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I understand it now!!! I dont know what the hell the manual is talking about!!! Maybe it's just the way they are wording it that I dont understand. But,... this is how I know I am right,... I kepted in mind the firing order of the engine(1-3-4-2) and basically timed it to that. I have the lobes for cylinder 1 facing up with cylinder 1 in TDC. I couldn't get the marks to line up the first time becuase the cams had slack because of the CHAIN!!! So, I made it so the lobes for cylinder 1 are facing up then with cylinder 1 in TDC which means it's just about to start it's way down, I turned the cams clockwise until I couldnt turn no more without pressing down on any valves. That took away any slack the chain might of had. After I did that I locked the gear in place and BOOM PERFECT TDC!!! Does this make any sense??? I am right though??? So,... now the mark on the gear matches up with the mark on the housing and also the DIS ROTOR when installed will be touching the cylinder 1 terminal which means that is was fired, which means TDC. Right?
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Old 12-08-2002, 05:21 PM
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Notice that the lobes for cylinder 1 are facing up. I had removed the slack from the chain by turning cam #1 clockwise or in the direction of rotation until the intake lobe for cylinder 4 is on the valve tappet snug. I then locked the cam gear down. In the factory manual they use dial gauges to set the timing. Basically, where my cylinder 4 intake lobe is snug on the valve tappet theres is pusing down the tappet like 1.4mm. The question is,... is that a big difference? I mean 1.4mm isnt much at all. But, I have a feeling I am going to do it anyway. I mean damn, I could probably apply alittle bit more pressure clockwise and eye ball 1.4mm. Let me know what you think.



Notice the gear mark lines up with the housing mark. Also in the middle you will notice 4 other little holes that someone made, they line up too.
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Old 12-08-2002, 06:12 PM
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The only other thing to make sure ...

Get under the car look for the notch on the flywheel, and then check the mark on the bellhousing window.

If those line up then you should be dead on...

Tension the belt and then finally when you think you have it right....turn the engine using the crank by hand....Slowly....if you feel any hesitation stop. You should be able to bring the engine completely around once without any pistons hitting any valves....

Good luck
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Last edited by ae1969; 12-08-2002 at 06:27 PM..
Old 12-08-2002, 06:24 PM
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HE HE HE, damn i'm good. I used my $15 dialcaliper and zeroed it with no pressure on the intake tappet of cylinder #4. I messured from the top of the lobe to the tappet using the center of the lobe as a reference point. I have that tappet down by 1.3mm, which is fine by me Window on the bellhousing? Ill have to look.
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Old 12-08-2002, 06:36 PM
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Do you mean this? I dont see any window. There is thing hole with this gumdrop looking thing inside I think thats where you test for wear on the clutch. Anyways, I can see the flywheel in the hole but no mark. The factory manual only speaks of this flywheel mark. It said to line this up and the cam marks to get perfect TDC.

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Old 12-08-2002, 06:54 PM
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It worked!!! I turned the engine by hand and nothing touched!!! I turned it around once and lined the marks up by the cam and it automatically lined up the flywheel. Time to get the fule rail back together.
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Old 12-08-2002, 07:44 PM
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I'm calling it a day. I'm tired as hell and freezing my ass off. Think I'll watch some Resident Evil then hit the sack. Today, I'm going to get to start her up, hopefully. I'll have a baby if she doesnt start!!! Anyways. till, then.
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Old 12-08-2002, 09:44 PM
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It looks right to me too.
Old 12-09-2002, 12:05 AM
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Cool, I think the timing on the car is flawless. After all that it's pretty damn easy!!!
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Old 12-09-2002, 06:09 AM
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I had this same questions a week ago and never got this type of response. Must of been ALOT of people on vacation that week.
Old 12-09-2002, 02:14 PM
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What do you need to know???? BRO, I know it all now, HA HA HA!!!
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Old 12-09-2002, 02:15 PM
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OK , how do you fine tune the engine by advancing the timing.
Old 12-09-2002, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by RJ Santangelo
OK , how do you fine tune the engine by advancing the timing.
Short answer, you can't

Other than setting TDC, timing is controled entirely by the DME.

DME will advance/retard the timing as it sees fit, based on temp, fuel volume/quality airflow etc.

AFJuvat
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Old 12-09-2002, 02:27 PM
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Well, although I do know something somthing about this my guess would be to get the car in perfect TDC then release the cam gear without losing the cams current position. On the cams you'll see a place where the cam is hexed for a large wrench. Messure how far down cyl#4 intake tappet is before you turn the cam. Then you turn cam#1 or the cam that is turned by the gear .5mm or even 1mm at a time. Turning cam#1 will rid of any slack in the chain. Tighten everything then run the car. This is just a quick how to. It is very HARD to do if you dont know how everything works. You need to fine tune yours? Why?
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Old 12-09-2002, 02:27 PM
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Well, then there you go
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Old 12-09-2002, 03:21 PM
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car does not pull as hard as it use to, but may have something to do with the 41/2 month old fuel in it. Plus i didn't use the dial calipers as mentioned in the manual. I've talked to a couple of 16 valve guys and they said they "fine tuned" there timing. I guess its a load of BS.
Old 12-10-2002, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by RJ Santangelo
OK , how do you fine tune the engine by advancing the timing.
What they meant by fine tuning the engine is to adjust the relationship between the camshaft sprocket and the crankshaft sprocket in very small increments until you find the location at which the car "comes alive".

All the work that is in the workshop manual is just a coarse adjustment to get the valves opening at approximately the right time. The final adjustment (which is not discussed anywhere in the manual) is to tweak the camshaft sprocket until the car feels right.

Hard to describe, and can be very time consuming (make adjustment, test drive, make another adjustment, another test drive, repeat until satisfied with the engine's performance.)

If you didn't have to take the camshafts out of the head, there is a step that you missed, where the manual indicates to lock down the camshaft sprocket with three bolts (at the time that you remove the distributor rotor).

gb
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Old 08-12-2004, 03:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by AFJuvat
Short answer, you can't

Other than setting TDC, timing is controled entirely by the DME.

DME will advance/retard the timing as it sees fit, based on temp, fuel volume/quality airflow etc.

AFJuvat
Not sure I agree with that statement. Correct me if I am wrong but the S has a plate behind the cam gear that can rotate slightly thereby changing the position of the rotor with respect to the cam. See the picture I will try to post...

This from when I had to rebuilt my top end beginning of the year.

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Old 08-12-2004, 01:09 PM
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One last note...since I am responding to this.
The Cam Gear should fit on to the cam woodruff key perfectly. There is not any oversize on the cam gear key-way. The plate behind the cam gear is the one that has the oversized key-way.
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Old 08-12-2004, 01:19 PM
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Well, changing the cam timing and changing the ignition timing are two entirely different things.

Certainly, changing the cam timing can be done by moving the sprocket in relation to the camshaft.

That said, the ignition timing is still controlled by the DME. This is why the rotor on the distributor is wide (rotationally) so that, even if the DME is advancing or retarding the moment of ignition, the rotor is still able to conduct the spark through the rotor to the appropriate receiving point on the distributor cap.

Kind of a thought experiment is necessary to visualize this...

gb
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Old 08-12-2004, 01:20 PM
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