Questions about aluminum ball joints

[924CarreraGTP]

After an inspection of my 1983 928S 4.7 U.S. I realised that the VIN was before the introduction of steel lower ball joints. I used a magnet to check them and they are in fact aluminum. For reference I also checked my '84 and they are steel. I had a converation with another mechanic about it recently and he said that it wasn't that big of a deal on the 928s as much as it was on 944s.
Then I went through the factory workshop manual and read about how there are two different parts for this. One is the old style and one is the updated style, but it also says that the updated style with the new eccentrics should not be put in an older car. I have access to the lower steel units from an '85 but now I don't know if I should even replace them.
I would like to use my '83 928 for a few SCCA races this summer, but now I'm afraid to for fear of breaking the ball joints. Any experience from some of you very seasoned sharkophiles is in order. I just need to know if these '86 parts will work on my '83. Thanks in advance.

[Ethre]

Are you looking at page 40-20 in the WSM?

The ball joint from 86 on is different from the ball joint to 86 (which is different from the original aluminum ball joint on early cars). The ones from an 85 should work well though (with the correct eccentrics). I believe most people consider it a potential safety hazard to keep the aluminum ball joint.

[stepson]

You really need to get those AL ball joints replaced. Chuck Scheiber had one fail as he pulled into a parking lot. You just never knowwhen they WILL fail and they WILL fail.

928 341 049 08 up to '86 cars
928 341 049 12 '86.5 and up cars

You will need one set of new eccentrics. One of your existing eccentrics will work and one will not.

[MPDano]

Ughh, never checked on my 83. Now it looks like they more than likely are alum. We need a write up on the replacement to add to our common fixes.

[Dean_Fuller]

I have seen MORE that one fail...on the move. Very dangerous. I would change them ASAP.

[924CarreraGTP]

Originally Posted by MPDano

Ughh, never checked on my 83. Now it looks like they more than likely are alum. We need a write up on the replacement to add to our common fixes.

Yes we do. The car that I can get these parts from is an early 86 that's actually an 85. The year in the VIN is F. So these will work? I will need new eccentrics? Does anyone have the part numbers for what I need in the eccentrics? I have everything else complete from the early '86 car. Are you saying I will still need to buy new eccentrics even with the early '86 parts? Also, what tools do I need to pull the ball joints. Thanks for the advice.

[stepson]

For the steel ball joints, both eccentrics will be the same size.

two 928.341.049.12 ball joint supports
two 928.341.466.00 adjusting eccentrics
one 928.341.091.05 left bracket (this can actually be re-used, but the bolts are just left long)
one 928.341.092.05 right bracket(this can actually be re-used, but the bolts are just left long)
Two 12MM Nut 999-084-420-02

[Mrmerlin]

dont pass go swap em out before you drive the car,
if the lower joint fails it can take out the fender,
there will be no warning of failure ,
except you will find the front of the car sitting low and the tire flipped up into the fender ,

Refitting 2 steel lower BJs will require you to purchase 2 new eccentrics
2 of the old ones can be reused
Roger sells em

[mikebloomfield]

I changed these out last summer. As mentioned, you'l need two new eccentrics, two of the old eccentrics can be reused. You can reuse the bracket that holds them, but Porsche recommends changing them because more of the bracket bolt is exposed with the new steel carrier. It didn't look like a big deal to me.

I had trouble getting the nuts off, have plenty of PB around. I also needed a breaker bar.

I used a cheap harbor freight ball joint puller on one side, but on the other side the bolt that drives the jaws snapped and I had to go to the pickle fork. The pickle fork ruined the old ball joint boot, but so what.

You'll need an alignment after. The important thing is to get the car aligned close enough so you can drive it. You've got to drive it enough so that the suspension settles before getting it aligned. Mine was not settled, and I ended up having to get the car re-aligned a couple weeks later.

There are procedures on this site and rennlist using laser levels to get it close enough.

[MPDano]

How much was the total cost on both sides? I was looking at 928 Intl and each one is $134

Also, so this part number came up for the 78-86.5

Item Number : 928 341 049 12

[SanDiego928]

Originally Posted by MPDano

How much was the total cost on both sides? I was looking at 928 Intl and each one is $134

Also, so this part number came up for the 78-86.5

Item Number : 928 341 049 12

I was looking at the same p/n last night. I would like to know also - true cost.

I took a flashlight and a magnet to mine last night to check. I looked at PET diagram and tried to locate.

What exactly am I trying to do here. Lots of alum. stuff down there. Some steel bolts and nuts but everything else seems to be alum. (wishbone? - A arm?)

Thanks.

[mikebloomfield]

I just called Roger at 928s R Us and he set me up. He's well aware of the parts needed for the change and can give you a price for the whole set up. I believe I paid a little under $400 for all the parts for mine. I could be mistaken.

SanDiego928, do a search either here or at rennlist for "aluminum ball joints," there are plenty of pics. What you are looking for is the bottom ball joint carrier. So if you lay down next to the wheel, look for the thing that the eccentrics are screwed up to. This is the ball joint carrier. The aluminium ones look more like a figure 8 than the steel ones do.

[mikebloomfield]

Just to follow up: I was incorrect, the NEW ball joints look more like a figure 8, the old ones do not.

[924CarreraGTP]

Is it the aluminum carrier itself or the ball joint that breaks?

[Mrmerlin]

the stud pops out of the carrier thats attached to the LCA,

[924CarreraGTP]

I see. Well thanks all for the answers to my questions. I'll pick out some of these parts i.e. the carriers and concentrics from the '85 and order the other parts soon. I may still drive the car some, but I'll take it easy on it until I replace the parts. The early ball joints are surely still working in many original cars. I'll heed the warning, but I'm not going to let the car sit.

[mikebloomfield]

924CarreraGTP, that's a good plan.

The problem with this failure is that there's no warning. First, Porsche said to inspect the boots. Then they just changed them all together. I'm completely surprised that they didn't do a recall.

The only silver lining is that they appear to fail at low speeds, when there might be a greater load on the joint. Still, scary stuff.

Here's a thread that you might not want to look at until you've changed them over:

[mikebloomfield]

Whoops!

Please Heed the Aluminium Ball Joint Warning!!!

[MPDano]

I just saw a writeup by Wally Plumley that stated any 1983 VIN before 92ES860404 had aluminum ball joints.

My VIN begins with 920DS8xxxxx

I'm still going to check but it seems as my VIN is "After" and we're fitted with Steel Ball Joints.

[MPDano]

Check this out! Someone made a quick video of the removal. Anyone know where I can get this tool?