Strange Clutch Issue and Burning Oil Smell...

[Cocacolakidd]

Remember to use antisieze on the starter bolts,even put some on the sholder of the bolt head, it will help with removal next time. Also make sure you torque to the correct value.

Quite a contradiction of mechanical terms. You cannot get correct torque values when adding Antisieze. Torque values are for clean dry fasteners only - Unless it is stated/marked with the torque value to add a specific compound, otherwise it is understood that torque values are for clean dry fasteners only.

[suedeworthey]

I re-assembled it last night, but did not use a torque wrench. I torqued the bolts to feel (hopefully enough). My torque wrench is too large to fit in there. I couldn't even fit a 19mm socket with a 1/2" drive wrench in there (it would fit at an angle, but I didn't really feel like shredding the bolts). I had to use an open-ended 19mm wrench ($25 long wrench set from Harbor Freight) to remove and re-install the starter. The closed end couldn't even fit properly on one bolt.

I also couldn't get proper torque on the 17mm torque tube bolt (that holds the heat shield on). This is the only one I am really worried about. There's no way to get a wrench in there, or any way to keep the socket wrench straight while trying to put some torque on the bolt...

Next time, I will invest in a power bleeder as well. It would have made the bleeding process much faster and easier.

Oh, and the job would have been 1000x easier on a level surface or on a lift. I'll post a picture... My chest barely cleared the car, and I was rather uneasy working under it.

[suedeworthey]

Here are the photos I promised... One on jack stands (yesterday morning), and one after I finished, washed it, and turned it around (this morning).

[Norm101469]

Where do you live Suede?? Looks like one of my friends neighborhoods in Virginia lol

Norm

[Gawernator]

Are those DoD tags on the windshield?

[suedeworthey]

I live in San Antonio, TX.

The tags are the inspection and registration stickers for TX.

[suedeworthey]

I felt under the rear of the cam tower cover to see if there was any oil leaking, and there is... It does not seem significant, and is not "dripping," but it was there. I don't think that this is the source, as there is no sign of oil on the exhaust headers at all. I can not see if the AOS is leaking either... I'll wait until I have some daylight and see if I can see it a little better.

When I was under the car replacing the slave cylinder, I did notice that there is some fluid everywhere (my guess is power steering fluid). I am wondering if I should switch to a manual rack...

[89-944NA]

Cam housing gaskets usually fail at the rear corner (#4 cylinder)....very common place for these to leak...I'm changing my cam housing gasket this weekend it just started to leak this past week.

[968 GUY]

Torqued to feel,oh my, Cococola kid should be having a heart attack by now!

[968 GUY]

I could not find starter specific torque values in my 944 manual, but I'm sure kid will step in.
What contradiction? I do understand that for CRITICAL torquing dry or lubed instructions must be followed, but on starter bolts which seldom get messed with, except for maybe someone like Cocacolakidd that must have the starter in and out quite often, and are steel giong into aluminum, and are subjected to water, dirt, temp. changes, etc. I am sure the extra torque on that sized bolt, if it indeed does not require some sort of lube, is not anengine destroying factor.
As I stated, I could not find any specifics in the 944 manual for the starter bolts, but it seems that when I changed the clutch in the 968, there was a torque value for each bolt and yes, I anti-siezed the HELL out of them, and have had to remove the starter since with no problem. And I retorqued by feel!
Please explain the "contradiction of mechanical terms" what? Torque and Tighten? Correct value?

[zedsn]

When I reinstalled my starter I used antisieze, a box wrench and just tightened the bolts to as hard as my hand would tighten them. There is no way to get a torque wrench on one side. As long as they are tight and you can even use a lock washer I don't think that you will have any problem down the road.

[968 GUY]

Thank you Zed.

[suedeworthey]

I didn't put any antisieze on my starter bolts (maybe I should have)... I am fairly certain they are plenty tight enough to not come out on their own though. The one I am actually worried about is the torque tube bolt that goes through the starter heat shield. There was no way I could really tighten it... Anyone have any ideas on that one?

As for the oil leak, it is not the cam tower gasket where the cam tower bolts to the head, but that rear seal (the one that seems to go out on everyone's car). Is there any way to get that off w/o removing the cam tower?

[kdjones2000]

19mm (or 17?) socket, long or intermediate extension, ratchet handle with swiveling handle. You might want to use a universal joint in there somewhere if need be.

Go in where the exhaust tubes open up into a "Y", and you can get at this bolt. Most 951 owners are very practiced at this bolt.

Good luck, Keith

[89-944NA]

So, your leak is at the cam cover on the back of the cam housing? You get to pull the cam housing for that one.

Can't find any specific torque for the starter bolts either, but general rule of thumb is a 12mm bolt (19mm head) 50 to 71 ftlbs. But I also follow the popular consensus and anti-sieze and tighten it TIGHT.

[968 GUY]

Thanks also to NA for that. I knew my Navy mechanic and shipyard and aerospace experience had not been completely wrong. Although correct in the fact there are times to not use lube when torquing. Had a few classes and certifications at Bremerton Naval Shipyard.
I may not be remembering correctly as it was a while ago, but I think I took that cover off without pulling the cam tower. Not 100% so if someone else has, please speak up, of course if there is absolutely no way, then state that also.

[968 GUY]

I had to take the torque tube on the Tip 968 to replace the broken damper and had to do like kd described although I had the exh. off and the 968 is not quite the same animal as a 951.Still had a hard time with it.Probably because there was no ANTISIEZE put on it. There is now.

[suedeworthey]

The torque tube bolt is a 17mm. My extension is the perfect length to take it off, and get it in, but I don't have enough space(between the exhaust pipes) to tighten it some more. There's no way my torque wrench would fit in there at all (while the exhaust is attached).

I have a universal joint, but no swivel handle/head ratchet (maybe another trip to the store).

As for the cam gasket, if I have to remove the cam tower, how can I properly re-tension the timing belt? I do not have the porsche tool, and would not tighten this belt by feel.

Thanks again everyone.

[968 GUY]

Do you have a workshop manual? You really need to get one. Some kind person may be able to e-mail you a copy...I would if I knew how.
The timing belt has an automatic tensioner. Some people don't trust it and use the tension checking tool, some just let the tensioner do the work.
Do a search on here and I am sure you will be able to find posts by someone who has laid out a detailed description of how they did it.
Always revert back to Clarksgarage.com, very useful. At the beginning of the turbo forum, there are some useful tips also.

[suedeworthey]

Yeah, I have the PDF manuals (painful to search, but nice to have). I also have a Haynes manual I bought several years ago.

Does the '87 Turbo have an automatic tensioner? I had an '86 944 NA in Belgium, and it did not, so I just assumed it was the same. What about the balance shaft belt? Does it have a tensioner on the newer models?

I use Clark's Garage as a reference for everything I can (including replacing my slave cylinder). It did not mention the bracket on the hose (half way down), and it was impossible for me to reach, so I still have an old hose (I'll have to figure that one out eventually, since I bought a replacement and all...).

I am still wondering if I can get that rear cam cover off w/o removing the cam tower.