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Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
Denmark doesn't have a border with America and its drug problem. The guns are there to protect the drug trade, both of which are illegal.
That is also my understanding of the situation here and have always wonders why gun laws were talked about when dealing with violence in the USA instead of the failed drug war, since we all know guns and gun laws will not solve the problem as witnessed by observing places like Mexico, seems if we really cared about violence here we should focus on the reason instead of the symptom?
Old 11-15-2019, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by sm70911 View Post
-Denmark is not a transit hub for the drug trade.
-Police and security services in Denmark have a higher standard of living so corruption and compromised investigation of corruption is far less commonplace.
-Education in Denmark is of a very high standard.
-Denmark is bordered by countries where gun purchase and sales is extremely restrictive.

- Mexico is a poor country that borders the richest country with the highest drug consumption per capita
- Local and Federal Police are poorly paid so corruption is rampant. Drug sellers can kill Police officials and their families without fear of reprisals.
- Class sizes, and teachers low pay in Mexico means education standards are low.
-Mexico has a long a porous border with the USA (irrespective of the 'wall'), the smuggling infrastructure is very well established and financed.
- The USA, Mexico's neighbour has almost 400 million guns, with more being built and sold daily.
I agree, gun laws are not the issue.
Old 11-15-2019, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by ficke View Post
I agree, gun laws are not the issue.
Quite patently they are, especially if we want Children to go to school in safety.
Old 11-15-2019, 07:21 AM
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Originally Posted by sm70911 View Post
Quite patently they are, especially if we want Children to go to school in safety.
I want our kids to be safe in school and...Ö. even out of school, I will virtue signal better than that and want people over 21 to be safe even if they do not go to school.

I believe decriminalizing drugs and addiction will do more to that goal than all the gun laws put together.
Old 11-15-2019, 08:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ficke View Post
That is also my understanding of the situation here and have always wonders why gun laws were talked about when dealing with violence in the USA instead of the failed drug war, since we all know guns and gun laws will not solve the problem as witnessed by observing places like Mexico, seems if we really cared about violence here we should focus on the reason instead of the symptom?
How many of those AR-15s being used in Mexico have "Made in USA" stamped on them? It's not an either or. They both are the problem. If the gun brokers in America didn't have the guns to trade or sell to the cartels it would make it more difficult, wouldn't it?
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Old 11-15-2019, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
How many of those AR-15s being used in Mexico have "Made in USA" stamped on them? It's not an either or. They both are the problem. If the gun brokers in America didn't have the guns to trade or sell to the cartels it would make it more difficult, wouldn't it?
True,

The Mexican government use the "guns from the US" to get money and support from the US. But the actual volume we have seen is from China, AK's by the ton in sea air crates is what is the most common. corrupt police who use US supplied AR's is another and from their own government G3's and now AR's.
Small time guys come to the states and buy weapons and smuggle them to Mexico.
The big dogs do not bother with the US for weapon supplies, just not enough volume and not the right weapons. There are much easier ways, especially for the automatic weapons, grenade launchers etc. The real military stuff the cartels are actually using.
Here is a good article on this subject,

https://worldview.stratfor.com/article/mexicos-gun-supply-and-90-percent-myth
Old 11-15-2019, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by ficke View Post
. . .

I believe decriminalizing drugs and addiction will do more to that goal than all the gun laws put together.
A big hell ya' from me on that, IckyFicke! The absurdity, and downright hypocrisy of the USA drug laws and punishments is probably one of the primary causes of most of our problems here.
Old 11-15-2019, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ficke View Post
True,

The Mexican government use the "guns from the US" to get money and support from the US. But the actual volume we have seen is from China, AK's by the ton in sea air crates is what is the most common. corrupt police who use US supplied AR's is another and from their own government G3's and now AR's.
Small time guys come to the states and buy weapons and smuggle them to Mexico.
The big dogs do not bother with the US for weapon supplies, just not enough volume and not the right weapons. There are much easier ways, especially for the automatic weapons, grenade launchers etc. The real military stuff the cartels are actually using.
Here is a good article on this subject,

https://worldview.stratfor.com/article/mexicos-gun-supply-and-90-percent-myth
So your argument is that strict gun laws don't work to reduce gun violence, but cite an example where those gun laws aren't being effectively being enforced in any reasonable way?

Do the Mexicans also have teenage boys walking into their high schools on a regular basis killing their classmates and themselves like we do here? Or are the strict laws actually keeping the guns out of the hands of kids down there because only the criminals and law enforcement have them?
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Old 11-15-2019, 10:25 AM
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I think you miss understand my point, focusing on gun laws is taking away from the issue, it is dealing with the symptom and not the problem. You always play catch up that way and will never get a head of the issue. Yes strict gun laws, that are enforced, are important but I think to much time energy and money is spent there because it is easier than addressing the real problems.

These students were killed by the police which is just as bad as being killed by other students, who can you trust down there? Schools are not safer places there
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Iguala_mass_kidnapping
Old 11-15-2019, 11:14 AM
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US drug and gun laws are not why Mexico is messed up, the do not help Mexico but they are a not the problem, Mexico is Mexico's problem.
Old 11-15-2019, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by ficke View Post
US drug and gun laws are not why Mexico is messed up, the do not help Mexico but they are a not the problem, Mexico is Mexico's problem.
Your opening statement was meant to show that strict guns laws don’t work. From there we delved into just how complex Mexico’s problems really are. All you have actually shown is that there is no one problem and have done nothing to prove that guns aren’t a part of that group of problems.
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Old 11-15-2019, 11:25 AM
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Denmark yes, Mexico no, as far as impact on our hobby goes.
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Old 11-15-2019, 11:54 AM
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Don’t tread on me. Cold dead hand.
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Old 11-15-2019, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
How many of those AR-15s being used in Mexico have "Made in USA" stamped on them? It's not an either or. They both are the problem. If the gun brokers in America didn't have the guns to trade or sell to the cartels it would make it more difficult, wouldn't it?
Yea, how many of those ARs were supplied by the obama administration? And from what I have read, AKs are the weapons of choice for the drug cartels
Old 11-16-2019, 10:39 AM
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Yea, how many of those ARs were supplied by the obama administration? And from what I have read, AKs are the weapons of choice for the drug cartels


"The Obama administration" ... They need you writing the orange clowns twitter feed. Perhaps next time there's a way you can spuriously mention Kenya 😂😂😂
Old 11-16-2019, 11:22 AM
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I wondered how long until my little land mine caught someone in the F&F trap.
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Old 11-16-2019, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by sm70911 View Post


"The Obama administration" ... They need you writing the orange clowns twitter feed. Perhaps next time there's a way you can spuriously mention Kenya 😂😂😂
Trap, it is a fact that it happed. Funny, while you scream Orange Man bad, you benefit from the results of his policies, from cheaper gas prices to people earning and spending more money Again. It is already illegal for a 15 old to own a gun, it is also illegal to shoot people without just cause. There is a reason typically the highest crime rates occur in liberal controled Gun Free zones. Look at the crime rates in liberal run cities, they consider not enforcing the law as a way to reduce crime rates.


https://thehill.com/opinion/katie-pavlich/323995-pavlich-failure-of-fast-and-furious

https://www.speroforum.com/a/PXMPKLASXK18/78438-Despite-Eric-Holders-claims-violent-crime-increased-under-Obama#.XdBqBbdOnqs
Old 11-16-2019, 01:35 PM
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Presidente Cheeto is a criminal and a crook. I don’t care if we have the best economy in hostory( which we don’t, manufacturing is actually in recession) he still has no place in the Oval Office. Criminals belong in prison.
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Old 11-16-2019, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
Presidente Cheeto is a criminal and a crook. I donít care if we have the best economy in hostory( which we donít, manufacturing is actually in recession) he still has no place in the Oval Office. Criminals belong in prison.
Yep, nothing justifies having a lump of human excrement in charge - wouldn't matter who the steaming pile was. Unfortunately, we seem to have long standing wood for choosing filth to lead us - really strange.
Old 11-16-2019, 02:03 PM
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[QUOTE=Racerbvd;10659584]Trap, it is a fact that it happed. Funny, while you scream Orange Man bad, you benefit from the results of his policies, from cheaper gas prices to people earning and spending more money Again. It is already illegal for a 15 old to own a gun, it is also illegal to shoot people without just cause. There is a reason typically the highest crime rates occur in liberal controled Gun Free zones. Look at the crime rates in liberal run cities, they consider not enforcing the law as a way to reduce crime rates.


https://thehill.com/opinion/katie-pavlich/323995-pavlich-failure-of-fast-and-furious

https://www.speroforum.com/a/PXMPKLASXK18/78438-Despite-Eric-Holders-claims-violent-crime-increased-under-Obama#.XdBqBbdOnqs[/QUOTE

This post is disturbing. I think you should reconsider it.
Old 11-16-2019, 02:09 PM
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