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shh-the robot is sleeping
 
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Thoughts on price for an ‘88 911

I do not have any pictures yet as I am hung up on the firm asking price and the car is not officially for sale. I hope you will use your collective imagination to point me int he right direction. These are the vital stats:

- ‘88 Guards Red on Black
- 68K
- Every record since new. Current owner for last 17 years with one prior owner
- one mechanic for past 25 years.
- All original paint... every panel and bumper.
- 4 years and 6K ago: Full engine rebuild due to broken head studs, “refreshed” mechanically including all common electrical sensors, rebuild of all calipers/brakes/hoses, axle shafts, clutch, flywheel, AC, suspension... Asked to be made mechanically as new with no expense spared on all OE parts. $23K spent on refresh (all records)
- factory front and rear spoiler, sunroof, regular non-sport seats
- car is as close to original and perfect as can be expected.

Firm at $50k....

This is about $10K more than I wanted to spend but would pursue it if it is a sound “investment.” Thoughts are much appreciated.
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'88 911 Coupe, 69k miles

Last edited by da Vinci Dan; 12-21-2017 at 02:05 PM..
Old 12-21-2017, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by da Vinci Dan View Post
I do not have any pictures yet as I am hung up on the firm asking price and the car is not officially for sale. I hope you will use your collective imagination to point me int he right direction. These are the vital stats:

- ‘88 Guards Red on Black
- 68K
- Every record since new. Current owner for last 17 years with one prior owner
- one mechanic for past 25 years.
- All original paint... every panel and bumper.
- 4 years and 6K ago: Full engine rebuild due to broken head studs, “refreshed” mechanically including all common electrical sensors, rebuild of all calipers/brakes/hoses, axle shafts, clutch, flywheel, AC, suspension... Asked to be made mechanically as new with no expense spared on all OE parts. $23K spent on refresh (all records)
- factory front and rear spoiler, sunroof, regular non-sport seats
- car is as close to original and perfect as can be expected.

Firm at $50k....

This is about $10K more than I wanted to spend but would pursue it if it is a sound “investment.” Thoughts are much appreciated.
You're missing the big picture. These are not investments.

See that $23K spent ? The one spending that could be you or anyone here for that matter.
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I can't afford that.
Old 12-21-2017, 04:04 PM
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Firm at 50K? Well - you can always throw out a "Firm at 40K" offer to see if they are interested. Negotiations are strategic.

My take on investment is this - I don't perceive to make any money on driving an old 911 - HOWEVER - I can almost guarantee I wont lose as much of my overall investment as compared to a (say) Toyota RAV4 in 5 years.. I say almost - because it is an old car and there is some shoddy workmanship floating around - but if the engine was done by competent mechanic -I wouldn't be too worried..
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1981 911SC
Old 12-21-2017, 04:24 PM
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I'd be worried. You'd pay that kind of money so you wouldn't have to do anything to the car for years. Porsches like that hardly exist.

It's true that most classic cars don't depreciate at anywhere near the rate as new or newer cars....this is one of the reasons why I drive them. But I never, ever consider them investments. That is, to make me money. It's a rare one that does.

My goal has always not to lose money on them, not including maintenance. At $50K you're top of the market.
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Old 12-21-2017, 04:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYNick View Post

My goal has always not to lose money on them, not including maintenance. At $50K you're top of the market.
+1

Also -(Goes without saying) Get a PPI.
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Old 12-21-2017, 05:19 PM
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very top of the market for an average car. Lots of these cars exist with similar history mileage etc. As others have said it isn't an investment as a hobbyist, only if you are a dealer or speculator. If it is EXACTLY what you want try to get him down some, at mid- upper 40s you wont be hurt on a nice car that you want.......however if you truly want an investment only Porsche then search for lower mileage more original(no motor rebuild) vehicle as close to factory original as possible. The best old car hobby saying is....."buy what you like"
Old 12-21-2017, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by da Vinci Dan View Post


Firm at $50k....

This is about $10K more than I wanted to spend but would pursue it if it is a sound “investment.” Thoughts are much appreciated.
50K is 10K more than you should spend.
Like others have said, this is not "investing"
but "smart buying" is more of the goal.
Old 12-21-2017, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by ficke View Post
50K is 10K more than you should spend.
Like others have said, this is not "investing"
but "smart buying" is more of the goal.

Sad part is I don't follow my own smart money goals..I find myself wanting to spend more and more on an old car... which I know I wont get back out of it..

Just bought a MOMO Steering wheel for Christmas (which I did not need).

Its a disease...
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Old 12-21-2017, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by High Life View Post
Sad part is I don't follow my own smart money goals..I find myself wanting to spend more and more on an old car... which I know I wont get back out of it..

Just bought a MOMO Steering wheel for Christmas (which I did not need).

Its a disease...
True,
What I like about this 'Porsche market place' is it helps keep me some what connected to the real time values so I do not go to crazey spending in satisfying my wants and hopefully I can do the same for others. We are a sounding board here, a self help group.

"I like Porsches" I say that a lot, this is what my wife thinks I sound like
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMNry4PE93Y
Old 12-22-2017, 05:41 AM
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In my mind these cars are not $50,000 cars..... auction season is about to begin there are usually at least 10 Carreras and SC up for auction at the various houses. I tend to think they provide an insight into real world pricing.

I recently bought a 1986 915, 3.2L Carrera. It is a solid 3 car w/ 78,000 miles. A sport oriented car, it is very dry, equipped with sport seats, spoilers as well as sunroof delete. In its lifetime owned by a pelican it came with H4s, Alpine radio/Amp and a proper Euro suspension set-up otherwise stock. Currently, in excellent knit, CarFax history included a minor parking lot scrape and is still in need of three small repairs (Cig lighter, Windshield Washer, Cruise control) that I know of. Four owner with minimal documentation, strong enthusiast / Brad Penn ownership for the last 10yrs, purchased off Pelican Classifieds. It drives well and pulls strong...... Could drive cross country or do a spirited rally (think CA Targa) as purchased..... still has not been touched by a mechanic.

Purchase Price: $34,000, another $1,000 for Taxes and Tags.... all in $35,000.

The question most carrera owners struggle with is what is the G50 premium....... I have owned both 915 & G50, to me the premium shows no value.....

The next question what was the Guards Red discount...... Sport Seats, spoilers and especially the Sunroof delete out weighed the G Red.....

Disappointment: No Limited Slip. (but we have Matt for that)

Old 12-22-2017, 06:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Macroni View Post
In my mind these cars are not $50,000 cars..... auction season is about to begin there are usually at least 10 Carreras and SC up for auction at the various houses. I tend to think they provide an insight into real world pricing.

I recently bought a 1986 915, 3.2L Carrera. It is a solid 3 car w/ 78,000 miles. A sport oriented car, it is very dry, equipped with sport seats, spoilers as well as sunroof delete. In its lifetime owned by a pelican it came with H4s, Alpine radio/Amp and a proper Euro suspension set-up otherwise stock. Currently, in excellent knit, CarFax history included a minor parking lot scrape and is still in need of three small repairs (Cig lighter, Windshield Washer, Cruise control) that I know of. Four owner with minimal documentation, strong enthusiast / Brad Penn ownership for the last 10yrs, purchased off Pelican Classifieds. It drives well and pulls strong...... Could drive cross country or do a spirited rally (think CA Targa) as purchased..... still has not been touched by a mechanic.

Purchase Price: $34,000, another $1,000 for Taxes and Tags.... all in $35,000.

The question most carrera owners struggle with is what is the G50 premium....... I have owned both 915 & G50, to me the premium shows no value.....

The next question what was the Guards Red discount...... Sport Seats, spoilers and especially the Sunroof delete out weighed the G Red.....

Disappointment: No Limited Slip. (but we have Matt for that)

This my friend, was a great deal. Congrats!
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1978 SC Coupe, Gris Argent Metallic Silver-not selling
1974 2002 Tii Polaris Silver, making progress
1972 911T-make an offer
(I don't list the cars I've sold, because they're gone)
Old 12-22-2017, 06:21 AM
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Good info Macroni on what you can buy in todays market.
Old 12-22-2017, 06:35 AM
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Macaroni- that must be the one from north Jersey? I offered cash the next day no questions asked and he said it was sold. I think you beat me to it by hours. That deal will be difficult to replicate. Oh those seats....

Tell you what... I’ll buy it from you for $38k... deal?
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Old 12-22-2017, 07:06 AM
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Thanks guys. I put investment in quotes. I really just do not want to loose money. My real investments are allocated to IRA’s, stock market etc...

eastcoast- Where are you seeing “Lots of these cars...with similar history and mileage...” for sale?

I’m ready to buy.
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Old 12-22-2017, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by da Vinci Dan View Post
Thanks guys. I put investment in quotes. I really just do not want to loose money. My real investments are allocated to IRA’s, stock market etc...

eastcoast- Where are you seeing “Lots of these cars...with similar history and mileage...” for sale?

I’m ready to buy.
Not sure about that. You haven't really decided what kind of car you want.

Is the one in your OP for instance, which is as close to original and perfect as can be expected. what you are looking for ?

It takes a lot of $$$ to maintain a car to that condition. $10K is nothing in the world of p-car "maintenance".
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I can't afford that.

Last edited by pmax; 12-22-2017 at 10:38 AM..
Old 12-22-2017, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmax View Post
Not sure about that. You haven't really decided what kind of car you want.

Is the one in your OP for instance, which is as close to original and perfect as can be expected. what you are looking for ?

It takes a lot of $$$ to maintain a car to that condition. $10K is nothing in the world of p-car "maintenance".
I’m looking for a nice 87-89 in the $35k-40k range. I’ll go higher if it makes sense.
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Old 12-22-2017, 04:37 PM
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I see you already have an 84, so what is the intent here? will you move the earlier 3.2 after you find your G50 mate?
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Old 12-22-2017, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by da Vinci Dan View Post
I’m looking for a nice 87-89 in the $35k-40k range. I’ll go higher if it makes sense.
I believe the previous car you posted is closer to that range.

Here's another "perfect" car which sold recently. Note the asking price.

1989 Porsche 911 Carrera 3.2 Anniversary Edition Satin Black/Linen 72k - $76,995
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I can't afford that.
Old 12-23-2017, 12:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmax View Post
I believe the previous car you posted is closer to that range.

Here's another "perfect" car which sold recently. Note the asking price.

1989 Porsche 911 Carrera 3.2 Anniversary Edition Satin Black/Linen 72k - $76,995
That car has been on the market a long time and given that sellers rep I am pretty darn sure it was not "Perfect"


I also have an 88 Coupe, guards red with linen, 65k miles. I just redid the suspension. Did an engine out service, replaced anything and everything that needed to be done. Cleaned everything too, including pulling the fan sneding it for powder coating, new sound pad,, every old switch, anything at all. Bone stock except for the head unit which sucks, and I put 17 inch euromiesters on it, I have the original Fuchs.

The only thing that needs attention is the radio and I dont really use it. I passed on $52k. Not that I didnt think that was a fair price, I just didn't really want to sell it.

The original posters car looks like it should do $50k all day long.
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Old 12-23-2017, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trader220 View Post
I passed on $52k. Not that I didnt think that was a fair price....

The original posters car looks like it should do $50k all day long.
My question, Eric , is would you pay $50,000 for your car?

As we can tell by following BaT there are buyers in the market willing to pay $50,000 for G50s......

I think the 3.0L SC and the 3.2L Carrera are air-cooled representatives that still can provide tremendous value to the buyer as well as a fair return to the seller..... They can be purchased at a reasonable price it just takes a bit of vigilance and cat like decision making when the time comes.... Remind yourself if you have the time to consult the board on a purchase you are not getting a deal.....

Last edited by Macroni; 12-23-2017 at 11:46 AM..
Old 12-23-2017, 09:41 AM
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