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This I assume is one of the 2.7 Carrera Targas and was for sale in Switzerland recently. The full matching cloth interior was option number M392 which could be in Tweed or Tartan. It also has the headlight washers which was amother of the options on the 25 anniversary model. Seams to have a sticker where the plaque should be so again assume it was removed by the original owner especially if it had his name on it.




Guy
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Old 10-21-2010, 02:52 PM
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So what is the difference between tweed and tartan? I'm thinking tartan means plaid, like klits and tweed is what the weave is on my interior. I have a tweed jacket in my closet and it isn't plaid.
Old 10-21-2010, 05:29 PM
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Well , I don't have any factory 1976 period literature showing a sample of tweed. So i'll have to go with everyone elses word on it (does anyone have any various year 1974 - 77 interior samples with factory names ?). And I have not seen that material in any other color but the blue w/ white accents like in the Silver Anniversaries (but it would make sense that they would have other shades).

Here is the original tartan seats in 1976 Carrera 2.7 / 660 9041 :


Old 10-21-2010, 07:14 PM
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g911,

I missed that photo of your badge before (and your previous post stating it was # C 2 ) , that IS a strange brew ?? As not only my first question upon seeing that is..... what is a letter "C" doing in that spot.... but I would have thought that since there was a run of 400 ROW cars. That dash badges would have started out being stamped with 001 ? (germans are very precise that way) . So what is a number 'C 2' , was Helmut drunk ?

Again , a bit bizzarre.

I agree , as Gwhite said , there is a very good chance that the name stamped there is the original owner of both cars , as who else would put it there ?

(I cannot read that name by the way).

I'm curious , as to a clue of where your car spent time in DE . It that a DE Sticker on the windshield ? How about a close up sometime ?

I would sure like to talk to an original owner of one of these cars, to see how they were acquired . Did you have to know someone ..... just exactly what the deal was ?

By the way , here are a couple other cloth insert materials that were available in 1976.

(This first one , courtesy of the Carrera 3.0 website / in the UK 1976-77 Carrera 3.0 Brochure. A photo of a Cork interior car with pinstripe velour cloth . This same cloth was available in ROW thru at least 1981 . As I had the same material in Black w/ white pin's in a ROW 1981 928) :


You have to look hard / enlarge , but that's what's there.


And GEE , i just noticed something. Isn't that a coincidence , although pleated - the cloth material continues up into the headrest area - JUST LIKE YOURS . And that's a factory photo (i'd take out one of your seats , and inspect the upolstery construction underneeth , it just might end up being original). :




Here's another pattern cloth that might have been available in 1976 (just depends whether these inserts have been changed , but I have a feeling not) . This 1976 Carrera 3.0 Targa was also at Lutziger's in CH , in the last year or so :








__________________________________________________ _________________________________

g911 , does your car have Thermostatic Heater Control ?

Last edited by RatBox; 10-21-2010 at 08:38 PM..
Old 10-21-2010, 07:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RatBox View Post
Here is the original tartan seats in 1976 Carrera 2.7 / 660 9041 :

RatBox, are you sure that is for 660 9041? It seems like 660 9041 has black interior (at least now). See photos at Porsche Restauration - FREISINGER MOTORSPORT
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Old 10-22-2010, 12:17 AM
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Hi,

The Tartan interior car is 911 660 9043 and is for sale asking price $110,000

Here is a page from the 1976 model year 'standard colours' chart showing that the cloth options available were Tweed (as in the 25th anniversary cars) or Tartan which came in three variations. It can be seen from the chart that some combinations had the headrest in leatherette and others in cloth. There is also a 'special colours' chart but I don't have a copy of this.



The information I had from Porsche on g911's car was interior code 15 which is black leatherette with Tweed seat centres and black leatherette headrests.

9116609043 is code 37 cinnamon leatherette with beige Tartan seat centres.

Guy
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Last edited by GWhite; 10-22-2010 at 02:43 AM..
Old 10-22-2010, 12:47 AM
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Yes, Thx for pointing out my mistake. I had photo's saved of 660 9043 (the chocolate brown/T3T3 car) from when it had late model leather 928 electric seats in it. When I added a couple more photo's of the interior after a later owner had re-installed the original seats (original , but recovered by the factory in 1986). I mis-marked them. Unfortunately as you can see in that same photo above , they did not also return the door pockets to the original light tan carpeted versions w/cinnamon leatherette trim that would have originally come with that interior. I dont know if they've been replaced by now, but those are full black leatherette trimed pockets

Here's a photo of 660 9043 in Germany with it's German owner Steffen Martin from sometime in the 1980's (i don't know if he was the original owner , but I don't believe so. As he wrote the factory to inquire about the car in 1982) :




__________________________________________________ __________________________________


Thx GWhite, for posting that interior chart . About that pinstriped velour material on the seat inserts of the UK brochure car. It could have been a pre-production version , as that happened alot for promotional photo's as i'm sure you know. Myself , I've never seen that material in a production 911 before , until 1978 - 79 time period , and on ROW cars only (or having any style cloth material into the headrests with the pleated style bolsters) . Now that I think hard on it , I believe the Euro 928 with the pinstripe velour I had mentioned prior was actually a 1979 MY (that was in the mid 80's , a fairly long stretch ago. And those days were ALOT of partying !!).

Anyway, it would be nice to see the interior special colors / materials chart. By chance, do you (or anyone) have a 1976 exterior colors chart , with special order metallics ?

Anyone know what "twill" side bolster / headrest material looks like ?

Did anyone notice , that the swiss 25th anniversary Carrera Targa, has the über rare solid targa cover ?

Last edited by RatBox; 10-22-2010 at 06:30 AM..
Old 10-22-2010, 05:30 AM
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Hi RatBox,

This is a photo of one of the seats from my '74 Carrera which has Shetland seat centres with Twill bolsters and headrests.



I have a '77 Special Colours brochure which I think are the same as '76, will try and post the images from it.

Guy
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Old 10-22-2010, 07:17 AM
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Thx again GWhite , so very nice of you.


If by chance, you also have an option list of available options for 1976 MY , and hopefully it would show something regarding applicable time frame / model year.

I'm digging into the origin of these 1976 cars , and I had a bit of info. given to me
a couple years ago. Which might be tied to it. It should be an option list which can be verified of being applicable to 1976 model year 911 , or even more specifically 1976 Carrera (although a 1976 option list probably covers both, & might even include 930).
Old 10-22-2010, 10:00 AM
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So what about the 1976 Signature series cars? Do people in Europe find those cars interesting as well? About 5 years ago, we had one and couldn't find a buyer for it as a complete car at most any price. Eventually it was sold as a rolling chassis and cut in half for a trade show display booth.
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Old 10-22-2010, 10:00 AM
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RatBox,

Here is the 1977 'Special Colours' chart:



And a link to a website with the options list (German dated 1/9/75) for 1976 models:

http://home.nordnet.fr/~nn-adsl-2923/froggy/doc/gerprice1976.pdf

I hope this information is of use to you, the German options list shows what options came as standard for each model but only refers to the Carrera 3.0 not Carrera 2.7. Of note is that tinted glass was not standard on the German Carrera 3 so the only options on the 'sonderseries' 1976 that were different to the Carrera 3 were no electric windows and no automatic heating unless added as an option. Also of note is that no mention is made in the German options list of M473 which was the front and rear spoilers so I think possibly all of the '76 Carrera 2.7's came without and they were added afterwards?


Matt,

I am not familiar with the 'Signature' series so might not have been marketed in the UK.

Guy
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Old 10-22-2010, 02:57 PM
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Thx for the special colors chart Gwhite ,

I have had this 1976 price list for a couple years, that I got from this 1975 Carrera 2.7 site . But I do not think it has all available options ? Only most , for instance M473 as you said. M473 was definately an option on a 1976 Carrera 3.0. I think most are there , maybe i'm wrong, but i'm thinking some are not.
If M473 is missing , what else is ?

I'm looking for a complete options list for 1976 from M00X - M6XX (whatever they had). I have some various lists from close years (like 73). But since the factory could change a meaning for a option number (and you never know when it took effect) , the only way you know for sure is to have it spelled out in the text of the document . Like being dated , or a statement / title like : '197X model year' / '1976 modell jahre'. Plus a new option could have be added if your referencing an older list.

And again I don't have a 76 list. I think there is a 1975 , non - downloadable , options list on his site also. But you do not know if the M numbers have the same meaning the next year. And I'm not sure all options are there anyway as it's not a factory document.

Thx as always. I am really enjoying looking at the color chart. And I especially like having the codes & the various lanquage spellings.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________

On that price list, I've always been confused by / and not understood the "Nicht in Verbind. " column ???

You know what that means / how to read it ? I'm getting 'not binding' as a translation. But for one, is verbind. a complete german word ? .

If anyone knows how to interpret it , and can explain - please do.

Last edited by RatBox; 10-22-2010 at 05:57 PM..
Old 10-22-2010, 04:51 PM
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Hi RatBox,

The column means that you can't have that option in combination with any of those in those other options. For instance you can't have a rear wiper M425 if you have air conditioning option M399 or M559 because the radiator takes up the space where the wiper motor would be.

Guy
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Last edited by GWhite; 10-26-2010 at 08:30 AM..
Old 10-22-2010, 09:48 PM
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Thanks to all for the valuable information. I know the owner of # 50 and have been trying to help in its restoration. This vehicle is a numbers matching, non sunroof, silver on black car that has been sitting indoors for 20 plus years and is begging to be restored.

A factory certificate has not been obtained yet, but a good deal of information has been discovered. The vehicle was imported in 1976 and is mostly true to its original form. Older photos of the car show it with a front and rear (two vent grille) spoiler. The front valance has been replaced since the earliest photos, but the vehicle appears to be factory equipped for fog lamps.

Gwhite's information has given us more to go on that months of searching the internet in vain. Any additional information or resources that can be posted would be greatly appreciated.
Old 10-25-2010, 11:20 PM
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Hi 'sduser'

I see #50 was the subject of a thread last year by a poster in San Diego, is that your owner friend?

I am glad that I have posted some information that is of use in the restoration of the car and please feel free to ask for any further help.

I run the Porsche Club GB Register for the 1974-1977 911's but I don't have knowledge of any of the 1976 Carrera 2.7 being in the UK. We do however have the last (#518) of the 74/75 Carrera 2.7 Coupes here and from this thread maybe #84 of the '76 cars has been sold to someone here.

Guy
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Old 10-26-2010, 10:54 AM
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What information are you seeking sduser ?

As far as a 930 3.0 / Carrera 3.0 , two grill type tail being used originally . It's always a possibility. But this is a very gray area .

As to date , so far , from what information I have been able to find. No car has even been verified by the factory to have been built with option M473 !

And the only factory information on the cars in general. Is a letter written in 1982 to the current owner at the time of 660 9043 (Steffen Martin / pictured above) from some factory representatives.....here's where the road starts twisting even more....

The letter (from Porsche representatitives in DE : K. Barels & E. Maier / dated 23.04.1982) ...states :

"Gleichzeitig wurde dieses Sondermodell serienmässig mit Stabilisatoren vorne und hinten, Sperrdifferential , Sportlenkrad usw. ausgestattet"

(translation) :

Simultaneously, this special model fitted with stabilizers front and rear, limited slip differential, sport steering wheel, etc. equipped
__________________________________________________ ____________

Yet, so far to date , of multiple DE & US based build reports on examples of 1976 Carrera 2.7 cars. All reports i've viewed have not metioned spoilers OR spoilers delete. AND there are many examples with standard rear deck lids in existance.

(Besides the fact that you have to assume that the term 'stabilizers' used by the factory representatives above , was used in place of the more commonly used term spoilers).

So the only thing so far that is 100% known to be standard on these cars is a 911/83 motor , a sport 3 spoke thick grip steering wheel , and 5 speed trans type 915/49 (it SEEMS always with M220 / limited slip).

As to spoilers being fitted originally to these cars, it's a complete quandry. My quess so far , is that the majority came without (maybe all - only time & research will tell hopefully).

So what is really needed , is a trip to the factory records room. Or a conversation with an original owner , or person who was involved with procuring one of these cars originally.

My suggestion , since you said the car was imported (i'm assuming you mean to the U.S.) in 1976 . Try to find that person who imported it . And see if he was the original owner , or can lead you to them. If you find out anything significant , please post it here.

Last edited by RatBox; 10-26-2010 at 11:40 AM..
Old 10-26-2010, 11:35 AM
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Hi RatBox,

Appears it's really complicated working out what is fitted to a car even with the COA which only lists items fitted over and above standard items for the model and country. For instance there is no mention of spoilers on the COA for my Carrera 3. This is because it was supplied as a UK 'sport' model which featured the spoilers, Bilstein dampers, sports seats and 7&8x15 Fuchs for the '76 model year and 6&7x16 for '77.
The UK price lists I have mention the spoilers as an option so the fact that the German one does not suggests to me that they weren't available, I have read that this is the case but thought it only applied to the Ducktail but maybe it also applied to the later whaletail. I have also read somewhere that the '76 Carrera 2.7 was only supplied in Germany and Switzerland, maybe ones supplied here could be specified with spoilers.

Guy
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Old 10-26-2010, 02:01 PM
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Manual windows
can't really tell what the seial number on the tranny is. I can see a partial that looks like 12 716 9743
Old 10-26-2010, 04:23 PM
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another angle
Old 10-26-2010, 04:24 PM
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Here's the window decal you were asking about.

Old 10-26-2010, 04:27 PM
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