1985S dual distributors US or Euro ?

aluminum · 09-06-2014, 08:43 PM

Can I be enlightened if someone knows the Skinny
Looking at a 1885 928S and understand it has " dual distributors "
(1) So Questions : Does the 1985 S US Model have dual distributors ? Or only the Euro ?
( Or Both have them ? )
(2) How do you tell the S Model rather then the Non S Model for 1985 ?
Thanks Members in advance
(3) Finally What about the Non S Model for 1985 also has dual distributors ? or single ?

Landseer · 09-07-2014, 01:52 AM

85 and 86 were transition years as the 928 was being merged to a single world platform in 1987.
There are two main versions for 1985 as well as 1986, both of which are 928S.
Both have dual distributors because they use nearly same engine control system.
With the hoods open, you can type the difference just from the look of the intakes from 100 yards.

The 32V car has a pair of side plenums and cross pipes. Distributors are located on the right and left cam covers.

The 16V car is what we call the later (electronic fuel injection) Euro S, which for 84, 85 and 86 was a 16V car, having the traditional spider pipe intake, and a twin distributor located on the drivers side, front of engine. It is a single block with a pair of 944 4 cylinder distributor caps side by side.
If in USA, they were imported thru the DOT rules for grey market cars.

aluminum · 09-07-2014, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Landseer

85 and 86 were transition years as the 928 was being merged to a single world platform in 1987.
There are two main versions for 1985 as well as 1986, both of which are 928S.
Both have dual distributors because they use nearly same engine control system.
With the hoods open, you can type the difference just from the look of the intakes from 100 yards.

The 32V car has a pair of side plenums and cross pipes. Distributors are located on the right and left cam covers.

The 16V car is what we call the later (electronic fuel injection) Euro S, which for 84, 85 and 86 was a 16V car, having the traditional spider pipe intake, and a twin distributor located on the drivers side, front of engine. It is a single block with a pair of 944 4 cylinder distributor caps side by side.
If in USA, they were imported thru the DOT rules for grey market cars.

Thanks for Info ( I like the detailed Answer rather then the short Type answer )
So they do have a 16 Valve Motor also but only if it is a Euro then and the
" Distributors " are both on the Drivers side ! .
******
Question (1)
******
If the Car (1985 928 ) is Not a S Model will it have only 1 Distributors then ?

I have not viewed the Car yet and Its quite a drive so want to determined exactly what Model / Engine it is generally IE : Euro or not > S Model or not .
I Know you have good Knowledge of these Years ( 85 86 )
( I asked owner to send me Photos of the engine to view )
******
Question (2)
******
Car has 86 K Miles they say hummm
Car was said to run fine then .
what would be your suspicion ? One Cam drive front gear broke upon starting car when Starting
( I am thinking the Belt Broke or slipped and the Valves hitting something and so the Gear broke )
No Doubt this could result in major damage
But is it possible to brake this gear and not damage the Motor perhaps ?

Landseer · 10:45 AM

Post the pictures when you get them.

As said above, there are only 2 models, both designated 928S for those years.
There is no such thing has a "non-S" for those years.
Closest thing is a car with spoiler delete package. I actually have one of these, an 85 32V car with factory spoiler delete. its still an S though.

So, ALL 1985 and 1986 cars will have two distributors.

I'm not sure what you are saying --- are you saying the car ran well, then it didn't? They parked it, now they want to sell it? So its a non-runner, possibly with a broken timing belt? Forget the mileage ( 86K is a lot from a condition perspective ), if the car is non-running, it would have to be pristine to be worth more than $1500. Garaged since it broke? That's not what I mean. Pristine means perfect. At 86,000 it will need repair plus a full ancilliary refresh of everything outside the engine. Figure about $5000 parts + your labor; That is after fixing crashed valves. Head work is a very big expense on these cars because of the cost of the valves and the tediousness / length of the job of refreshing 32V heads. Remember, its very unusual for a well maintained car to suffer a timing belt failure. Oxymoron in fact.

You can assume if the timing belt broke that either version of the car has crashed valves. It is also possible for the cam end to break. Same outcome. It is also possible on the 32V car to loose the chain connecting the two camshafts on one of the banks. That will mean half the valves crashed, but since 32V, it still is 16. Am dealing with this situation right now on a 109,000 mile car.

Do not overpay for a non-running car. In fact, unless you really know what you are doing, proven, then don't even think about a non-runner.

If its running, well, different story. But not much different. its a a 40 year old german sports car, notoriously expensive to maintain. Most log a lot of miles in the hands of poor men, who don't maintain them, and who then try to get trophy money for them after they break them.

Parts cost on these has passed the point, for me at least, where its economical to pick one up cheap and refresh it to a daily driver status.

aluminum · 01:50 PM

[QUOTE=
Post the pictures when you get them.

As said above, there are only 2 models, both designated 928S for those years.
There is no such thing has a "non-S" for those years.
Closest thing is a car with spoiler delete package. I actually have one of these, an 85 32V car with factory spoiler delete. its still an S though.

So, ALL 1985 and 1986 cars will have two distributors. This help a lot
Received no Motor shots yet from the Guy yet
Say's in Ad , But who knows . Model designation: 928 S / 928 S2 (UK)
Seller says Dash is Good humm Say's Seats are Good hummm
I am skeptical , I am thinking parts car because of the non running and mention of broken Cam Gear . I am thinking the Motor may well be Junk .

By the way I have seen Thrust measured with dial indicator at the front Pulley .
run motor place in drive stop and take measurement after tapping pulley rearward .
Then Run Motor and place in reverse , stop motor , tap pry forward and take measurement. Also one can simply watch the pulley when running at Idle and have someone shift from forward to rearward to view any movement Stationary pointer
in place, Talking Automatic Transmission . What do you think of this as a field test .

Danglerb · 09-07-2014, 02:03 PM

Flat tire always a good sign.

85 there were two Euro models, a 16v and a low compression 32v for some smog markets. Many of the latter were palmed off on unsuspecting foreign buyers.

Wow I hate these pictures where you can't tell if it has a sunroof or not.

Landseer · 09-07-2014, 02:35 PM

That's right, I forgot about that fact, the 32 V car was sold in some Euro markets other than US, Canada and Japan during 85 and 86. Then, imported here. But its the 16V Euro that is the desireable version.

Fredfox · 09-07-2014, 03:26 PM

Looking at that picture, don't the side markers say euro?

DougM · 09-07-2014, 05:24 PM

No doubt a Euro. Side markers and no rear bumperettes. If it is an '85, it probably is a 16v dual dizzy.

stepson · 09-08-2014, 12:59 PM

If you want to buy it for parts, I have a friend who wants the wiring harness, computers, MAF, and injectors

stepson · 09-08-2014, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aluminum

But is it possible to brake this gear and not damage the Motor perhaps ?

Possible, but not likely if the cam gear is actually broken

Quote:

Originally Posted by Landseer

Do not overpay for a non-running car. In fact, unless you really know what you are doing, proven, then don't even think about a non-runner.

Truer words have never been spoken

Quote:

Originally Posted by DougM

No doubt a Euro. Side markers and no rear bumperettes. If it is an '85, it probably is a 16v dual dizzy.

The only way to know 100% if it's a Euro engine is to check the engine serial plate on the top front of the engine. Euro spec engine is M28/21 or M28/22.

aluminum · 09-09-2014, 12:39 PM

Still No Photos ? So I called the Seller again and asked aghain for the Photos of the Motor .
Here is a side Photo
does this look like a Euro ? or US Model ?
So It's possible it could be a 1985 Euro with a 16 V 300 HP Motor ?

aluminum · 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Landseer

85 and 86 were transition years as the 928 was being merged to a single world platfor

The 16V car is what we call the later (electronic fuel injection) Euro S, which for 84, 85 and 86 was a 16V car, having the traditional spider pipe intake, and a twin distributor located on the drivers side, front of engine. It is a single block with a pair of 944 4 cylinder distributor caps side by side.
If in USA, they were imported thru the DOT rules for grey market cars.

Talked to the Guy again on the Phone and he sent Photos but I don't receive them ?
However he did state to me during the Call that " BOTH DISTRIBUTORS " are on the Drivers side right next to each other .
So I guess Its a Euro Model 16 Valve Does that sound right ?
If so would that be the 300 HP motor during 1985 then I Guess ?
Question ? what would be the Block Number for the 1985 16 Valve Euro Motor on the top of the motor block I Guess in the normal place then to check for the right engine

DougM · 09-09-2014, 02:32 PM

Yes it is a Euro based on the pic unless someone went through the trouble of replacing both front fenders. Dual dizzy 16v motor has a single body distributor on the driver side bank with (2) 4-cyl caps. 310 hp motor.

Landseer · 09-09-2014, 05:52 PM

Yes, sounds like it is.

Now the question is does it run?

aluminum · 09-10-2014, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stepson

Possible, but not likely if the cam gear is actually broken

Truer words have never been spoken

The only way to know 100% if it's a Euro engine is to check the engine serial plate on the top front of the engine. Euro spec engine is M28/21 or M28/22.

Wops I Missed that Part of your Post Thanks
(The only way to know 100% if it's a Euro engine is to check the engine serial plate on the top front of the engine. Euro spec engine is M28/21 or M28/22.)
That's what I was looking for the Block Numbers one for Auto and One for Manual Trans .

ROG100 · 09-10-2014, 05:55 PM

S2 cars are ROW 16v 84 to 86 with twin dizzy's 310 HP

S3 cars are ROW/USA/CAN 32v also with twin dizzy's. Sold in 85 & 86 in the USA/CAN only and ROW 86 only

S2 ROW 86 16v cars have the S4 brakes & suspension - like the 86.5 USA/CAN cars

S3 ROW 86 32v cars have the S4 brakes & suspension also

aluminum · 09-11-2014, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROG100

S2 cars are ROW 16v 84 to 86 with twin dizzy's 310 HP

S3 cars are ROW/USA/CAN 32v also with twin dizzy's. Sold in 85 & 86 in the USA/CAN only and ROW 86 only

S2 ROW 86 16v cars have the S4 brakes & suspension - like the 86.5 USA/CAN cars

S3 ROW 86 32v cars have the S4 brakes & suspension also

**************
Wow no Kidding :
Quote : S3 cars are ROW/USA/CAN 32v also with twin dizzy's. Sold in 85 & 86 in the USA/CAN only and ROW 86 only
So the Twin Dizzy Distributor can also be found on the 32 valve Engine ? This is news to me
What is the Horse power of that Motor ? I have never seen a actual Photo of the motor .
So Most definitely that motor would be a Interference motor .
would like to see a photo of one of those motors with the twin dizzy .

ROG100 · 09-11-2014, 10:55 AM

Both the 16v and 32v are interference motors.

Both the 16v S2 and 32v S3 have two distributors.

32v distributor is mounted on the end of each camshaft.

16v has a twin distributor mounted in the same position as the single distributor on the earlier 16v cars

aluminum · 09-11-2014, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROG100

Both the 16v and 32v are interference motors.

Both the 16v S2 and 32v S3 have two distributors.

32v distributor is mounted on the end of each camshaft.

16v has a twin distributor mounted in the same position as the single distributor on the earlier 16v cars

Thanks Rodger : OK Got it only the Euro has the Dual Twin distributor on the Drivers side.
The 32 Valve distributor's are on both sides.
I was thinking that the 32 valve Motor was much more of a interference Motor then the 16 Valve Motor but I guess not .
What's your take / Guess on a Broken in Half Aluminum Camshaft Gear on a 1985 Euro 16 Valve Motor as to cause . ( Twin Dizzy Distributor on drivers side )
I Guess that's not a fair question lol .
How about is it possible / plausible to have a broken Cam Gear on such a motor without ruining the motor or causing heavy damage .
Or Most likely further heavy damage has occurred .