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gearhead
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Loverland, CO
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Porsche no longer provides engine number on what used to be called a COA. If you give them the number they will confirm it, but a 2.7 in a 1973 chassis is generally not going to be one. You can. I convert a 2.4 to a 2.7 when rebuilding a 73, but it didn’t sound to me like this car was one. I only quickly read the ad and didn’t even see the COA.
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Old 07-06-2019, 05:33 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #141 (permalink)
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The old version is the COA that actually shows the serial numbers, while the new version is called Porsche Product Specifications, which only says whether it’s numbers matching or not. The one in this auction says it’s ‘numbers matching’ but on a COA, so that is a bit confusing to me as well. But I’m still confused by the non-authentic question above. Unless he meant non numbers matching instead, cause non authentic means not authentic. Not authentic means it’s a fake, a replica, which Porsche couldn’t provide any records on since they didn’t build it. What a mind f*ck this is...
Old 07-06-2019, 05:53 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #142 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
Porsche no longer provides engine number on what used to be called a COA. If you give them the number they will confirm it, but a 2.7 in a 1973 chassis is generally not going to be one. You can. I convert a 2.4 to a 2.7 when rebuilding a 73, but it didnít sound to me like this car was one. I only quickly read the ad and didnít even see the COA.
1973.5 is a 2.7 correct?
Old 07-06-2019, 06:00 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #143 (permalink)
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Porsche no longer will confirm your numbers for you with that process. Your car needs to go into one of 8? Porsche classics centers and you pay them for an inspection and they will provide you with a document as part of the inspection that verifies whether your numbers are matching or not. I’m thinking the document is mailed to you and not given to you on the spot
Old 07-06-2019, 06:02 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #144 (permalink)
gearhead
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathanbs View Post
1973.5 is a 2.7 correct?
No, itís a 2.4. But it is the first of the 7R cases. And itís CIS.
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Old 07-06-2019, 06:02 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #145 (permalink)
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If a 2.7 wasn’t the original engine, then how is it numbers matching? And how is it numbers matching on the older version COA that would only provide the numbers without telling you whether it matches or not? I feel like we’re playing who’s on first...
Old 07-06-2019, 06:13 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #146 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMS935 View Post
If a 2.7 wasnít the original engine, then how is it numbers matching? And how is it numbers matching on the older version COA that would only provide the numbers without telling you whether it matches or not? I feel like weíre playing whoís on first...
You can, with some difficulty, rebuild a 2.4 (7r) block into a 2.7L displacement. Technically, you'd have a "matching numbers" engine. Not saying that's what happened here, but it's possible.
Old 07-06-2019, 07:14 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #147 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mocker View Post
You can, with some difficulty, rebuild a 2.4 (7r) block into a 2.7L displacement. Technically, you'd have a "matching numbers" engine. Not saying that's what happened here, but it's possible.
That might explain it. Thanks Mocker.
Old 07-06-2019, 07:21 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #148 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mocker View Post
You can, with some difficulty, rebuild a 2.4 (7r) block into a 2.7L displacement. Technically, you'd have a "matching numbers" engine. Not saying that's what happened here, but it's possible.
Yes, it requires machining the case ďspigotsĒ and heads to fit the larger cylinders. Straightforward but pricey. I did it to the 2.4 I owned in the 70s. Big improvement.
Old 07-06-2019, 08:02 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #149 (permalink)
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When Porsche offered a COA on longhoods you usually got the original engine number plus the options, and if you were lucky they got it correct. Often the transmission number was listed as unknown.
Now the only way to get confirmation is to give them the engine and transmission numbers when it is submitted.
The only way that Porsche will put the original engine number on the Porsche Product Specifications sheet is if the person who submitted it somehow had the original engine number and gave it to them.
The '73 Targa has a unstamped case, so the seller had some way of knowing the original engine number.
Old 07-06-2019, 08:04 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #150 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arbee View Post
When Porsche offered a COA on longhoods you usually got the original engine number plus the options, and if you were lucky they got it correct. Often the transmission number was listed as unknown.
Now the only way to get confirmation is to give them the engine and transmission numbers when it is submitted.
The only way that Porsche will put the original engine number on the Porsche Product Specifications sheet is if the person who submitted it somehow had the original engine number and gave it to them.
The '73 Targa has a unstamped case, so the seller had some way of knowing the original engine number.
Well if the case is not stamped then it canít match anything. Call me confused again, Iím not following.
Old 07-06-2019, 08:15 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #151 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arbee View Post
When Porsche offered a COA on longhoods you usually got the original engine number plus the options, and if you were lucky they got it correct. Often the transmission number was listed as unknown.
Now the only way to get confirmation is to give them the engine and transmission numbers when it is submitted.
The only way that Porsche will put the original engine number on the Porsche Product Specifications sheet is if the person who submitted it somehow had the original engine number and gave it to them.
The '73 Targa has a unstamped case, so the seller had some way of knowing the original engine number.
Please see my reply above as the method you describe is no longer the case
Old 07-06-2019, 08:25 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #152 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
No, itís a 2.4. But it is the first of the 7R cases. And itís CIS.
Oh weird, I always thought it was a 2.7 CIS
Old 07-06-2019, 08:26 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #153 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by JMS935 View Post
Well if the case is not stamped then it canít match anything. Call me confused again, Iím not following.
Wow that BAT sales ad is intentionally vague then
Old 07-06-2019, 08:28 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #154 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by nathanbs View Post
Wow that BAT sales ad is intentionally vague then
So if I pick up the ball and throw it to first, who gets the ball? Naturally.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kTcRRaXV-fg

Sometimes it just doesnít make sense, whether itís intentional or not, who knows. Wait heís on first base.
Old 07-06-2019, 08:58 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #155 (permalink)
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Amazed there is so much confusion. The car in question would have originally had a 2.4 not a 2.7. it now has a blank case 2.7 with low pressure and knocking sound. The COA in the listing only says matching numbers because the car came with info of the original engine number so the owner applied that (pointlessly) to the COA
Old 07-06-2019, 11:08 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #156 (permalink)
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confused

Sorry for the confusion re the wording " non authentic", for some reason I was under the impression that if a car was not a numbers matching car Porsche would not issue a Cert of Authenticity. Hence my choice of the words "not Authentic" I wasn't trying to knock the car.
Old 07-07-2019, 06:32 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #157 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Jim deCordova View Post
Sorry for the confusion re the wording " non authentic", for some reason I was under the impression that if a car was not a numbers matching car Porsche would not issue a Cert of Authenticity. Hence my choice of the words "not Authentic" I wasn't trying to knock the car.
Ah. Got it. You meant not original.
Old 07-07-2019, 07:11 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #158 (permalink)
gearhead
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
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At this point, this is really here nor there on this car, but even unstamped factory replacement cases still have a pro date on them, which would allow us to tell if a case was originally supplied from Porsche with the spigots machined for 2.4 or 2.7l.

On the driver side, 101 case, it's above the oil return tube, between 2&3.



On the passenger side it's more forward, under the number 6 cylinder.




That circle contains a week and year that will tell you when the cases were actually cast. Often they don't have the same week to them, but as long as the mating number up top matches then they were machined together as a pair prior to leaving the factory.

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Old 07-07-2019, 11:25 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #159 (permalink)
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With regards to the 83 SC coupe that sold last week for $37 plus fees....

Jul 11 at 1:39 PM
gandyman 10
I donít know if heís a dealer, but I do know heís a dbag. He started by texting pictures of his yellow McLaren. Then got slippery when I asked him the location of the car so I could get a PPI before I wired him the money. Now has ghosted completely. NO SALE. Silly me for thiking BAT vetted sellers at all.




This was the car that had only moved 2 miles in 13 years according to the carfax and records, yet the seller claimed he drove it 50 to 75 miles over the last 3/4 years.
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Old 07-11-2019, 09:52 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #160 (permalink)
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