944 Timing Belt, Seals, and Gaskets

[Icey1174]

The Porsche dealer is charging me 8.5 hours of labor for a 1987 944 to change a water pump, timing/balance belts, and replace the seals and gaskets in the front end. Does this sound right? Sounds like a lot of time for someone that has all the tools, proper training, and experience. I can't get anyone else to touch it so I am stuck with the dealer. Not to mention the fact that it must be done right the first time.

Any input to the time charges???

[schwank]

Honestly, that sounds pretty close to correct if it includes all the front end seals.

[Icey1174]

Thanks. I never know what to think with some of the dealers. So far they seem decent. They don't seem real interested in telling you the cost of the repairs though. It's worse than pulling teeth. $1050 is the quote for all the parts and labor. They must be getting the parts cheap because the labor rate is $100/hr.

[soxnail]

Sounds right I just paid $1150.00 for the same thing.
Sox

[Icey1174]

COOL! I can't wait to NOT smell burning oil again! (Double negitives are OK when things are good)

[nize]

i do that myself. save money and learn.

[Icey1174]

If I had someone that knew what they were doing there to help with questions or problems then I would do it myself. I worry a little when "mechanics" refuse to work on the car. I am not a mechanic, but I can fix a lot of things. The timing belt can lead to major damage so I decided to leave that fix to the dealer. I think I could do it, but "thinking" and knowing are two different things.

[nize]

'mechanics' refuse to work on the car because they don't have the special tools required for the work, such as the tensioning tool to do the belts;
http://www.weissach.net/P9201.html

you can easily get all the info needed to work on your 951 online these days. ask all the questions you want on forums such as this one and rennlist, and refer to the online shop manual at clark's garage;
http://www.clarks-garage.com

[Icey1174]

Update: Prosche does not have a water pump in stock anywhere in the US. Had to get an after market. Hopefully it is ready tomorrow. Not a single strut assemby anywhere in the country either, Prosche or after market. This is a little frustrating. It would be nice to drive it sometime this summer. I am guessing it will not go so well in NY snow.

[nynor]

Originally posted by Icey1174
Update: Prosche does not have a water pump in stock anywhere in the US. Had to get an after market. Hopefully it is ready tomorrow. Not a single strut assemby anywhere in the country either, Prosche or after market. This is a little frustrating. It would be nice to drive it sometime this summer. I am guessing it will not go so well in NY snow.

where do you live?

[Icey1174]

Buffalo, NY. I called Porsche dealers on the East Cost that all said they checked the entier Porsche system, nothing in stock. They all said they had to order from Germany with a 12 business day wait on shipping.

[nynor]

um... did you try here, at pelicanparts?

[Icey1174]

Yes. They do not have strut assemblies either. I called yesterday to see why they were not shipped yet and they said they do not have them and that they have to come from Germany. They told me that I should be getting an email telling me that they do not have them. Our local Auto Zone has the driver side. I need the passenger side more so, but would like to get both of them.

[Icey1174]

Update: Porsche dealer called again. Now an 8 labor hour job has turned into 6 days. The problem the car was taken in for was leaking oil. I requested that all the cam gaskets and seals be replaced as well as all the front end seals. I was advised to have the t-belt and b-belt changed as well as the water pump more so as a PM and to take advantage of the labor time. The car starts and runs just fine, just some minor leaking oil! It does not lose a qt of oil over 3 months of driving. Just a pesky drip of oil on the exhust manifold that gives off some smoke ocassionally.

The dealer never ordered the water pump, that added a day. And I have to pay their over night fees for shipping.

The dealer also never ordered the new seals. So today the water pump gets here but they have no seals. So again I have to pay to have parts over nighted that will not be here till Monday. How did they think they were going to put it back together?

This job was scheduled 3 weeks out and no parts were ordered till the car was disassembled. This is very agravating at this point.

Now they tell me that there are leaks from the rear cam housing. I said ok, I thought you were fixing that per my initail request of repairs. They said no, they cannot fix it. How can the dealer not fix something? Is that possible?

Who knows what they have run the bill up to so far. But now I have a rebuilt water pump that is an after market water pump to begin with, two over night shipping charges for parts that could have been ordered from Germany and still have been here on time at no additional cost, and still no completion.

Is this normal for Porsche dealer service centers? It sounds outragous to me. At this point I am seriously thinking that I should have done the job myself.

I am willing to bet that the car is not ready on Monday. And even if it is, they already told me they cannot fix the problem that it was brought there to be serviced for.

Does anyone know anything about the "rear cam housing" leak? What do I need to do to fix it? They also said the rear main is leaking, but that was replaced 1 month and 200 miles ago. So I guess that sucks for me. They also said the rear ballance shaft seal is leaking as well as the head gasket. That sounds like a lot of work to repair. Wouldn't I notice a bad head gasket? There are no problems with the exhust, no water in the oil, no oil in the water, and it starts and runs runs just fine.

Any help from anyone that know what they are talking about??? The dealer is no help at all at this point.

[nize]

sounds like you're getting screwed by the dealer. this reminds me why i started working on my own car in the first place.

it's easy to check if a head gasket is bad, compression and leakdown test the cylinders. takes about 10 minutes per cylinder and very simple to do yourself with this $20 kit;
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=39224

can you clarify if they mean 'the rear of the cam cover' by 'rear cam housing' ? if so, it's a relatively easy fix (you have to replace the cam cover gasket) but it's labor-intensive. this is also part of a headgasket job as you must remove this part to get to the headgasket.

i'd pull the car out of there and do the work myself.

[87944turbo]

Here is where you need to go for information on the rear cam tower gasket (http://www.clarks-garage.com/shop-manual/cam-03.htm). It's a cork gasket (#9 in the diagram on Clark's) and very prone to leaks. Fortunately it is not too hard to replace, just a little tough to get to all of the bolts.

I would say the dealer has really had their way with you on this one. Are you negotiating any sort of discount for all of the delays and extra charges?

HG and rear balance shaft are a lot of work to repair. It's possible that your HG is leaking coolant and it is seeping out between the mating surfaces. I had one that was doing this and would not have know until I was under the car for something else and noticed the drip. Did not give any other signs and was such a slow leak that the drop in coolant level was hardly noticeable. I would go over there and have them show me exactly what they are talking about.

[Icey1174]

The cam gasket on the back looks and sounds easy enough for me to replace. Now I just have to find one. That seems to be the hard part. I do not lose any coolant, just minor oil leaks everywhere. I will not be going to the dealer for any more work, that's for sure. When they control a complete monopoly in your area they can do whatever they want. I have been to a dozen "mechanics" that "work on imports," but will not work on this basic 944. So I will be doing the work myself. Can you get the the rear ballance shaft seals from the back or do you have to take the shafts out of the car to get to them?

[nize]

is this a turbo or a n/a ? you might want to post the specs to your car for more accurate help on here.

[Icey1174]

N/A

[nize]

you might want to also post in the 944 forum on here;
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-924-944-968-technical-forum/

the gasket can be purchased easily right here from pelicanparts !