Massive oil leak, noise, oil in coolant?

[crossrocker]

Hi guys
It seems that I have a plethora of problems on my hand.
A little background: I got a 87 944S. About 3 months ago I did a bunch of fluid changes(oil, transmission, brake) as well as oil filter and spark plugs. Right afterwards, my filter seal popped and oil launched all over my windshield. I figured OK maybe I put the filter on wrong and put another one and replaced the oil. Also, when I replaced the spark plugs, I did see little pools of oil inside.

Fastforward a few months later, my filter pops again(pretty sure)! I saw light white smoke from under the hood, so pulled over. Couple of things it could be- The first time it popped, everything in my engine got drenched in oil. And since then, Ive had an oil warning light with oil pegged at 0. I figure no big, the pressure sender is drenched in oil. So I cleaned everything off and accidentally over torqued one of the nuts:

On top of that, a few connections look screwy(pinched, corroded wires):

[img]

It could also be that I had a little bit too much oil in the tank. I was getting annoyed of trying to get the perfect amount in so it was a bit over the high point on the dipstick.
Also, it seems that I now have oil in my coolant tank as well as a few drips of coolant on the ground:





After dipping a paper towel in the tank:



And the car now makes a tapping noise like this:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYfSu94dkaM
I'm not sure if it's because low on oil(probably about 2 quarts- i only started it for a sec because it needed to be moved)

So basically-
Oil and a little bit of a coolant leak. Oil leak is probably from filter seal, not 100% sure.
Coolant tank is nasty
Spark plugs are oily
Oil pressure sender or OPRV problems
Everything drenched in oil

My question is where do I start? some reasarch says head gasket, some says oil cooler leak. maybe both.
One thing I definitely know about and want to tak care of is the wiring around the oil pressure sender. Some of it is corroded and stripped. What do I do about that? Im terrible at electrical things.

Also, before someone points it out, I've been a dumbass with this car. I should have inspected the problems when I noticed them but I let the frustration of other problems get the better of me.

Thanks in advanced, please help me not have to take this into a shop!

[PA_944]

A compression test should prove whether it's the head gasket or not.

Low oil pressure should always be investigated as if it is truly running low pressure you'll eventually wear at least one internal engine component until it fails.

If it is sounding tappety then your almost certainly running low oil pressure.

[crossrocker]

Originally Posted by PA_944

A compression test should prove whether it's the head gasket or not.

Low oil pressure should always be investigated as if it is truly running low pressure you'll eventually wear at least one internal engine component until it fails.

If it is sounding tappety then your almost certainly running low oil pressure.

I'll get working on compression test, good idea. But yea so the tappety sound is definitely low oil pressure since that sound only started after the fact.

[djnolan]

First, Are you sure you are using the correct oil filter (Mahle 142 or Porsche) and it is tightened properly?

Second, If your oil pressure gauge is not reading at least the minimum pressure, then don't run the engine until you figure out why.

Get oil pressure resolved before going any further...


Tappet noise on startup is normal for a car that has been sitting.

Rule of thumb: Oil in coolant is from a bad oil cooler seal. Coolant in oil is from a bad head gasket.

[crossrocker]

Originally Posted by djnolan

First, Are you sure you are using the correct oil filter (Mahle 142 or Porsche) and it is tightened properly?

Second, If your oil pressure gauge is not reading at least the minimum pressure, then don't run the engine until you figure out why.

Get oil pressure resolved before going any further...


Tappet noise on startup is normal for a car that has been sitting.

Rule of thumb: Oil in coolant is from a bad oil cooler seal. Coolant in oil is from a bad head gasket.

Yes, mahle oc 142 all 3 times.
I figured the oil pressure thing was only because of a wonky sensor, the dipstick looked ok, if not a little bit higher.
And the car hasn't been sitting that long, this happened recently so I believe the tapping sound may just be from low oil.

What can I do about corroded wires? Not even sure how to start

Oil is in coolant tank (....right?) so I'll order the oil cooler seals. What about oil in spark plug wells?

[PA_944]

You cannot tell how the oil pressure is from the dipstick that just tells you how much oil is in the engine.

The oil pressure is generated by the oil pump, it is possible to have decent oil pressure with a really small amount of oil in the engine (not recommended though). It's just as possible to have the correct oil level on the dipstick but have no oil pressure due to a bad oil pump or a leak in the pressurized side of the oil tracks.

The tapping sound is most likely from the hydraulic lifters being starved of oil so because their not getting the correct oil feed they are not tensioning themselves as they should giving you the noise.

As has been said earlier it is not advisable to run an engine if you do not know if the oil pressure is good as serious internal damage is bound to be the outcome with no oil pressure, that goes for a Kia or a Ferrari.

Best of Luck,

[djnolan]

If your filter leaked make sure the gasket surface is clean.

Did you say your oil pressure gauge is not reading? If so you need to figure out why before running engine again.

Oil in spark plug well is from a bad valve cover gasket. Ignore for now, more fun to come later with the chain tensioner pads, etc.

[djnolan]

Originally Posted by crossrocker

What can I do about corroded wires? Not even sure how to start

1st make sure the two wires are not touching. From the picture they look to still be making a connection but if they aren't, cut the connector off and get a replacement connector to crimp on at your auto parts store. Even better if you can solder it on.

A replacement sensor is in the $25 - $50 range and might also fix the problem. They do go bad.

Go to Clarkes Garage and look at the garage shop manual section. Clark's Garage Home Page
There are three sections to look at for this problem:

Engine oil pressure, sensor replacement
T-01 engine trouble shooting, and
T-09 Electrical gauges troubleshooting

[Bradical]

Sounds like you have a bad or misaligned oil pressure relief valve.

[crossrocker]

Here's the plan so far:
Run a compression tests
Repair leaking oil cooler (will order kit)
Repair oil pressure sender and its wiring and look at OPRV

Should I do a foes as well? I'm thinking I may as well. Recommendations?

Bradical, I will definitely look into that when take care of the pressure sender wiring. I'll probably just replace it.

[djnolan]

Before attempting the oil cooler seal, fix the oil pressure gauge problem first and make sure you have proper oil pressure.

The oil cooler seal is pretty complicated and you don't want to start the repair until you are sure you have proper oil pressure.

[crossrocker]

Originally Posted by djnolan

Before attempting the oil cooler seal, fix the oil pressure gauge problem first and make sure you have proper oil pressure.

The oil cooler seal is pretty complicated and you don't want to start the repair until you are sure you have proper oil pressure.

Ok I will. Just the pressure sender and OPRV right?

[djnolan]

Originally Posted by crossrocker

Ok I will. Just the pressure sender and OPRV right?

Just work on the sender and the wiring, if needed, to get the gauge working and to verify proper oil pressure at idle.

Should be 4-5 bar at idle when cold, 2-3 bar at idle when warm. Check clarkes for exact numbers.

Hopefully your filter leak has been fixed, if not, fix this next.

Once you have good oil pressure you can worry about the oil cooler seal next. I warn you it is a ***** for a novice.

Don't touch the OPRV yet. It is part of the oil cooler seal repair.

[Bradical]

To me, i would suspect OPRV problems are the source of all of your woes. You blew off an oil filter due to exessive oil pressure, then added oil and blew another one? Oil cooler seals are probably a second symptom. Putting a new oil pressure sender before doing the seals and OPRV is just delaying the inevitable.

Take a minute and consider this- the oil cooler is difficult to access with the engine installed. You blew two filters, so we know we have an OPRV problem. You have coolant in your oil now, which means the milkshake has coated your rod and main bearings. Porsche recommends the bearings be changed when the cooler seals go.

I guess what I am hinting at is... How old is your clutch?

[djnolan]

A bad oprv is one I haven't heard of too many times but it could be. I would still want to have a working oil pressure gauge before starting any further diagnosis or repairs. Also I looked at several 16v S cars before finding a decent one, and many of them had poor oil pressure, no doubt because of the more powerful 16v engine putting more wear on the rod bearings.

Good luck, it sounds like you have some work ahead of you.

[crossrocker]

Originally Posted by djnolan

A bad oprv is one I haven't heard of too many times but it could be. I would still want to have a working oil pressure gauge before starting any further diagnosis or repairs. Also I looked at several 16v S cars before finding a decent one, and many of them had poor oil pressure, no doubt because of the more powerful 16v engine putting more wear on the rod bearings.

Good luck, it sounds like you have some work ahead of you.

Yea I'm definitely hoping the OPRV doesn't need replacing. I'm gonna do those seals alone with the pil cooler as well as alignment.

As far as the wiring for the pressure sending unit and others, how do I go about it? Can I just remove everything bring it to a store and get replacement wiring? I feel so stupid with electrical stuff cause I don't know even a little bit

Btw, can someone tell me what this is: http://imgur.com/qhG9isf


Edit just looked down there again to remove some wiring, here's what I got:

Do I just chop off the wiring, crimp new wiring on, and reconnect?

I'll be ordering a new oil pressure sender as mine is screwed:

[mikepellegrini]

Blowing the seal on an oil filter is a classic symptom of a stuck OPRV.

[crossrocker]

Update: started working on getting to the oil cooler and pressure sender. I had to remove a line that is right above the headers to get to the header nuts. Coolant came out of the line and I didn't notice any oil, though not much coolant/water came out anyway. This is inside my coolant tank

So is there oil in the tank? What's a surefire way of telling?

I have also found the source of coolant leak and I'll get a picture of where from tomorrow.

[djnolan]

There would be a white "milkshake" on the coolant cap.

[djnolan]

Judging from your picture of the coolant tank you don't have a oil cooler leak. What does the coolant cap look like underneath? White milkshake or clean?

You should repair the oil pressure gauge first. Easy fix, replace sender and go to auto parts store and buy some crimp on connectors.

You should be able to repair the OPRV without removing the oil cooler. Change the o-rings, degunk it. What else could make it stick?

If you have to remove the oil cooler, You don't have to remove the exhaust header to change the oil cooler gasket. It will slip out underneath the header. You just need to have a good set of wrenches, sockets, extensions, etc. to get to the bolts. And you need to get the gasket surfaces clean before reinstalling.

Removing the exhaust header is a *****. The flange bolts will be rusted to heck unless they have been changed to stainless. you will have to remove the studs or tilt the engine to get it to clear the frame to remove it. In this case this can all be avoided.

Just work on one thing at a time. Do easy things first. Don't panic...