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Nathan Solomon
 
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Join Date: Apr 2008
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Help me think this through...

My car is an '81 SC and a regular, but not daily, driver. 154k with a top-end rebuild at 120k. I have 95% of all records dating back to 1981. The car is pretty stock, except for the usual upgrades (carrera tensioners, turbo TR ends, tower brace, turbo valve covers, pop-off vale, euro ride height, etc). Paint is 7/10, the roof is faded and there is a scratch on the right door. No problems unusual to the type and year. It has been both cared for and driven regularly.

A couple of pictures attaced for your reference.

Here's the rub: in 1997 the car got wet, not the engine, the interior. Previous owner disassembled, dried, treated everything that got wet. Car was marked water damaged in Maryland (not salvage), but since my home state at the time (I'm military) didn't brand titles from other states, it's not branded on my title. I purchased the car for very little, so it represents no loss for me and I have seen no sign of water damage or effect in 8 years of ownership.

Obviously if I sell the car, I'm going to be up front and make sure the buyer knows the whole history.

My question to you is, how would you price it?






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Nathan Solomon
Jacksonville, FL
1981 SC "Die Klapperschlange II"
Old 02-02-2018, 09:12 AM
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That was 20 years ago. I would disclose the issues and price it the same as other '81 SCs.
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Old 02-02-2018, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattC2993 View Post
That was 20 years ago. I would disclose the issues and price it the same as other '81 SCs.
What then incentivizes a buyer to purchase this car over the same '81 SC with similar mileage and condition for the same money? Unless we are talking really special or rare cars such as 356 speedster or early 911s, this logic doesn't make sense. Sounds to me like insurance paid the car off and previous owner bought it back otherwise the title would have never reflected the incident. In most states that would be considered a rebuilt title. My opinion is 10-15% deduct for a car like this.

Props to the OP for being upfront and honest. Seems rare in this market.
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1990 964 C2 Coupe - Black / Cashmere
Old 02-02-2018, 11:30 AM
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Mid $30's
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Old 02-02-2018, 11:53 AM
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Whilst the damage has been "done", it's always useful to be fully honest - like it seems you have.

I'd probably say the car is a mid 20's car, to someone who's willing to take the history on.

I agree with pnut_lee, it would probably take a 10-20% hit for someone to accept this damage vs another similar car
Old 02-02-2018, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pnut_lee View Post
What then incentivizes a buyer to purchase this car over the same '81 SC with similar mileage and condition for the same money? ...
You can always negotiate down. People pay dumb prices for cars everyday. The market is not totally logical.
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Old 02-02-2018, 02:24 PM
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Nathan Solomon
 
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Thanks for the input, I have a whole narrative on how the water got in and a very detailed account of the remediation that was taken. Obviously I don't think it's an issue, but I doubt I'd be so casual if I was the buyer. It's crazy out in used 911 world...
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Nathan Solomon
Jacksonville, FL
1981 SC "Die Klapperschlange II"
Old 02-02-2018, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattC2993 View Post
You can always negotiate down. People pay dumb prices for cars everyday. The market is not totally logical.
I 100% agree with this. I always say start high. Easy enough to feel the market out, but placing too high of a startng point will make potential buyers skim over (ignore) your ad for future price drops. And as you state with regard to logic....... there are many who get wrapped up in the emotions. I'm certainly not always immune......
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Old 02-02-2018, 02:50 PM
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Old 02-02-2018, 03:36 PM
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First off I applaud you. There was a remark in your other thread about how even people with all the records don’t tell all the story. You are telling it all.

I often say that what the car is today matters most. I own an S title car and don’t stress about when I will sell it. It will sell based on current condition and you just tell the story. Obviously I made a few bad assumptions in your other thread. In this instance records won’t help bump your price but they will help preserve it.

I say mid $30s. Try to sell it locally so buyers can inspect it, lift the carpets, see it has no smell etc. after 20 years I wouldn’t expect it, but water scares a lot of people. There are more arses than seats these days. Even with the market pulling back a bit there is still plenty of demand for condition 3 drivers.
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Old 02-02-2018, 04:38 PM
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Nathan Solomon
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post

I say mid $30s. Try to sell it locally so buyers can inspect it, lift the carpets, see it has no smell etc. after 20 years I wouldn’t expect it, but water scares a lot of people.
Matt,

That's a great insight. I will try to sell the car locally first. I love the marque so much I would hate to see someone soured on the name because of something I did. If the buyer has a chance to inspect, I would feel better.

Full disclosure is the only way to go...

Thanks
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Nathan Solomon
Jacksonville, FL
1981 SC "Die Klapperschlange II"
Old 02-02-2018, 04:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
I say mid $30s. Try to sell it locally so buyers can inspect it, lift the carpets, see it has no smell etc. after 20 years I wouldn’t expect it, but water scares a lot of people. There are more arses than seats these days. Even with the market pulling back a bit there is still plenty of demand for condition 3 drivers.

3/5 sound so much better than a 6/10.... assuming this was M2's scale...
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Old 02-02-2018, 05:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanbenae View Post
3/5 sound so much better than a 6/10.... assuming this was M2's scale...
I'm using Hagerty 1/4.
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Old 02-02-2018, 05:35 PM
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These cars are getting old, they have been driving a lot, common to see 200,000 miles on them. They have been tracked, raced and generally seen some real use. Many of the them have had many owners and some not so honest.
A real "cream puff" is pretty rare.
I have worked on and looked over quite a few 911's of proud owners of their "cherry" car to see rear trailing arm that have been replaced, most likely from sliding into a curb, engine fire damage, fenders replaced, much more mileage than what is on the odometer, etc.
I just keep my mouth shut, unless of course I see something dangerous, let them live in their blissful ignorance. So many people are driving around in funked up cars and think they have the cats meow.
My point is a smart buyer looks at the car, the owner and the records and gets a good PPI and then makes a decision based on those facts.
Your car sounds like a good, typical cared for used SC with the right updates. You sound like a honest owner who trying to be fair and transparent with the records and history of your car.
I would say mid 30's is a good place to start.
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Last edited by ficke; 02-03-2018 at 04:46 AM.. Reason: spelling
Old 02-03-2018, 04:06 AM
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Certainly agree with mid 30’s...

Although, I think you should sell it to ItzaMe for $20k and make a young man very happy:

Still on the hunt
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Old 02-03-2018, 04:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
First off I applaud you. There was a remark in your other thread about how even people with all the records don’t tell all the story. You are telling it all.
Yep, Military Man. Honest to the core. Definitely in the rare 1% group.
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Old 02-03-2018, 07:34 AM
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Post the VIN when you sell it.
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I can't afford that.
Old 02-03-2018, 09:01 AM
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Nathan Solomon
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmax View Post
Post the VIN when you sell it.
Will do. I'm going to start assembling a "seller's package" with lots of very detailed photos and will put scans of all the maintenance records and the carfax in a drop box account for people to peruse.

Thinking of going ahead and having my local shop do at least a leak-down test so I can post those numbers. I haven't had one done in over five years, so I'd also like to know of any surprises...
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Nathan Solomon
Jacksonville, FL
1981 SC "Die Klapperschlange II"
Old 02-03-2018, 09:15 AM
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Good Luck with your sale,
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Ralph W
Old 02-03-2018, 10:04 AM
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How's your private message box going? I'm surprised no one has made you an offer yet!

Contact the PCA Florida Crown Region President. I'm sure someone will know someone who wants your car.

I'd contact Fields/Jacksonville Porsche as well. Skip, John or Charles are sure to know someone who's looking for an air cooled. All around pretty good guys in the Service Dept. Try Charles L. there.

Son was in JAX a few years back. Guided missile cruiser.

GLWS sailor.
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1978 SC Coupe, Gris Argent Metallic Silver
1974 2002 Tii Polaris Silver, Under construction
1972 911T
(I don't list the cars I've sold, because they're gone)
Old 02-03-2018, 10:07 AM
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