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Location: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
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New to the forums and Porsche

Hello all. Just wanting to say hi and all that jazz. Just joined here and have been doing a lot of reading over the past few days. I just purchased my first Porsche and got one hell of a deal on it. I will be on here quite a bit looking for solutions to problems that I know are going to come up and just over all hanging out. Anyways here are the details of my steal. Let me know what you all think.

1982 Porsche 928

The car has been parked for many years. It was my girlfriends fathers car before he passed away 3 years ago. She can remember sitting in the car when she was in 3rd grade. He purchased the car back in 1995 for $3000. The reciept for this purchase came with the car along with the original owners manual and maintinance book. The car was driven for a while after being purchased but he was in the middle of restoring another car at the time and never made it to this car.

The car has 83k miles on it. The body is in perfect shape. I think there is 1 or 2 spots that the paint has chipped and the PO sprayed it with some primer to stop it from rusting. But they are very small spots. It is a Black car with black/red interrior. The car has been under an awning for the last several years and has been able to avoid weathering too bad.

The interrior needs redone but it isnt too bad. Everything is leather. From the seats to the headliner and dash. the back seats arent bad at all but the front seats and dash need recovered. The headliner is in good shape. The car came with a car phone from the factory and the manual for the car phone is still with the car. I took up the back carpet as I am about to drop the fuel tank and I had to remove the car phone box that was screwed down back there and the carpet under it was like brand new.

It was supposedly started about 2 years ago but I have been unable to start it. I tried for about 2 hours to get it started but I lost. It would act like it wanted to start if I put a bit of gas in the intake but it wouldnt stay running. I removed the fuel pressure check valve and there was no fuel in the fuel rail. So I tried to jump the fuel relay to kick on the pump and the pump will not start. I did check to make sure there was power getting to the relay and there is. A tester light lit up when I connected pin 30 and 87 so I know that there is power there. I could not get it to light up back at the fuel pump when it was installed. So I am not sure if I have a bad fuel pump yet or not. I need to trace the wire and see if I see any breaks or anything.

When I got it I was told there was no gas in it. Here is where me being impatient, and wanting to hear my newly bought car run may have caused me problems but I am doubting that since I do not think the fuel pump has powered on since I got the car. So I put 1 gallon of gas in it. I was unable to get it to start. So thinking that maybe 1 gallon was not enough I went to the store and got 2 more gallons to put in it. (This is where the more experienced people are going to shake their heads at me.) Still nothing at this point. I should have checked the fuel pressure sooner but I did not.

Anyways I went to remove the fuel pump and drained the gas..... I drained out about 5-6 gallons of gas from the car. It was almost piss yellow and smelled odd. Way different smell than any gas I have smelled before which I am assuming is due to the gas breaking down over the years. And then I removed the fuel pump. And that is where I am at with this car as of last night. Tonight I am going to pull the gas tank and see what condition it is in.

The car also came with a spare set of rims/tires. They are gold Porsche wheels with 245 50vr15 tires I believe. Tires are almost new and have been sitting in a garage so they have not weathered. I would like information on these wheels if anyone knows anything. I will get pictures soon.

I payed $1000 for this car. Clean title and everything.
Old 10-26-2011, 03:02 PM
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Welcome to the Board. Your gonna get the same responses but clean the tank real good. Replace the Fuel Filter and possibly the fuel pumps if they are responding to jumping. Here is a link to a lot of issues already solved:

**MOST Common 928 Issues AND Fixes**
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Old 10-26-2011, 04:26 PM
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Whatu,
If you don't jumper the fuel pump relay (terminal 30 to 87), you may not ever show power back at the fuel pump. The fuel pump,if it's working, will only pump for about 3 seconds after you turn the key on. That is not really enough time to run back to the back and crawl under and position your test light. If you jumper the relay position, your pump, if it's working, will stay on until you remove the jumper. The 3 second thing is a safety feature that will turn off the fuel pump if the engine stops for any reason. (think of an accident in which you became unconscious).
How about letting us know your approximate location in the world? There are lots of folk on these forums that would really love to lend a hand to somebody starting out in one of these wonderful cars, but we need to know where you are.
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Old 10-26-2011, 06:51 PM
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Welcome to the forum, and the insanity that either leads to or results from 928 ownership.

Wise thing to do, and therefore never done, is to drain all the fluids, drop the tank and flush it out, pull all the plugs and squirt in a little ATF, then do a safety check to make sure all the fuel injection hoses don't need replacing before you put 50 psi gas in them.

Anyway stop pouring gas in the intake, drives me nuts and I don't have far to drive.
Old 10-26-2011, 09:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPDano View Post
Welcome to the Board. Your gonna get the same responses but clean the tank real good. Replace the Fuel Filter and possibly the fuel pumps if they are responding to jumping. Here is a link to a lot of issues already solved:

**MOST Common 928 Issues AND Fixes**
Thank you for that link. That is actually one of the first articles I read on these boards and it is partly why I joined. I like the knowledge that is available here. I think I will be replacing the pumps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stepson View Post
Whatu,
If you don't jumper the fuel pump relay (terminal 30 to 87), you may not ever show power back at the fuel pump. The fuel pump,if it's working, will only pump for about 3 seconds after you turn the key on. That is not really enough time to run back to the back and crawl under and position your test light. If you jumper the relay position, your pump, if it's working, will stay on until you remove the jumper. The 3 second thing is a safety feature that will turn off the fuel pump if the engine stops for any reason. (think of an accident in which you became unconscious).
How about letting us know your approximate location in the world? There are lots of folk on these forums that would really love to lend a hand to somebody starting out in one of these wonderful cars, but we need to know where you are.
I did jumper it and the test light showed no power. I also had my room mate turn the key and no power. I may not have been connected to a good ground. I will retry the connections now that the pump is out just to make sure I was not doing something incorrectly.

Also I am located in Oklahoma City.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danglerb View Post
Welcome to the forum, and the insanity that either leads to or results from 928 ownership.

Wise thing to do, and therefore never done, is to drain all the fluids, drop the tank and flush it out, pull all the plugs and squirt in a little ATF, then do a safety check to make sure all the fuel injection hoses don't need replacing before you put 50 psi gas in them.

Anyway stop pouring gas in the intake, drives me nuts and I don't have far to drive.
Thanks for the welcome. I come from working on Mitsubishi DSMs. I am used to insanity with cars but this whole Porsche thing is a completelly different world. This is also my first V8 car so there is a bunch that I need to learn.

And I checked all the fluids and they looked good. I had planned on flushing everything out but I wanted to see if I could get her to fire at all before spending $100-200 in fluids and such then the car not fire and it end up sitting while I troubleshoot. Now that I know I do have an issue I will be flushing and everything anyways. I wont be able to put any money into this car untill I do my breaks and change the rear cross member in my daily driver. 99 Dodge Avenger.

I saw on a 928 site there was a complete fuel line replacement kit and I was thinking of ordering that once I get the tank cleaned and have the money to start investing into the car.

And the gas thing was just to help verify that if there was fuel available that it would try to fire and to maybe help prime the fuel system. This may have been a rookie thing to do but I was extremely excited to hear her run. But it wont be done again.

Anyways I am a young guy and have a lot to learn. I have been working on cars since I first got a car when I was 16. It has been a hobby of mine ever since. I am self taught for the most part. I have had some help along the way with other forums and friends and for that I am thankfull. I am hoping to learn a lot on here and I am sure that there is more to learn on here than I will be able to in a year lol.

A bit of my history. I have owned 7 cars now since I was 16. I am 23 now. I owned a 93 Eagle Tallon non turbo, 90 plymouth laser FWD turbo, 90 Mitsubishi Eclipse AWD turbo, 90 Nissan 240 SX, 95 Dodge Neon, 99 Dodge Neon, 99 Dodge avenger, and now my 82 Porsche 928. The last 3 I still have. I blew a timing belt in my 93 Talon and it threw a valve through a piston. So I am very aware of the destruction a timing belt can cause and am thus very cautious with them. I inspected the 928 belt before I even turned the motor. I swapped the motor from my 90 Laser to the 90 Eclipse shell. My 90 240 was a POS rust bucket and I hit a curb in an ice storm and my front A-frame and front cross-member support broke in several pieces. The 95 Neon I wrecked the front end and it totaled the car. I had a motor in my garrage that I was going to rebuild and put into that car because the motor in it had a slight knock. Because of the motor I had I bought the 99 Neon for $400. It had spun a bearing and broke a rod in the #3 cyl. It was a DOHC motor whereas the one I had was a SOHC. So I took the DOHC head off the blown motor, had it rebuilt, and put it on the good block that I had and got a great running car for under $1000. This was the first major rebuild that I have taken on. Then it started having some issues, which I haven't been able to figure out to this day. It still sits in my driveway waiting for me to care enough to troubleshoot it. I then bought the 99 Avenger from my brother for $700. I have been lucky to get some good deals on all the cars that I have owned. Anyways thats my car history and mechanical background in a quick paragraph. I have done some freelance mechanic work on the side as well for friends and family that have given me some great experiences and knowledge. Just hoping that a lot of that can be applied to my newly aquired Porsche.

My 90 Exlipse GSX was my first project car. I was stupid for the fact that it was also my daily driver at the time. I will never make that mistake. Never mod your daily driver w/o a back up. I took it to the track not too long after I got it. Had only done a few mods to it and ran a 14.3 at 97mph if I remember correctly. And that was my first time at the track. The car was grinding 3rd gear and slipping on launches. Supprised I didnt break something that night. That car was totaled in a 4 car pile up while I was sitting stopped at a stop light. =( I think I have finally found a car that can replace the hole that was left when that car got totaled. I miss the turbo and I miss working on it.

Anywho, it is raining today so I probably wont be able to snap any pictures but I will get some as soon as I can.

Again thanks for the warm welcome! =)
Old 10-27-2011, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whatudrivin View Post

I did jumper it and the test light showed no power. I also had my room mate turn the key and no power. I may not have been connected to a good ground. I will retry the connections now that the pump is out just to make sure I was not doing something incorrectly.
This kinda sounds like a bad Ignition Switch. They are about $60 and another known issue with the 928's.


Quote:
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Thanks for the welcome. I come from working on Mitsubishi DSMs.
SWEET! I have a 1998 Mitsu Eclipse Spyder Turbo. Changing the TB and Balancer Belt was a byotch! I also rebuilt my Itty Bitty Turbo too. I think I posted it here too.
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Old 10-27-2011, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
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This kinda sounds like a bad Ignition Switch. They are about $60 and another known issue with the 928's.


SWEET! I have a 1998 Mitsu Eclipse Spyder Turbo. Changing the TB and Balancer Belt was a byotch! I also rebuilt my Itty Bitty Turbo too. I think I posted it here too.
Would the ingnition switch not allow the pump to turn on even if its jumpered? I thought if it was jumped at the relay that it would be bypassing the ignition switch.

Yes those can be a pain to replace. And they are a pain to replace the timing belt while motor is in the car.
Old 10-27-2011, 09:29 AM
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Cleaning the Tank is not as easy as one might think.
(1) Best way is to Remove it > then remove the Gauge and any inside Pump if it has one > This must be done carefully . Then take the Tank to a Radiator Shop and have it Boiled out .
Look for such a Shop before you start .
(2) OR Same as above ( Remove it > then remove the Gauge and any inside Pump if it has one > This must be done carefully .) Then with about 3 Gallons at a time Boiling Hot water with TSP in it pore into tank and slosh around and dump several times > Pressure wash and Wash and Wash and Wash until it runs the water out clear > No Pressure Washer ? go to self service Car wash and do the same .
***AFTER RE INSTALLING TANK WITH SAY 5 GALLONS OF GAS ***
(3) Remove Fuel Rail plug fit line to container Get Pump going with fresh Fuel in it and run Pump to Pump out all the Gas lines / Fuel rail's in to container > you will see rust and dirty fuel dump out
( other wise you just pump all that crud in to the injectors nice yes ? )
************************************************
Still no start ? will clean clean clean the Fuse panel / all fuse's Relay's PRONGS ( you must carefully remove them to clean them >> Green Corrosion on Panel ? Don't forget to pull the Panel loose and inspect / Clean the back side
still no start ? all the Grounds on the motor and Battery
bad Injector / pump Relay's
TIP: Small Brass brush > Starting Fluid > Compressed Air and Eraser for the fuse ends
now that should keep you busy until your next post

Last edited by aluminum; 10-27-2011 at 10:35 AM..
Old 10-27-2011, 10:30 AM
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You need to get the set of manuals Roger has at 928rus.com . One of the many things they contain are nice blow uppable wiring diagrams in .pdf files. I made a copy of the files I wanted and took a CD to Kinkos and had 17x34 prints made of a few different model years I work with.

Its not even 10am, so I am not awake enough to check wiring diagrams for you, but yes I think there is a good chance the bus the fuel pump relay gets power from was not energized either due to the ignition switch or perhaps an alarm system (old half dead, 100% buried alarm systems put a LOT of 928's on the side lines).
Old 10-27-2011, 10:35 AM
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What are the odds that the old gas has turned to goo in the injectors and clogged or froze them?
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Old 10-27-2011, 10:41 AM
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Yes, true true. I would start from the back forward on this one. Except, not a bad idea to get those Injectors Serviced and Flowmatched by Witchhunter.

My thread on that. $900 1983 US 928S The latest LEO928S

Witch Hunter Website: Actually had my Mitsu Eclipse and my 928S Injectors done here. Great results both times.

WitchHunter Performance - Injector Cleaning & Flow Testing Services
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Old 10-27-2011, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aluminum View Post
Cleaning the Tank is not as easy as one might think.
(1) Best way is to Remove it > then remove the Gauge and any inside Pump if it has one > This must be done carefully . Then take the Tank to a Radiator Shop and have it Boiled out .
Look for such a Shop before you start .
(2) OR Same as above ( Remove it > then remove the Gauge and any inside Pump if it has one > This must be done carefully .) Then with about 3 Gallons at a time Boiling Hot water with TSP in it pore into tank and slosh around and dump several times > Pressure wash and Wash and Wash and Wash until it runs the water out clear > No Pressure Washer ? go to self service Car wash and do the same .
***AFTER RE INSTALLING TANK WITH SAY 5 GALLONS OF GAS ***
(3) Remove Fuel Rail plug fit line to container Get Pump going with fresh Fuel in it and run Pump to Pump out all the Gas lines / Fuel rail's in to container > you will see rust and dirty fuel dump out
( other wise you just pump all that crud in to the injectors nice yes ? )
************************************************
Still no start ? will clean clean clean the Fuse panel / all fuse's Relay's PRONGS ( you must carefully remove them to clean them >> Green Corrosion on Panel ? Don't forget to pull the Panel loose and inspect / Clean the back side
still no start ? all the Grounds on the motor and Battery
bad Injector / pump Relay's
TIP: Small Brass brush > Starting Fluid > Compressed Air and Eraser for the fuse ends
now that should keep you busy until your next post
I havent looked up the steps to clean the tank yet so thank you for giving some insight into this. I know this is something I need to have done or do myself (which is what will probably happen.) That is why I have already started tearing apart the fuel system. I dont trust it. And thank you again for all of that other information. It will surely be useful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danglerb View Post
You need to get the set of manuals Roger has at 928rus.com . One of the many things they contain are nice blow uppable wiring diagrams in .pdf files. I made a copy of the files I wanted and took a CD to Kinkos and had 17x34 prints made of a few different model years I work with.

Its not even 10am, so I am not awake enough to check wiring diagrams for you, but yes I think there is a good chance the bus the fuel pump relay gets power from was not energized either due to the ignition switch or perhaps an alarm system (old half dead, 100% buried alarm systems put a LOT of 928's on the side lines).
I have downloaded the Wiring Diagram and Books from this site: Manuals and am going through them. Reading on what I am doing right now but will read more later. And I need to figure out if this car had the alarm system.... Is there a quick and easy way to check for this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete R View Post
What are the odds that the old gas has turned to goo in the injectors and clogged or froze them?
I am hoping this has not happened. It appears all the fuel receded from the lines and back into the tank.... Just dont know how long that took and what it left behind. I might take them out and clean them up a bit. Also would give me access to all my spark plugs then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MPDano View Post
Yes, true true. I would start from the back forward on this one. Except, not a bad idea to get those Injectors Serviced and Flowmatched by Witchhunter.

My thread on that. $900 1983 US 928S The latest LEO928S

Witch Hunter Website: Actually had my Mitsu Eclipse and my 928S Injectors done here. Great results both times.

WitchHunter Performance - Injector Cleaning & Flow Testing Services
I will check them out. Going to have to price it first. I don't have the spare cash flow to invest much into this car right now. I got lucky in being able to buy it like I did. I should be getting a raise at work soon which will allow me to fix my 2 daily drivers then start working on the 928. I am hoping this happens quickly because I want to hear this car run!!!

I honestly do not remember ever seeing one of these out on the roads around here. And if I did I dont remember. Are there many people on here from the Oklahoma City area?
Old 10-27-2011, 04:55 PM
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"I am hoping this has not happened. It appears all the fuel receded from the lines and back into the tank.... Just dont know how long that took and what it left behind. I might take them out and clean them up a bit. Also would give me access to all my spark plugs then.
"
The fuel Turns to Goo / Evaporates and the Like > You can't really take the injectors apart Much without damaging them . But you can do things > Once you get the Fuel Rail Pressurized with good Fuel ( all cleaned out now ) then with the Injectors Out (You need to replace the Little O Ring Seals anyway Pelican has them cheap ) But still hooked up to the Fuel Lines you can power them on and off with a small jumper wire and see if they are spraying Fuel . If Some Don't Tap them with a wood Hammer Handle or the like a few times Lightly and Keep Powering them and they Most often will Free up.
Personally I like to Get the Motor Running so you can drive the car and evaluate the entire Car before dumping money in the Motor so you know what you have .
Why put a lot of work and Money in to the engine then to discover the transmission / Clutch and Or just who Know what else is bad ? . With it running You can drive it a Bit and make a List of just what it needs >
You will discover a 928 is a very hard car to get running many times after they sit > many people fail and Give up > Porsche is a electrical nightmare so you must take your time and may need some help to trace down the faults > Look for someone in your area perhaps used to a 928
Manuals are a Big Help but they leave out " TECHNIC " Most Often.
For Example Many Porsche Shops Can't get a Long time 928 Started and just give up .
They wake up slow .

Last edited by aluminum; 10-27-2011 at 09:44 PM..
Old 10-27-2011, 09:41 PM
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WhatU,
There are several folk from up that way. Most of them are on RL (one of the other forums). RKD in OKC is from there. I think Jarrod Wise is up that way.

It is VERY important to check your test light and ground with a known power source before going on a search mission to locate power. Don't ask me how I know, but I will tell you that I'm not necessarily a fast learner.

Check also your fuel pump fuse. Actually remove it and clean the fuse holder as well. Then reinstall it. Use your test light to check both sides of the fuse holder.

You can bench test your fuel pump to be sure it works. While you have the fuel pump out, you can visually check the wires for visable problems.

Making sure the engine runs should be priority number 1. You can find out about the rest of the car once the engine runs.
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Old 10-27-2011, 10:10 PM
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That is exactly what I want to do. I want to get it running so I know what else I need to do to it. So I am hoping that I can clean up the fuel system and get it going.

How would I bench test the fuel pump? I dont want to put too much power to it and fry it.

And I did verify that my check light was working. Spent a few hours once checking things and getting pissed off then realized my check light had burnt out. Felt like a complete retard.

I know all about replacing those fuel injector o-rings. Had some problems caused by bad seals on one of my previous card. I am hoping that this baby isnt going to be too troublesome to get started. There isnt very much corrosion on the batt cables or jumper up front. I did notice some corrosion in a spark plug well. Like around the spark plug. I havent been able to inspect all of them as I havent taken apart my intake yet. I will be doing that either this weekend or next week sometime. Im not going to let this car get the better of me. It WILL run again. May take me 4 months to get it there..... but it will come back to life.
Old 10-28-2011, 06:26 AM
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Quote:
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How would I bench test the fuel pump? I dont want to put too much power to it and fry it.

12 volt pump, use 12 volts. There is also polarity signs near the spades (+ -)

Not sure if you have an In-tank pump too, but check that one also.
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Old 10-28-2011, 06:48 AM
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See I haven't been able to find any information about an in-tank pump so I don't know if I have one. But I will find out once I get the tank out and take it all apart. Do I need to worry about how many amps the power supply has or would a walmart adjustable power supply work? One you can get for like $10.
Old 10-28-2011, 08:21 AM
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To be safe, just use your car battery or someones car battery. Just put the pump on a towel and use jumper cables. A pump will just go in reverse if the polarity is switched, which is not a bad thing too since some pumps just get stuck and need a little help unsticking.
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Old 10-28-2011, 08:35 AM
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Ahhh ok. I might try and do that tonight. I'm hoping the pump is still good. It doesn't look to be in bad condition but looks are never a good way to determine stuff like that. Just hoping that it will pump.

And for future reference would the car be worth more with the factory 4.5 in it or with a 5.0 from an 85 model?
Old 10-28-2011, 10:57 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whatudrivin View Post
That is exactly what I want to do. I want to get it running so I know what else I need to do to it. So I am hoping that I can clean up the fuel system and get it going.
Quote:
Originally Posted by whatudrivin View Post
And for future reference would the car be worth more with the factory 4.5 in it or with a 5.0 from an 85 model?
Most Porsche people see almost any modification as a sign of low quality maintenance, as in what else did the PO do that will cost a load to fix correctly.

OTOH less than 8+/10 condition early 928's don't sell for a whole lot regardless. Best way to look at it is that for it to have any positive effect it needs to be totally turnkey.

Getting it running won't be all that revealing about what needs to be done. Get someone that has expert knowledge of the 928 to look it over with you and come up with a list of things to do, its much more experience and inspection than see how it drives.
Old 10-28-2011, 07:27 PM
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Old 10-28-2011, 07:27 PM
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