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It's funny that I never read anything about any of this in the past 3 years I've been anticipating this rebuild.. It seems like something that someone would mention from time to time, not something I would have to specifically search for.

The machine shop is redneck (North Carolina) and after getting ripped off by a user called "many944s" for $850 on my first rebuild, I think I'm gonna go ahead and pull the plug on this... I dont wanna go another 3 years and still not have a working 944, **** it.. I quit.

For sale: 1987 944S "project"

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2001 Porsche Boxster
1987 944S
Old 11-18-2013, 12:43 PM
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I want it out of my garage, parted or whole..

FS 1987 944S 16v "Project" car
Old 11-18-2013, 12:54 PM
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Also, just curious.. assuming I drop another $1500 to fix the cylinders and recoat the pistons, why would I need to buy new piston rings if they're already new?
Old 11-18-2013, 01:16 PM
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The block can be salvaged if you choose to go that route. Otherwise find a good used block and use that to start.

928 Motorsports® Services - Porsche® 928, 944, & 951 NiCom® (Nikasil®) Plating and Honing - Porsche® 928 World record Holder 216.63537 mph
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Past worth mentioning - 1987 924S, 1987 944, 1988 944T with 5.7L LS1
Old 11-18-2013, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Endat View Post
Also, just curious.. assuming I drop another $1500 to fix the cylinders and recoat the pistons, why would I need to buy new piston rings if they're already new?
Depending how much the block was honed it might not be possible to get the bores back to factory spec. This would require either using oversize piston rings or possibly over sized pistons to make up the difference.

Send the block out first to be evaluated, they can then tell you what will be required to make it work.
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Jon
1988 Granite Green 911 3.4L
2005 Arctic Silver 996 GT3
Past worth mentioning - 1987 924S, 1987 944, 1988 944T with 5.7L LS1
Old 11-18-2013, 01:19 PM
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Hang on! Can't you go back to the shop that butchered it in the first place and work something out with them? Will they not stand behind their "work"? You'd think that when you told them what it was out of they'd have done some homework. My guy did tons, and he's only doing a head.

Look up HondaDustr's build thread. It's great.

Frankly, you're lucky you posted pics of those bores. This way's better than going all the way on the build only to have it grenade instead of run in...
Old 11-18-2013, 06:57 PM
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Endat, I have a good block if you need to go that route... PM'ed you
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Old 11-18-2013, 07:11 PM
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I'm in redneck North Carolina.. I'm not going to find anyone who won't treat my car like a Pontiac.

This is the 3rd time in 3 years this rebuild has derailed because of someone else. It's just been an excuse for people to lie to me and take my money.. I would rather spend the rest of my money moving in with my girlfriend.. stop wasting my life on this ****ing car.
Old 11-18-2013, 08:12 PM
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It's just a 2.5 block, no reason to do machine work on one. Just find a block with decent bores (no scuffs or deep scratches) and the same piston tolerance group and buy it for a few hundred, wrench it together and go. Sell your block to someone who wants to bore, sleeve and go big. Get your $ back from the shop, assuming they could be expected to know that their procedure was incorrect. If you handed them the block and asked for an iron block style hone then it's probably on you.

-Joel.
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Old 11-19-2013, 10:46 AM
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Way too soon to punt in my opinion. You're not that far along on the rebuild. I had a cracked cylinder wall in my 968 block and ended up pulling and rebuilding the engine 4 stinking times before it was right. Believe me I wanted to push the thing in a lake many times, but I am glad now that I didn't. Just for kicks here's a picture of one of these Alusil bores. It does look a lot different than the iron bore cross hatching that is much more common.
Don't give up
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'94 968
Old 11-19-2013, 12:33 PM
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If this were a 968, I would build it as many times as I needed to and spare no expense.. but it's not.

I definitely told the guy at the machine shop exactly what car it was for and all of the specs from the workshop manual... i asked if he was sure he knew what he was doing.. he said he's done it before, so I guess he's butchered other 944 blocks. Maybe it's my fault for not knowing about this "Alusil" and making sure he had the correct machines and materials.. but IMO, if I pay for a certain job to be done, I shouldn't have to dig that deep to make sure it doesnt get ****ed up. Besides, I saw no mention of it in the workshop manuals.

Still, all of the engine parts must go! If I had it to do all over again, I would go back 3 years and just buy a working engine. Anyone want to trade a working engine for a ruined engine build?

If no one takes the body as a whole, I may just buy a working engine next summer and skip the ambition of a complete overhaul.
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Last edited by Endat; 11-19-2013 at 12:50 PM..
Old 11-19-2013, 12:48 PM
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So if the cylinders cant be honed without an expensive laboratory, and everyone avoids this process.. how long does this special liquid chemical coating last? I am thinking any "used" block I get will have worn cylinders..

I can't assume this Alusil junk will make it last forever... How many miles until this special cylinder lining is depleted? and what would be the point of putting someone else's used/worn cylinder walls in a brand new engine?

And if it can't be recoated without throwing it out of spec, it sounds like these are single-use engine blocks unless you want to use larger rings or change pistons.. is that correct?

No wonder I see so many chevy conversions... the M44 engine sounds like it's very sensitive and delicate :P
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Old 11-19-2013, 03:30 PM
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These engine blocks go a long, long time with normal maintenance. It's not a liquid chemical coating, it's a process of supersaturation of the aluminum (when molten) with silicon, which precipitates in the suspension as silicon crystals, and those in turn present a glass-like wear surface to the piston rings.

The 944 suffers from being a high-tech platform available at very low cost, and this is unfortunately what happens sometimes when a high-tech platform is taken to Honest Eddie's Auto. I did the same thing with my 924 and my 944S - i.e. I took them to a couple of local shops and regretted it. I also took my 968 to one supposedly expert shop and regretted it, and ended up doing all of my own work since.

The sad fact is if you're going to own a Porsche, pretty much any Porsche, you need to be able to turn your own wrenches or have quality service available within a distance you're willing to drive.

I hope you don't give up on it, but having done it twice myself, I'll understand if you do and I wish you the best of luck.
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Old 11-19-2013, 03:57 PM
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The good thing about these bores is that if damaged, they can be welded back together, and the Alusil repaired back to stock bore. Pistons, bearings, seals and such will all wear out before those bores under normal use with proper maintenance.
Old 11-20-2013, 04:49 AM
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I have the 6 workshop manual pages that describe the cylinder bore machining/honing procedure in a PDF. Should you want to take it to the shop that did the original work or to another place to see if they can do it, drop me a pm and I'll email that to you.
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'94 968
Old 11-20-2013, 05:11 AM
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At any rate this is easy to fix with some random 944NA 2.5 block I believe.
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Old 11-20-2013, 08:18 AM
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If you are anywhere near Raleigh (or Charlotte, for that matter) I might be able to point you to some great shops who know what they're doing when it comes to Porsche.

Good luck!
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Old 11-20-2013, 09:10 AM
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If a 2.5 block will work I may have one I can give you if you wanna pay to ship. Its from a 86 though, so no tensioner...
Old 11-20-2013, 09:21 AM
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Old 11-20-2013, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHICKS View Post
If a 2.5 block will work I may have one I can give you if you wanna pay to ship. Its from a 86 though, so no tensioner...
If it'll work with my internals, I don't see why not... does anyone know if the studs for the tensioner be transferred over?

I should at least take some time to reconsider everything before selling it off.
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Old 11-20-2013, 04:11 PM
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