77 911s Targa for sale? maybe

[PK 77 911]

Well this is not an easy post for me to write. I have decided to sell one of my jewels.
I am looking for help on value. I had originally thought 10k but with reading some of the post here I think I may be under valuing it.

So here goes

Engine and Transmission work all done in last 8000k by me, my mechanic actually. He does 90% of all old Porsche work in the City.

Original 2.7L

-All Case work, Certs, studs, line bore etc.
-Nikasil cylinders
-all bearings
-Heads, valves, guides, seals
-Transmission rebuild including shift fork
-Clutch and flywheel
-Master brake Cylinder
-Turbo Tie Rods
-Rebuilt Steering rack
-New Koni Reds
-SSi exhaust
-Cam Savers installed
-New Wires
-Fuel Pump
-Short Shift Kit
-Targa Top recovered.

Plus few other things I have forgotten I am sure. It all ads up to $11,000.00 I know that.

Silver Paint is 10 years old very shinny from 2 feet away, A few nicks from being my daily summer driver.

-Tires are Bridgestone Potenzas with 70%
-Black Interior with cloth inserts is OK with no rips or tears. Could be nicer with a little do it yourself work, I may even do it myself.

Negatives
Needs a new dash.
Has phone dial 15" rims.
Needs one H4 head light lens.

Unfortunately, I do not have receipts for the work. A PPI inspection and a conversation with the shop is welcome and will reveal all major work.

Car runs awesome.

I sell either the 77 S or my 84 Cab 3.2. I am just going through an upgrade on the 84' with SW Chip, Pre Muffler, Sport exhaust to try and wake it up. I want the part throttle power to feel like the 77.

The car is in Victoria BC. I have owned it 8 years.

Thanks
PK

[christiandk]

From the info and the pictures 10K seems about right for the car - give or take.........

[Matt Monson]

Knowing pretty much all the major players in the Vancouver market I have a hard time believing any one of them gets 90% of the air cooled engine work. You are going to need to name names. And explain why there are no reciepts. Both those things hurt the value unless you can properly explain the situation.

[PK 77 911]

Victoria, not Vancouver.

[Matt Monson]

Ok, Victoria. Wouldn't be surprised if there was only one guy out there. Doesn't mean he's any good though.

I'm not trying to be a jerk here. I am just pointing out that your details are slightly cryptic and buyers don't like cryptic. They want details and facts. And asking us to value your car missing such details and facts puts us at a distinct disadvantage in our ability to help you price and market your car. We're a helpful bunch here, but help us to help you...

[Bristol]

The main issue with the middies is the engine and it seems like you've addressed that as well as fixed a ton of other stuff. That engine should be good to go for another 150K miles! I would get a letter from the shop verifying that the work was done as well as current compression and leak down numbers. That should help relieve any fears from the buyer. I don't see the wheels as a negative, they look good. The wing doesn't do it for me, but that's personal taste. With the engine and trans work I would price the car more around $15K to $20K and be patient to find the right buyer. $10K would be more appropriate for a driver in rough condition that has NOT had all of that work done.

Kirk

[PK 77 911]

The shop in Victoria has been rebuilding these 30 for years. Evaluation has to be given based on the fact that I don't have receipts. It is what it is.

I may be able to dig up emails from the fellow that did the case work. He is in the Seattle area and is on the board, at least was in 2006. He was recommended by people on the board. I also have pictures with the engine out and at the shop as well.

A PPI should tell the story at this moment. If someone had work done 20,000 miles ago does that make everything still right? In theory I guess it should be.

I purchased the car with 260,000.00 KM on it. I knew it needed a rebuild when I purchased it.


Thanks

[christiandk]

Sell it for 10K if you get a snappy offer - I would - the market is hyperinfalted, and the car looks shady. Sorry to say. I suppose that the car does not come with manual/servicebooklet!?

Cheers,

Christian

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by PK 77 911

The shop in Victoria has been rebuilding these 30 for years. Evaluation has to be given based on the fact that I don't have receipts. It is what it is.

My comment was a hypothetical comment and not an attack on the actual shop. How long has Motormeister been rebuilding engines? It becomes a lot easier if we know who it is versus some anonymous shop.

[Bristol]

Wow, I still don't see how this is a $10K car... I think that a 74-77 that has had the engine issues addressed should be worth at least the lower part of the market for a SC - $15K, and more if it's a really clean car. This car looks pretty clean to me, at least I have seen a LOT worse for $10K.

You guys have helped me though! I've got a '75 Targa that is one of my projects. About 1-1/2 years ago I had all of the machine shop work done on the engine, including case savers/inserts, valve guides, valve grind, rod size, etc. I had moved out of state for a new job at the time and my wife picked the engine parts up from the shop for me. In the process she misplaced the receipt. I always figured that we'd dig it up sometime after the move. I never have found it. After reading this post I called the shop and sure enough they still had the records in their computer and immediately e-mailed me a PDF copy of the receipt. Maybe I can sleep better now. I will personally be rebuilding my engine and I will make sure to take LOTS of pictures and keep all of the parts receipts to show the next owner that the rebuild was done right...

PK 77 911, maybe you should contact the shop that did the work and see if they still have computer records. Having a receipt for that $11K expense sure seems like it would help you with this sale!

Kirk

[COLB]

10K Euro maybe. 10k in dollars would be giving it away.

If you got the engine work done recently (8000 km ago?) I would expect the shop still has a record. Most places keep records of work.

Have you tried to get a copy of the work order or receipt?

Even without it, a strong running middie with good cosmetics (not perfect), no rust, and no major needs is a 13-15k car.

If done properly, the transmission rebuild should be apparent in a test drive, as would the other visible components. PPI, leakdown, get a copy of the engine workorder, and you are easy over 15k.

[Unobtanium-inc]

I think $10k (that's US dollars) is not far off for a car that has very undesirable non-original wheels, a cracked dash, worn paint, an add-on tail, odd non-original seats and needs some TLC items like headlight lens replacement. These cars aren't climbing over $15k (sorry Colb) unless they are original, original, original ... and very clean. -- Matt

[Matt Monson]

I don't consider all middies equal. '74-75 are more interesting and valuable than '76-77, by $2-3k for equal condition cars. I think this '77 is a $10k car. Add another couple grand if some records and a more cohesive story emerges.

[PK 77 911]

Thanks all for your input. Some real interesting points of view here.

Horse trading was done for the work. That is why no receipts. We can all figure it out from there. Any serious buyer can go to the shop or call for confirmation. There is no shady story, The paint is excellent with a few nicks and such from driving.

If a beater / ok driver is worth 10k how can one with all this work done be worth 10K?

Is a receipt worth more than a good PPI?

Not trying to be argumentative or defending my car, just trying to get to a real # to ask for the car be it on Pelican or Ebay or at home. Seems like there is a lot of fixation on the records. We are not talking about a 40K car here. Just a whole heck of a lot of fun for the $.

Keep the comments coming.

PK

[CountD]

1) Lose the tail - sell it to someone who wants it
2) Lose the wheels - sell them to someone who wants to period correct their 3.2 Carrera
3) Put some stock period '77 black leatherette seats in it
4) Last, but certainly not least, put the correct Fuchs on it, or if you cannot afford or find those, do cookie cutters...

And then ask $13.5K

[SilberUrS6]

Originally Posted by CountD

1) Lose the tail - sell it to someone who wants it
2) Lose the wheels - sell them to someone who wants to period correct their 3.2 Carrera
3) Put some stock period '77 black leatherette seats in it
4) Last, but certainly not least, put the correct Fuchs on it, or if you cannot afford or find those, do cookie cutters...

And then ask $13.5K

Yup, this is the right answer.

To the OP, the car is worth more than $10k. To the *market*, the car is not worth much more than that. Not $15k, by any stretch.

[PK 77 911]

excellent advice. thanks. any thoughts on turning the targa bar back to stainless

[G450X]

I'd say at least $15k given the condition and engine/transmission work, any less is a give away of sorts. The SSI's are worth $1k as a stand alone, you could part it and make over $10k! '77's have a few upgrades over earlier impact bumper cars (better 915, galvanized chassis). A Canadian 911 may have less emissions nonsense to deal with (?), the big detractor of the series.

I know many people (myself included) who said that about 356's -they are souped up VW's (mainly because of the engine & sound - pushrod flat 4 low power) I doubt they will ever appreciates much - especially the mid 356"B" series. At least 911's have a real exotic engine with nothing in common with any VW...

In many ways the '74 - '77 models are the 356B of the 911 line. It will take more time, but they will appreciate as other models are priced out of the "working mans" budget. I know alot of people trash talked SC's - and guess what, they are heading north in value as well.

Sorry to carry on a bit here...

[Matt Monson]

Something that hasn't been mentioned, and which I think warrants mentioning is location. My valuation of the car is a $US price selling the car down into the States. If you market it locally or nationally within Canada the car will absolutely bring a couple thousand more in the domestic market. There are much fewer good cars up there and it is expensive to bring one in from the States. It is that old rule of supply and demand and a car that would sell for $10k here in Colorado or California will carry a premium north of our border where there are much fewer examples to chose from. You will make the most on this car if you sell it in Canada.

[PK 77 911]

Well the 77 went on trade to a friend. I traded the 77" 911 and a really nice 86 535is that I had far a nice 2000 e39 M5. Value wise... $13,000.00 for the 911 and 5K for the Bimmer. New owner is having tons of fun with, he is a mechanic by trade and fixing the little things I didn't even know where wrong. Turn the page and now I can concentrate on the 84' Cab.

Again thanks for all the input.