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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYNick View Post
Agree completely Adam, and while there may not have been any Beetles in sight on those track, their parts were all over those 356's beating those Ferraris.

The Beetle is as much the heritage of the 356 as the 356 is to the 911. Ferdinand begat both.
I agree, true cousins, and yes the Dr. birthed both ideas, only one at the behest of the 3rd Reich. One was the car he was paid to build, the other was the car he dreamed to build.

----Adam


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Old 09-09-2018, 03:00 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #81 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by thamlin000 View Post
Someone earlier made a silly comment earlier about 996s running circles around 993s. Must have been a joke..... When I owned my 993 and drove my father’s 996 back to back, there is little to no difference in power and I’d say that the 996 handled slightly better. The overall layout, build quality, seats and driving experience of the 993 are far superior. The 996 is more modern and reliable. My father has had his 996 for 15 years and has had only minor unscheduled repairs. IMS issue is overblown btw.
A friend that works for Porsche said around the watercooler the 996 is known as the car that the account's built, and I thing things like the interior reflect this, among other things.

---Adam
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Old 09-09-2018, 03:13 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #82 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Unobtanium-inc View Post
It was weak and slow, when it was beating everything on the field and taking the checker? Ferrari, Osca, Maserati, Jaguar, you name it, they all got beat by a Porsche 356 and usually with 1/10th of the race budget.

Anyone who is confused by this should buy a copy of Excellence was Expected and take this winter and do some reading, you might come back understanding more about Porsche and why it is synonymous with winning, long before the 9 series were dominating, the 356's and 550's were cleaning the clock of everything on the track, and there wasn't a beetle in sight...

---Adam
I FIRMLY stand behind my comment that the 356 was both weak and slow when compared to its contemporaries of the day. Here is a list of sports cars of the 1950s, it shows 25 total sports cars of that era. It lists their horsepower, weight, and also their lb/hp ratio. The Porsche 356 is almost dead last in both hp and lb/hp categories. It comes in at 22 of 25 for total hp, and also 22 of 25 for lb/hp. What’s even more shocking is that the Porsche 356 has roughly 1/3 the horsepower of the top 10 on this list!!! And even less than that when compared to a few of the top cars on this list. Like I said, it was a very WEAK and SLOW car in comparison to its peers, no matter what metrics you use for comparison sake.

Old 09-09-2018, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by JMS935 View Post
I FIRMLY stand behind my comment that the 356 was both weak and slow when compared to its contemporaries of the day. Here is a list of sports cars of the 1950s, it shows 25 total sports cars of that era. It lists their horsepower, weight, and also their lb/hp ratio. The Porsche 356 is almost dead last in both hp and lb/hp categories. It comes in at 22 of 25 for total hp, and also 22 of 25 for lb/hp. What’s even more shocking is that the Porsche 356 has roughly 1/3 the horsepower of the top 10 on this list!!! And even less than that when compared to a few of the top cars on this list. Like I said, it was a very WEAK and SLOW car in comparison to its peers, no matter what metrics you use for comparison sake.

Yet somehow these "slow" old Porsches won the Targa Florio no less than 4 times. Checkered flags don't lie. If you've never pushed a 356 for all it's worth you just don't understand, and if you can't see why or how it beat so many other cars in the era you don't really understand the first thing about Porsche. That's why Porsche won, again and again, because they knew it wasn't all about HP, it was about building a better car in ways the competition couldn't even fathom, until they got sick of staring at tail lights.

My advice is get off the internet, buy a book, a good one like Excellence was Expected, and do some reading.

---Adam




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Old 09-09-2018, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by JMS935 View Post
I FIRMLY stand behind my comment that the 356 was both weak and slow when compared to its contemporaries of the day. Here is a list of sports cars of the 1950s, it shows 25 total sports cars of that era. It lists their horsepower, weight, and also their lb/hp ratio. The Porsche 356 is almost dead last in both hp and lb/hp categories. It comes in at 22 of 25 for total hp, and also 22 of 25 for lb/hp. What’s even more shocking is that the Porsche 356 has roughly 1/3 the horsepower of the top 10 on this list!!! And even less than that when compared to a few of the top cars on this list. Like I said, it was a very WEAK and SLOW car in comparison to its peers, no matter what metrics you use for comparison sake.

Maybe last in the hp and lb/hp but pretty sure it will beat half those cars around the track. Especially if you got a Carrera 4 cam. Porsche has always been about handling.
Old 09-09-2018, 05:29 PM
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Back when my next door neighbor lived in LA he used to "rally" over to Palm Springs. He would "race" his buddies in their Corvettes and Mustangs in his B coupe. He said he consistently got there first by 20-30 minutes. Probably a fish story and it was really only ten, but still...
Old 09-09-2018, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by billh1963 View Post

There are several types of (insert collector car here) buyers:
1. Tire kickers - fantasize about a car but never take action. They spend a lot of time and emotional energy (and use up other peoples time) but never buy. No car is ever right. A lot of them place WTB ads on the forums then basically disappear

2. Timid buyers (chicken *****s) - These are the guys who over analyze everything, worry about the price, and waffle over the decision. Once someone else buys the car they realize it was a good deal and then whine on the forums about how they could have had that car but someone else bought it out from under them

.

Speaking of buyers are really looking for excuses not to pull the trigger,
I know a guy who has been "shopping" for a mass market car for almost a year now.

I informed him of a local car, with a For Sale sign on it today.

To his credit, he called the seller.
But, he said the seller told him someone is coming to look at it.
That was all it took for him to close the lead, and give up.
In reality, if he was serious about buying a car, that wouldn't have meant squat.

It's so damn obvious when someone is not serious about a car.
I can smell it like an animal now, the slightest hesitation or excuse making,
and I stop wasting my time sending the guy leads. He's not a buyer.
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Last edited by sugarwood; 09-09-2018 at 06:04 PM..
Old 09-09-2018, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by sugarwood View Post
Speaking of buyers are really looking for excuses not to pull the trigger,
I know a guy whe has been "shopping" for a mass market car for almost a year now.

I sent him a local car, with a For Sale sign on it today.

He said the seller told him someone is coming to look at it.
That was all it took for him to close the lead.
In reality, if he was serious about buying a car, that wouldn't have meant squat.

It's so damn obvious when someone is not serious about a car.
I cam smell it like an animal now, the slightest hesitation or excuse making,
and I stop wasting my time sending the guy leads. He's not a buyer.
From a seller's perspective the guy who you know won't buy the car is the guy who asks a million questions, wants 20 more pictures, etc. That guy can never pull the trigger, it's the guy who asks, "Do you still have it and where do I pay?" That's the guy.

---Adam
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Old 09-09-2018, 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Unobtanium-inc View Post
From a seller's perspective the guy who you know won't buy the car is the guy who asks a million questions, wants 20 more pictures, etc. That guy can never pull the trigger, it's the guy who asks, "Do you still have it and where do I pay?" That's the guy.

---Adam
I hang up the phone politely or end email conversations on those types.
Old 09-09-2018, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by JMS935 View Post
I FIRMLY stand behind my comment that the 356 was both weak and slow when compared to its contemporaries of the day. Here is a list of sports cars of the 1950s, it shows 25 total sports cars of that era. It lists their horsepower, weight, and also their lb/hp ratio. The Porsche 356 is almost dead last in both hp and lb/hp categories. It comes in at 22 of 25 for total hp, and also 22 of 25 for lb/hp. What’s even more shocking is that the Porsche 356 has roughly 1/3 the horsepower of the top 10 on this list!!! And even less than that when compared to a few of the top cars on this list. Like I said, it was a very WEAK and SLOW car in comparison to its peers, no matter what metrics you use for comparison sake.
well, there are these things called corners, and when you are racing (not drag racing) you have to around/thru them. light, balanced cars with crisp handling can go around/thru said corners much faster than heavier, less balanced cars with inferior handling. that's fundamental. porsche learned this early and used it to their advantage on the track.

the '60's muscle cars from the US had massive HP and impressive power to weight ratios. but unless you're going stoplight to stoplight in a straight line, they kinda suck. put them on a tasty mountain road, and goodbye.

honest question, have you ever driven a 356? have you gotten comfortable with one and really pushed it thru corners? i would be surprised if you answer yes to both questions and feel the way you do if you ...
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Old 09-09-2018, 06:16 PM
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I hang up the phone politely or end email conversations on those types.
Me too. I don't date buyers. You want courtship? Not gonna happen and we ain't gonna do the deal.
Old 09-09-2018, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Unobtanium-inc View Post

I can't stand that picture above. Shameless.

Well, this is how the real picture is supposed to look, the full picture - and in that picture is the guy we all owe the Bug, the 356, the 911, and pretty much everything that Porsche ever did and took credit for. The magnificent Erwin Komenda. Interesting how the Porsche family has conveniently "cut" him from pretty much everything.

Old 09-09-2018, 07:51 PM
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And not only did Komenda do the Bug, the 356, and the 911 (and the 904) - he even did the Porsche crest and badge. Porsche is pretty shameless in not naming him in pretty much everything.
Old 09-09-2018, 07:55 PM
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And not only did Komenda do the Bug, the 356, and the 911 (and the 904) - he even did the Porsche crest and badge. Porsche is pretty shameless in not naming him in pretty much everything.
His family feels the same way, they are currently suing Porsche.

http://www.manager-magazin.de/unternehmen/autoindustrie/porsche-kein-geld-von-porsche-fuer-tochter-eines-ex-designers-a-1220325.html

Here is some history on the badge.

---Adam


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Last edited by Unobtanium-inc; 09-09-2018 at 08:38 PM..
Old 09-09-2018, 08:33 PM
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Speaking of buyers are really looking for excuses not to pull the trigger,
I know a guy who has been "shopping" for a mass market car for almost a year now.
How is old Itza doing??
Old 09-09-2018, 09:34 PM
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(+1 Matt. We must've been typing at the same time.)
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Are those pics from soapbox derby races?!?!
Old 09-09-2018, 10:06 PM
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Here is some history on the badge.
What history?
Do you think anyone can actually read that?
What was the point of posting that photo?
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Old 09-10-2018, 06:05 AM
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Are those pics from soapbox derby races?!?!
The 356 might be the 2nd ugliest car I've ever seen.
(The ugliest is the slantnose Fiero 3.2)

The photo of those cute clown cars racing is cute
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Old 09-10-2018, 06:07 AM
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The 356 might be the 2nd ugliest car I've ever seen.
(The ugliest is the slantnose Fiero 3.2)

The photo of those cute clown cars racing is cute
Would the third ugliest be the 911/912 then as they are very “borrowed” from the 356?
Old 09-10-2018, 06:30 AM
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What history?
Do you think anyone can actually read that?
What was the point of posting that photo?
Settle down sticky wood. The napkin is on my office wall, so I couldn't take a close up until this morning when I got back to the shop.

---Adam


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Old 09-10-2018, 07:44 AM
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