blip. now, on the other hand its put in there by porsche...... what do you think about it?

I think CASIS was put in the 944 during the 'gas crisis'. Yeah, yeah, most of you guys have no clue what I'm talking about.
OK - early '70s, post-Vietnam, recession, Carter. Jeesh, I'm getting old.

The darn gauge thing is meaningless. If you drive as 'suggested' at 1,500 RPM you'll get better fuel efficiency than at 4,500 RPM. That's it. You decide if it's worth being a slave to a gauge needle. I prefer performance and can't wait to someday rid my dash of the worthless, infernal thing (it's right up there with the oil light that, when functioning 'properly', informs you that it's now time to buy new engine).:rolleyes:

Boyeee , welcome a board!!!

There are quite a few "S's" around the Toronto area and I believe they are all Canadian spec from what I have seen at the PCA meetings. In 1988 the "S's" did not sell very well in Canada or the world for that matter so that might account for the small number in Canada.


Mark
'86 944NA

Apologies
 

You're right, I was harsh, and for that I'm sorry. But, what I said about your post stands. Ofcourse you're welcome to post here, and I'm only one of the 1000s of people here, I don't have the power to change the way you post. It's your call, I'd like to NOT see the type of U2, b4, me2, etc.

Anyway, I shift at around 4500 when engine is cold. Today after my first post I actually watched when I really shift, it's more like 5500 to redline until up to speed, then cruize at 2200 to 3100rpm or so, depending on how much power I may need (hills, curves, cars to be passed, etc.) Same goes for when the engine is cold, except I accelerate briskly (don't usually go over 3/4ths throttle when cold), shift at around 4500 to 4700 rpm, then cruize as usual.
Ahmet

I've only been driving a 944 for 1 month but have had no problem finding the perfect shifting points. In town, I shift under 3000 rpm. The car has plenty of legs at low rpms and runs very strong. There is no reason to push you car to 4000 or 5000 rpms when driving around town. Take it easy, enjoy the car, and watch the odometer click to 15K for the fourth time!!!! (I can't wait!!!!!!)

However, there is always room for spirited driving! :D

If letting the engine rev "2" 5000 rpm was bad, then the rev limiter would be set @ 4800 rpm. Use UR Head.

speaking of small, high rpm powerbands.. My suzuki is a dog below 9,000 rpm and on the race track I rarely get below 10,500 the redline is 14,500. Talk about piston speed.


Sarcastic Sergio

These cars ARE perfectly happy in their upper ranges of RPM. I think you might be scared to take the engine there because of how furious the engine rips thru the redline in first gear? If you're scared of exceding redline, just shift alil lower in first gear until you're confident in your shifts, say 6,000 rpm on your car since it's redline is 7,000. Yes, you do not want to blow a shift when you are at redline cause it is possible to do valve damage even with the rev limiter. As your speed increases in each successive gear, the engine doesn't run thru the rev's as quickly, it becomes more controlled and you can feel how well the engine works from 5,000 to redline. You should be able to shift at redline, without feeling too rushed, in 3rd to 4th and 4th to 5th (My 8v's 4th to 5th comes at just under 120 mph). Most people are alittle more confident of 1st to 2nd shifts and 3rd to 4th shifts because they just require you to pull the gear shift lever towards you, but the other shifts of 'up and over' for 2nd to 3rd and 4th to 5th just take alittle more practice.... don't be afraid ... it's fuuunnnnn!

when to shift
 

I had the same problem when I acquired my '83 944 6 weeks ago. I have been driving a Toyota Camry automatic (166,000 miles) and a suzuki GS1000G. Both enginews have a lot of torque at low rpm and get great gas mileage when shifted early. When I acquired the 944 it did not seem to like being shifted early. Yet, for most of my driving I am still interested in good gas mileage. I have one of those mpg gauges and I hate when it drops below 10 mpg. However, it definitely shifts smoother at higher rpm's, anything above 3500.

Wow - I really thought this was a stupid topic, but apparently this "when should I shift" thing is actually something people think about. I'm glad I didn't falter in in my decision of starting this topic.

I like the obsevation that people become more confindent when they shift in a downward motion - I'm like that my own self.

I also like it that 1.2gees said he was actually watching when he shifts after his first post - that's neat knowing he was thinking about it.

....and about the "U's" and "2's" - well, that is how I type and I can't change now - but I have decided that, from feedback, some people on this forum cannot tolerate such outlandish activity and that I must conform.....but I will not actually stop using "U's" and "2's" - instead, I'm planning on NOT using any words that require my "intricate code". When reading this post, all readers will notice a lack of the words "to" or "you" or any other words that fall under such category. I'm not actually typing any differently than I normally would, but it does take some extra time when I post because I will now avoid certain words. This effort is my way of saying that I want continued support and friendships......and I will put up with people's poor grammer and lack of ability when it involves capitalizing the letter "i". He he.

.....but seriously, if anyone catches me using another "U" or "2", don't hesitate in telling me I've relapsed. Also, if anyone see's the word's "you" or "two" being typed - inform me of that also because I state, as of this day of November 20th, that 944S Boyeee will never, and I repeat, NEVER use the words "you" or "two" or "before" or anything like that in any of my posts. It will become my "thing".

Enjoy.

PS - I started shifting in the 4000-4500 RPM range and now I have a bunch of Prelude and Civic drivers always thinking I'm initiating a race or something - the higher revs must scare them or something. I overheard a young "backwards ballhat wearing" fella just last nite say, "It's only a 944 - it's not a real Porsche, 944's have no guts". He must not have seen the "S" on the back of my car or something cause later on when I met him at the lights he revvvvvvved up his V-tec (or whatever they call them) and away we went. I was afraid of getting behind him in the early gears, but with the help of my Forun friends, I shifted at like 5500-6000 RPM and squeeled my tires in both 2nd and 3rd gears (I think this put him off a bit). We were pretty much side by side until we hit the first corner. I went in at like 130 KMS and didn't even squeel - but as I looked in my rear view, I swear I saw his tires on his right side lift up off the ground a bit. Needlessly said, once we got out of the corner and on the highway, I didn't see him till I came out of Burger King from getting my Double Bacon Cheeseburger (ummmmmmmmmm, Double Bacon Cheeseburger, best on the planet) when he said, "Is there chips or something in that car? Does it have racing suspension or something?". I simply replied, "No, it's "just" a 944 - and real Porsches drive like that, educate all the other Honda drivers."

I'm not one that initiates "racing", but when a lil' white guy who is wearing more gold than Mr. T and is dressed like he was given hand-me-downs by Puff Daddy calls my car "not a real Porsche", I must defend the 944 name, plus it was really cool!!! Weeeeeee!

Thanks again Forum people. I'm 1-0!!!!

Here I am worrying about "babying" my car and I'm flying at corners at 130 (not miles per hour - remember I'm Canadian) and getting her up around 210 on the highway. Something in that car made me do it!!!

........and I'm not complaining.

I typically shift at 3k...looking for a little bit more acceleration i shift at 3.5k to 4k....haulin ass acceleration i shift at 5.5k or therabouts...

Yahoo for defending the 944 name. :) This guy in an integra with a 8" wing revved at me...I was like....are you serious? I dont think it was a GSR...something like 8-10 or more carlengths to 110...

By the way...the 944S isn't that much quicker than an early '44...thats what I've read anyway..

Boyee: Nice to see another canuck on the board... I was up in PEI in the summer visiting my sister (and totalling her 924, thats a long story)......was in Nova Scotia for a while (my brother in law is from there)..... either way ...just thought I would say hi.

Back to the topic.........

uhmmmmm this post made go look at where I shift...

when cold.... 2500-3500

when hot .....3500-4500

when having fun 4000-6000 ** I just don't like hitting the rev limiter it just makes my stomach queezy....

with ice on the road ... no more than 3500 cold or hot! Unless you want to hit the ditch

on the highway 2500-3000

Once you get over 3500, the car just wants to pull, and it seems smoother over 3500.

?? uhmmm any of you turbo guys drive in the snow? curious if it kicks its rear end out once the turbo spools up?? I can't imagine driving that 500 hp 944 on the ice....
??never thought my 944na would have upside to having low torque and hp??? :)

ae1969-

To answer your question on the snow driving: my 951 spins once the turbo spools up on dry pavement (well, in 1st and second gear) :)

It's all over on snow or rain. I believe that if my wife were to race me (her in her Sentra, me in the 951) on a wet or snowy road, she would win. It is pretty hard to modulate the throttle well enough to get down very much power without spinning. It sure is fun though. ;)

Dave

Adrial - I'm not sure about the difference between a 944 N/A and a 944 S - speed-wise, that is. I've never driven a 944N/A. I did, however have a video tape sent my way that "showcased" a 944N/A and I noticed a considerable difference in the sound the engine gives off when the car is pushed. No offence directed at the 944N/A owners, but the "S" sounds a lil' bit smoother and it doesn't sound like it's trying as hard. I watched the RPM on this 944N/A when the guy was on the highway and also noticed the "S" gains speed faster in the higher gears. I don't think the speed difference is that noticable, but the "S" does seem like it pulls a bit stronger and has more pick-up on the highway. There is an extra 25-30 horsepower, so it must have some improvement over the 944N/A performance. I know there is a considerable jump between the "S" and the 951. That is my next car, the 951.

ae1969 - how's it goin', eh??? I'm just a-boat almost packed, I'm taking a trip over Calgary way in hopes of catching a Flames game (I swore that if they start playing well, I'd go see them - so, now is that time). What province in this fine country is the one ae1969 calls home?

hey boyee.......

I am from edmonton....... and I never thought I would see the day again....when edmonton and calgary would be leading the pack in the NHL.......(a sign of the end of the world...LOL)

Its going to make for some good hockey here in the Province of Alberta............

Just saw the Blues get their ass kicked here on Tuesday......man they looked sad...... Tkatchuk, Pronger and weight were invisible.....

Are you originally from out west?

Shift points are really a matter of driving style and conditions. I have mixed driving every day. When the car is cold and driving in a congested area, I generally shift at about 3K. As it warms up and traffic eases, I'll shift later at about 4K. When it warms up and traffic opens up, I'll shift at about 5K in the higher gears. When driving in a "spirited manner" I'll shift at about 6K. On a 951, torque starts to fall off a bit then. Enjoy your 944S, it's a great car.

Dave951M

Thanks Dave951M - I will enjoy it - as long as my wallet stays closed a while (lol)!

ae1969 - it is amazing that Calgary AND Edmonton have become one of the "elite". The world, sadly, will end because my dream year is coming true (get a Porsche AND the Flames have a winning record, and the top scorer in the league) - I was even going to go as far as painting a huge "C" on the hood of my car if they made the playoffs (not the Porsche - my Sidekick, I'm not that silly). Yup - St. Lou, Colorado, Dallas, New Jersey and Washington all look pretty bad - it's a nice change. Edmonton and Calgary both continue playing "all out, every shift" hockey and I love it!! As per norm, I'm not a huge Oil fan, but I must respect what they have done. It's gonna turn out crazy come seasons end I'm guessing. All we can do is watch, enjoy and prey!! As a matter of fact, the Flames play Ottawa at home later tonite on CTV Sportsnet - I'll be home wearing my Flames shirt, hat and socks, while drinking from my Flames cup that sits on my Flames coaster! This will be a tought test for them tonite - Ottawa is hot at home right now. Fingers will be crossed.

I'm 100% a Maritimer thru and thru - I do (as all Martimers) have relatives in Calgary, Ontario, B.C., etc. - but have yet to see a Flames game in person. Hopefully I will be heading Calgary way soon to catch a game.

As to why I'm such a huge Flames fan - as I young child my dad sat me down and said, "Son, you have to pick your favorite sports teams and stick with them forever - it is your duty as a Canadian boyeee". Being very young, I picked the teams with the most colorful jerseys - thus the (at that time) Atlanta Flames (glad Vancouver didn't have those crazy "V" muti-colored shirts back then) and I picked the Houston Astros in baseball (remember those old super colorful striped jerseys they had? And those silly "Pittsburg Pirates" style flat top ball hats?). So, to this day, I'm a Flames fan and Astros fan - I stuck with those cities in most sports (Stampeders fan, Rockets fan - although, the Raptors are starting to change that view - old Football Oilers fan - but now a Vikings fan....an old Viking coach was a friend of my dads). So, I have tried to stick with my original choices as much as possible. You can only imagine my delight when the Flames finally hoisted the cup (in Montreal, mind you - the only team to EVER raised the cup in their old rink). I hope it's not to long before I get that delight again. Hey, at this point, a playoff birth will do!!!!

If they win the cup this year (a big "if", I know - but it's not impossible) I WILL paint a huge Flames "C" on the hood of my Porsche, as a show of my unfaltered support!! I will send picks to this forum.