944 Fuel Leak

[GermanBoy]

Picked up a 88 944 NA that had sat for 2 years due to a non start issue. After getting it home and looking it over it appears the no start issue was due to a bad DME relay. Fuel pump wasn't sending fuel. Did the 3 wire Clarks thing and fuel pump now works.

Uppon trying to start the tach bounces as per having good sensors. Fuel is delivered at least to the rail and spark is being sent. So what are we missing? Fuel, spark, air. Pulled the air cleaner housing off and found a mouse or squirrel nest. Removed it and still no start, not even a fire.

I noticed a hissing sound and it turns out the fuel line has a small leak in it. I would have to assume for sitting as long as it did it would be a dry rot crack. Obviously it needs to be replaced and I ordered one yesterday, but it wont be here for a couple weeks. It's the high pressure rubber line that comes up from the fender area and connects to the damper on the front of the rail.

Would the small leak cause a no start? I have looked over vacuum lines and other obvious places of failure.

Any healp would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

[GermanBoy]

Changed the plugs, wires, cap, rotor. No more leak...

Odd...

Will fire with starter fluid.

Perhaps the gas is so old it is no longer gas?

Best way to drain?

[wrench1]

Welcome to the forum. You will find a lot of good hearted people with lot-o-knowledge here willing to help with your project. Weed thru everything that you can on several forums to pick up what you can and ask questions. Again, welcome to the group.

As to your questions. Have you removed the fuel rail front cap nut and checked for fuel flow and pressure? There is a small steel ball in there that seals the fuel fitting from leaking, don't loose it. It's an odd metric fitting. What I do is press a fuel hose on to it and clamp it and turn on the fuel pump and check for flow. If you have flow then check for pressure with a gauge, around 40-50 PSI is good. If you have flow, pressure and spark and will run with starting fluid you are down to either the injectors or the DME.

Check your local parts houses for a "Noid" light. It's a small LED lamp with a diode that will flash each time the injector is triggered. If you can not find one local you can get one from this host or build one yourself. Unplug each injector, insert the Noid and crank the engine over. If it flashes then the injector is getting power. If the injector gets power it proofs the DME sense the car will run on starting fluid. At this point it sounds like the injectors may be gummed up from sitting. You can have them cleaned or you can replace them.

The late model DME is located under the passengers foot well on a section of wood. Yes wood, I don't know why but it works.

[John_AZ]

Originally Posted by GermanBoy

I noticed a hissing sound and it turns out the fuel line has a small leak in it. I would have to assume for sitting as long as it did it would be a dry rot crack. Obviously it needs to be replaced and I ordered one yesterday, but it wont be here for a couple weeks. It's the high pressure rubber line that comes up from the fender area and connects to the damper on the front of the rail.

Would the small leak cause a no start? I have looked over vacuum lines and other obvious places of failure.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

First, I hope you are replacing both fuel lines and the jumper fuel line.

Pelican sells the "jumper"
Pelican Parts - Product Information: 944-110-413-02-M100

I bought my 2 fuel line kits from Rennbay and they came in a couple of days.

If the "squirrel or mouse nest" was in the air intake, maybe they chewed a couple of wires by the AFM. Check the connection, make sure the "door" swings freely.

GL
John

[xsbank]

2-year-old gas is probably sludge, too. What does it smell like?

[GermanBoy]

I havent taken the fuel rail front cap off. Will do that this morning. I assumed there was flow as there was an apparent leak from the high pressure line.

There is a hissing from the fuel regulator area when using the relay jumper, but not when using the actual relay. I thought that perhaps the relay was bad so I had a new one overnighted but even with the new relay there is no "hissing". I did read on the clark site that with the jumper the PSI is about 36 and with the relay the PSI is about 29.

I'm inclined to think the fuel system is clogged. The screen in the tank, the fuel pump, filter, vent tube, etc... I am hesitent to drain the tank as there is about 15 gallons of gas in there.

When I take the fuel rail nut off I will have a better sample of the gas (if it is infact flowing) to determin its condition.

I did order a replacement fuel line from Pelican for almost $150, I could have gotten it from the dealership for $50 and quicker. I didn't oreder the return line or the jumper as they showed no signes of leakage.

I will check on the AFM operation today as well.

I would really like to get this thing running this weekend. It was good to hear it run, even if it was only for a few seconds on started fluid.

I missed these cars.

Thank you for the replies.

[Ky914Newbie]

If you determine that there are any issues with the injectors, let me know. I have 2 Bosche injectors that have been rebuilt by Witchhunter performance that I would sell for the price of the rebuild ($50). At the least, I would change the o rings on the injectors if it sat that long to make sure there isn't a leak. You don't want a fire once you get it going.

[GermanBoy]

Fuel is coming out at the rail. Looks like piss.

The clear is regular gas. The other is what came out of the car.

[bfunke]

I've never seen colorless gasoline. Most has a yellowish hue. Some are greenish, others blue.

[GermanBoy]

The gas on the left is 94 Octane that was purchased two days ago. The stuff on the right is what came out of the car.

We drained it out the rail by connecting a rubber hose to the rail where cap comes off.

We put in 5 gallons of 94 and some octane boot aditive. Then pumped that through the system to purge the remaining of the old.

Car still will not start. Mysteriously the high pressure fuel line no longer leaks?

Going to test the injectors and AFM.

[BoxsterGT]

I can help with Fuel Hoses & Lines, and I have this tester that connects to the same test port you are using to examine the fuel.............




I have a repair hose that goes between the fuel hardline in the front Rt fenderwell and up to the Fuel Rail............







I also re-make the Fuel Rail "Jumper" hose that everyone eventually needs as well............




There is a little "Noid Light" tester readily available for cheap money at NAPA or Auto Zone stores or the tool trucks. It is very helpful in testing for injector pulse.

Also a common issue are the two flywheel sensors at the rear top of the motor above the Bell housing & flywheel.

If one or both of these are bad you will get no injector pulse & no spark.

Len at Autosportengineering dot com

[GermanBoy]

Thank you for that, though I think it is too late to cancel my order with Pelican.

We get spark as it will fire with starting fluid.

I just put the multimeter to the inector harness. Shouldn't there be 12v with the key in the on position? I get nothing...

[GermanBoy]

OK, strike that.... I didn't realize that to test you connect one lead to the negative on the battery and check each connetor on the harness for the 12v ...

Both connectors in the injector harness show 12v. That means a short somewhere right?

[GermanBoy]

Wooohoooo! It runs.....

Tired as hell ... will splain tomorrow.

Thanks guys for everything!

[jeffrsmith]

Congrats! Glad you were able to figure it out.

[VirginiaF1]

Originally Posted by GermanBoy

Wooohoooo! It runs.....

Tired as hell ... will splain tomorrow.

Thanks guys for everything!

Yay!
How much did you pay for Estella?
When? Whats her miles?
Let us know your solution.
Welcome!

[GermanBoy]

I paid $1500 couple days ago. 91k miles.

At the time it wasn't running but I did the usual checks to make sure it wasn't serious. Was told it was an electrical issue. That the car had sat for a couple years due to an unresolvable (by them) no start issue.

I paid $250 to have it towed 48 miles.

Purchased new Bosch battery - $152+

Purchased tune up stuff - Plugs, Wires, Cap, Button, Fuel Filter, Oil Filter, Air Filter, Oil, Wiper blades, Battery Holder, Battery Cover, New gas, Octane booster, New headlights, new fog lights, DME relay, Fuel Line (to be cancleed as not needed) - $450

Will purchase tomorrow - Thermostat.

TESTED:
Injectors, AFM, CPS, DME relay, Coil, Fuel Pump, My sanity....

The issue was a combination... DME relay bad, old gas, desperately needed tune up.

Inevitably the eurika moment was the firing order.... I had spent 14 hours today testing and f*cking with everything that the firing order was wrong. It came to me after sitting frustrated while drinking some intoxicating beverage. I ran outside, adjusted the order and boom, she purred like a kitten.

The oddest thing was the fuel leak... The high pressure fuel line leaked since starting this project and all-of-a-sudden stopped leaking and is no longer a problem.... I suppose (without realizing the fundamentals of rubber) it was due to age and none use.

At this point I am extremely happy. I love these cars. NA or turbo it doesn't matter. It's not about being the fastest or having the current proclaimed best, it's about respecting a legend. Our bimmirs will out perform this car, but the fundemental passion of being a part of something so gratifying is priceless.

I am this night perhaps, the happiest idiot allive! =)

EDITED: Grammatical crap!

[John_AZ]

14 hours of drinking to remember to check the firing order...Oktoberfest!

Great news

[968 GUY]

Don't trust that fuel hose. You may end up with a 944 barbq grille.

[Ga 951]

Best advice is to replace all the engine compt fuel hoses if you don't know their history. All of them can cause a catastrophic leak. BBQ front end