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MSD ignitions and retard boxes

First will just a MSD 6 ignition that increases your spark work on a 944? Second can a Boost timing master be hooked up to a 944 that retardds your timing as boost increases? I was planning on using the MSD 6BTM which has both of those effects. Do you still use the stock coil and distributer and wires? Im pretty sure you do. How does this work, does it wire into your DME somehow to bypass the dme's timing? It says will hook up to any car but im skeptical. Please help wise men...

John
Old 02-05-2003, 09:04 PM
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The MSD actually will be between your DME and coil. It will receive the coil firing signal from the DME and alter it before sending it to the coil. At lower RPM it will send multiple firing signals at higher RPM it will send a longer signal that will fire the plug for more degrees of crankshaft rotation. The BTM part will change the timing by when it sends the signal, you can adjust for 0-3 degrees retard per pound of boost pressure with a maximum of 15 or 20 degrees (i can't remember for sure). It should hook up to your car no problem.
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Old 02-05-2003, 09:19 PM
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Thanks alot for the help! The BTM that hooks into your stock ignition only can retard up to 20 degrees and from 1-3 degree per pound of boost. The 6BTM that has increased spark and the retard timing has a maximum of 15 degrees. Do you think i would need the one with the increased spark? Isnt the stock 944 ignition system made pretty well? I was thinkin maybe just upgrading to a Blaster 2 coil for a little more spark, and then just using a normal BTM made for the stock ignition. What do you all think about this, thanks

John
Old 02-05-2003, 09:53 PM
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my mom kept me in a retard box.
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Old 02-05-2003, 11:37 PM
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Old 02-06-2003, 01:09 AM
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Can you go with the J&S Safeguard to retard your timing?
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Old 02-06-2003, 04:13 AM
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I only have the 6A hooked up to my car, which was installed on top of a very good ignition system. It is probably the best money that I've spent on my car. You can really really feel more power at lower RPMs, and it makes 1st gear seem a lot more powerful. Your revs will get up a lot faster, hence you will be going faster. It even feels like torque is increased a little. It won't do anything for the high end, you need better breathing for that, but it will get you there quicker.

Worth every cent.

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Old 02-06-2003, 05:22 AM
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Yes the J & S safeguard will retard timing like the MSD BTM and also retard timing as it knocks, which is the safest way, but you need to pull the engine to drill and tap a knock sensor in and plus the J&S safeguard with the BTM and knock sensor is around 600. I can get a regular MSD BTM that works on the stock ignition for around 120. I think that if i put plenty enough fuel, use an intercooler and just automatically retard timing as boost increases, it will not knock, at least not much, so the J&S will not be necessary, although it would be the best bet, im looking at a money issue here.
Old 02-06-2003, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Wolf1
The MSD actually will be between your DME and coil. It will receive the coil firing signal from the DME and alter it before sending it to the coil. At lower RPM it will send multiple firing signals at higher RPM it will send a longer signal that will fire the plug for more degrees of crankshaft rotation. The BTM part will change the timing by when it sends the signal, you can adjust for 0-3 degrees retard per pound of boost pressure with a maximum of 15 or 20 degrees (i can't remember for sure). It should hook up to your car no problem.
I don't quite understand what you imply. You are saying the unit will make the spark last longer with a regular coil?
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Old 02-06-2003, 01:05 PM
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The MSD claims to multi-spark for 20 degrees of crankshaft rotation below 3000 rpm and one single spark that holds for 20 degrees of rotation above 3000 rpm.
Jacobs FC1000 claims to multi-spark with up to six sparks per combustion event over 22 degrees of crankshaft rotation.
Mallory Hyfire VI and Crane HI-6 also multi-spark but do not specify duration.
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Old 02-06-2003, 06:11 PM
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Just read MSD's web site. Interesting ignition system. Can't see where the street systems give more than multiple sparks. Their off road system claims to have a continous spark above 3000 rpm. Are you using this system for the street?
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Old 02-06-2003, 06:52 PM
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Wolf1 explained it good, i dont know exactly what it does but i know it works along with your stock coil and just boosts the spark energy and amount of volts, but the one i am getting also retards timing as boost increases. Yes i am using this for street. Most MSD systems are used on street, the MSD6 and BTM and 6AL are minor upgrades for street usually.

John
Old 02-06-2003, 07:01 PM
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I've used several MSD6-BTM units with supercharged V-8's. You can actually see the multi-spark and long burn time on the ignition scope. I don't know for sure how many degrees of burn time it "actually" provides. They claim 20, I can't prove them right or wrong, but it is a noticeably longer burn time than the stock ignition pattern. I mainly use them for the ignition retard feature and the rev limiting, but they do seem to help with starting and provide a more stable idle with larger cams. In the literature that comes with the 6BTM it states the "single spark event that lasts for 20 degrees crankshaft rotation" I think the main difference with the offroad 6 is the tougher case and resistance to vibration and elements, but they dont offer it with the boost control built in.
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72 914 - old toy- sold.
And a whole bunch of German scrap metal shaped like 924's.


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Old 02-06-2003, 07:07 PM
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Mallory makes a unit that retards off of a MAP sensor signal. They told me you could add the MAP & an IAT signal together to retard off of boost & intake temp combined.

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Old 02-08-2003, 04:12 AM
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I put an MSD-6a on my 924 in an effort to smooth the idle. It did nothing except burn up spark plugs.
I took it out and have it setting on a shelf.
I really think these things are only fixes if you have some other ignition issue and the will wear plugs fast.
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Old 02-08-2003, 04:13 AM
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That makes no sense, is it for sale?
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Old 02-08-2003, 04:17 AM
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Because the sparkplugs are firing so many more times than usual, more wear on them is expected. Don't use high performance sparkplugs (ie. silver). Instead use something stronger (ie. platinum). I've used Bosch Platinum +4s with no adverse effects.

-Tony
Old 02-08-2003, 05:09 AM
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MSD box

I have an MSD-6 box that I have always wanted to install on my NA 84 944 but don't really know how to wire it up. Does anyone have the correct wiring instructions for this car? If so, please let me know so I can add it to the winter to-do list.

nolte@pennswoods.net
Old 02-08-2003, 06:06 AM
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My car ia an 84' as well. If you still have the instructions, you need to use the first diagram setup. I think I might still have my instructions around here somewhere, I'll scan and send you a copy if needed.

-Tony
Old 02-08-2003, 07:56 AM
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http://www.msdignition.com/pdf/6series.pdf

The link above are the instructions in PDF format, direct from the MSD website. The diagram you need to follow is at the bottom of page 10. It's only takes 15-30min. to install....no biggie.

cya!

-Tony
Old 02-08-2003, 08:04 AM
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Old 02-08-2003, 08:04 AM
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