Cancer Spot...and Growing!...(Pics)

[fleetline51]

Hope I put this in the correct place!

Our '90 Carrera C4 is showing an area of body cancer right under the passenger side lower rubber windshield moulding.

This is bothersome to me, as it is definitely growing...slowly, but growing.

some pics here...









Has anyone here dealt with this? Should I attempt to repair it myself or just take it to a reputable auto-body shop and know that it was done right?

Any help with this issue would be greatly appreciated...Thanks Folks!

Tony

[KNS]

That's a common spot for the earlier cars as well, I had a similar spot repaired on my 1980 SC (a California and Arizona car). The body shop removed the windshield and repaired it for not a whole lot of money - came out great.

Don't let it go, get it fixed!

[porterdog]

It's definitely a screen-out repair; lots of photos around- could be the tip of the iceberg.

I'd seek professional help, but a body man I ain't...

[Vandit]

I've got a similar rust bubble on mine. My issue is that most shops tell me there's a really good chance of the windshield breaking on removal or reinstall, which would easily more than double up the cost of the repair. I think it's the next issue I tackle.

[gtroth]

Common on 993s as well. Corrected it on mine and a similar looking spot in the lower right corner of the rear window too.

[Turbolaal]

I had a small spot just like that on my 993 that needed fixed as well, take it to a good body shop and get it fixed before it spreads...the windshield does have to come out but if the body shop has done some other 911's I don't think the chance of breakage is that high...

[gtroth]

Yes, it's a must fix, particularly on the front since it will eventually leak into the passenger compartment. Carefully inspect the rear too so you can fix it at the same time if necessary and then repaint the whole top.
When they remove the windshield, they may break the antenna connection, btw.

Edit- oops. I just noticed the OP has a cab, so disregard the stuff about the rear window :-)

[GeorgeK]

Earlier you do it, cheaper it will be.
I had mine done this spring, and it was about 3 months from a big hole. As it turned out, some brazing, some lead and it is good now.
Removing the windshield has no reason to turn into breaking it. I have removed/ have had removed over 20 911 windshields in the last 20 years, and never broke one.

[fleetline51]

Thanks SO much for the speedy and informative comeback!

I WILL NOT hesitate to take action on this matter...This C4 is my Love!

My only reservation is ...How would I know if the body shop is capable of this repair?

Yeah, I know...Question the He!! out of them, etc., etc.

If anyone here can recommend a reputable and reasonable body shop that can
perform this repair in my area, I'd GREATLY appreciate any feedback.

I am in Hackensack, N.J. (North-East N.J.)

Thanks All!

[dad911]

Originally Posted by Fleetline51

.......
I am in Hackensack, N.J. (North-East N.J.)

Thanks All!

Since you're in NJ, If you want the best, bring it to Paterek Bros PATEREK BROTHERS

Also DJ's in morristown & Foreign Specialties in manville.

[aigel]

Originally Posted by GeorgeK

Removing the windshield has no reason to turn into breaking it. I have removed/ have had removed over 20 911 windshields in the last 20 years, and never broke one.

IMHO the shops say this so they don't have to pay for a new windshield in case they do mess it up (even if it rarely happens).

G

[Fixer]

That's an easy repair, you are lucky your car is white and not a metallic.
It will be easy to match.
Make sure the rust is removed completely, i just painted my '83 928S and dealt with areas like yours under the wing by media blasting to bare metal. That needs to be done in your case as well to be sure it never returns.

Beautiful C4 BTW.

[autobonrun]

I had rust fixed this summer at corner of my 993 window. I picked out a good body shop for the fix. They subcontracted the window removal and install. I got all new gaskets and seals.

Also the shop must keep one of the windows slightly cracked when they close the door after the fix. Otherwise the pressure can pop the new install up before it sets. I know.
After I picked my car up, I kept my window cracked when I closed the door a full week after the repair to insure everything set.

[Quadcammer]

Originally Posted by dad911

Since you're in NJ, If you want the best, bring it to Paterek Bros PATEREK BROTHERS

Also DJ's in morristown & Foreign Specialties in manville.

paterek wouldn't bother with this. They are too busy doing $400k 356 restorations.

[Fixer]

Do 3.2L Carreras have this rust in the screen frame problem, i never did, and i do not recall every hearing about or seeing rust develop there with 3.2L or SCs???

[Imcoz]

I think it's interesting to see this on a Cab. I have a 92 Cab with no sign of any rust around the windscreen. Porsche changed the windshield gasket starting with the 964s... me thinks the gasket is the cause, maybe holding moisture tightly under the flatter style seal.

[KNS]

Fixer,

That problem area in the windshield corners goes all the way back to 1965. Some cars have it, some don't. My 1980 SC spent its whole life in Socal and AZ and both lower corners had rust.

[aigel]

Originally Posted by KNS

Fixer,

That problem area in the windshield corners goes all the way back to 1965. Some cars have it, some don't. My 1980 SC spent its whole life in Socal and AZ and both lower corners had rust.

My feeling from reading the forums for years is that the 964 and 993 may be more prone due to the different style in gasket. It appears to be the first spot on the later air cooled cars that rusts in rust belt areas.

A big role in rust developing in this area is windshield service. If the windshield was out or replaced, often the tech doing the work scrapes out the old sealing material, compromising the paint. This gives rust an area of attack in a spot that traps moisture, road salt and grime.

G

[79BlueBird]

Sorry to see your ride with this common blemish. I also have 1990 964/C2 and repaired a handful of these when I did a complete repaint. I am second owner and my car was a California car to boot. I have also owned and operated an Auto Body shop here in the Atlanta suburbs for over 5 years (now closed, thanks to Obama).
Some things to remember as you embark on this repair:
1.) Strap in to spend some $. If you approach this from a (cheapest bidder) perspective your likely to get a bad or incomplete result. What you are seeing could be the tip of a small iceberg. An estimate is just that, don't be surprised if your final cost is higher or lower (yes some shops have a soul).
2.) Go to Porsche and buy a new windshield gasket and provide it to the body shop. Loads of reasons to do this, but suffice it to say you'll be happy you did. Saves a few $s, insures the proper part is used, and it will be obvious if this gasket is not used and your old one is put back in. If you have rock chips in the glass now is a good time to replace it.
3.) Find a reputable body shop that your local PCA has relations with. They have more to lose than you if they do this job and don't make you happy. When checking out shops, do it in person. If the shop tells you they have one of these and you get the tour, don’t see it, leave. This won’t be the last thing they are not honest with you about. Local mechanic shops usually know the pecking order for the local body shops. Warning! Just because a shop does high volume collision repair for insurance companies does not mean they are right for this job. This is not a replace and paint job. This requires a good bit of skill and technique.
4.) For paint, you'll want PPG Global line or better. You want to be guaranteed in writing that Primer coats, base coat, and clear coat are from the same PPG Global line. It is common for shops to use a low cost primer or clear product to make a few more dollars on materials. While this is good for them and often times it won't matter, this repair is a high stress repair and you want the full paint manufacturer’s warranty standing behind it in addition to the body shops own warranty. I say it is high stress because this surface takes impact each time you put the car in drive, is exposed to the sun, and has to deal with a heavy foreign material against it (the rubber gasket which can trap moisture, debris, and repel/deflect debris back onto this painted surface.
5.) Contrary to many posts in this thread, you should not expect that your cars current color is easily matched or is a standard color. The sun fades all colors and dissolves clear coats over time. It does this unevenly and any time it has the opportunity. Expect any reputable shop to recommend you "blend" the new color into the hood and tops of the adjoining fenders. I wouldn't do it any other way as you'd certainly notice the cowl panel if you tell them to just panel paint. ALSO, this is a good time to paint the entire hood and repair any rock chips. Its only marginally more $, but you'll be happy you did it after. If you do this, take a close up pic of the rock chips and agree that ALL are to be repaired. Techs are prone to miss one or two and you will want some way to address the issue if they do.
6.) You may want to be at the shop the day your glass is removed. Not only to see the care taken, likely by a sub glass guy, but to be sure they immediately tape and paper the opening twice over(once from outside, again from inside), then put plastic covering the interior where practical.
7.) You want them to blast this canker with(sand, bead, or soda) and the entire cowl panel where it meets the rubber AND the J channels in corners at cowl. This will uncover any hidden additional corrosion and provide an even surface to build up from. Fix it right, Fix it once!
8.) If there are pin holes or more substantial holes in the body at this site, you want them to either "lead them in" or fill them with weld and grind smooth. Insist they take a picture of the repair or call you to inspect prior to applying primer. Ask them how they will condition the metal surface prior to primer as well. Some shops use a metal conditioner, some an acid to get all the rust out at the molecular level. There is a cheap acid at the hardware store called Ospho Rust Inhibitor that works wonders!
9.) When ready for paint, you should remove your electrical switches (windows, tail, etc.) prior to paint. This is because the paint booth will "bake" your paint job somewhere close to 130 degrees or better. Well, that means its going to "bake" your whole car and everything inside it as well. With the age, some of your electric switches have become brittle or will after the bake and likely fail. You may save a few by keeping them out of the oven! Downdraft paint booths have a large hole in the floor with a grate over it for the air to be pulled from the ceiling down through the floor.
10.) Don't machine wash or power wash this area of your car for a solid two weeks to be sure the cure process is complete. Parking outside in the sun during this time will help get any extra solvents out and complete the cure process.

All the best.

[fleetline51]

Whew! Never thought that such a general post would have generated this much
comeback!

Thankful for havin' Ya'll give Your honest opinions...I am going to three local shops
in my area tomorrow with Our 964 and will proceed to ask for what is the only
answer to this problem:

What will it take to get this job done the RIGHT way, etc. , etc.

Thanks again to all who responded to this original posts and especially to those who
forwarded the tips and direction needed to get my Baby fixed RIGHT!

Best Regards,

Tony