B&B longneck intercooler install

kellcats521 · 07-04-2007, 01:11 PM

This may be the worst engineered part EVER made. The mounting brackets do not line up (my understanding is that they 'fit' the 91-92 full bay mounting hardware/locations), the locations for the sending units interfere with the rear wiper motor, the rear mount hits the fan (and still is nowhere near the factory mount), and the hose barbs for the BOV and wastegate interfere with the trunk hinges once an actual hose is connected to them.

If anyone has installed one of these, please post pictures and any hints. Welding a full cage in my last race car was an easier excercise than this intercooler.

Pat K
87 930

Ken911 · 06:00 PM

Your first mistake was buying anything from B&B I called them a while back when I was looking for an oil cooler it was obvious they didn't give a crap about their customers, so I got one someplace else. Call Stephan at imagine auto he probably has forgot more about 930 mods than most of us know. if your having trouble you can e mail him some pics and he will help.

RarlyL8 · RarlyL8's Garage

Intercoolers designed for 965s will not fit 930s. Many things will not line up properly. Blown6 had these same issues at first but fixed them for the 930. I run a B&B made for a 930 and it fits perfectly.

kellcats521 · 07-04-2007, 08:41 PM

I bought the 'standard fit' long neck intercooler for 75-89 as listed here, part #FPOR-0305

B&B webpage

It is not a 956 unit, but it has some similar design components, including the need for the $300 hose that connects the turbo to the intercooler (which I may now use to smoke dope with

)

PP page, Part #19

This unit requires upgrade to the C2 BOV, and is significantly bigger than the 'drop in' B&B unit (of which I was told is a waste of $ as it provides little improvement over stock - 2 Atlanta shops use the stock IC over the drop-in B&B)

Anyway, this thing is junk too - only with Porsche could a company as piss-poor as B&B remain not only in business, but considered a marque aftermarket company

......

RarlyL8 · RarlyL8's Garage

I misunderstood. It sounded like you bought a 965 intercooler.
So this is a 965 style intercooler, correct?

Those are also a problem. Actually it is the same problem I described above. Most 965 style intercoolers won't fit a 930 either. I have seen many of these things and talked to folks that have purchased them unwittingly. It can be a nightmare.

The problem really is the advertising. These intercoolers are not a "bolt-on" for a 930 and should not be listed as such. B6 just went through this and lost some credibility in the process. I think they have their fitment issues addresses but it hurt them. It can be difficult to time the introduction of new products into the market. You have to stand behind any issues that come up.

My B&B intercooler works well for what it is. I don't expect much out of a stock footprint unit that is twice as thick as stock but it does fit perfectly.

B&B should label your intercooler "for 965 use only" and refund your purchase price. Bolt-on doesn't mean cut the deck lid, buy new parts, fab your own brackets and hope for the best.

kellcats521 · 07-04-2007, 09:28 PM

Unfortunately, it's not a 965 unit either, as it's for sure smaller than the OE 965 unit - it will fit with the 930 A/C condenser present. From what I see, I think it was sorta designed for EFI conversion use, as it has no fitting for the AAR on the right side, nor were the fittings drilled and tapped for the boost sensor and boost cutoff (although there are pads cast into the reat tank for these on the top left side, ala 965).

Here's my take on mounting this thing:
1) cut/reweld the arm that mounts to the coil bracket as it was angled and it is just plain wrong. This is the biggest 'issue' since the cast tank is a porous hunk of crap - one of the poorest castings I've ever seen.
2) clearance the tab near the TB so you can actually thread a nut on to the mounting stud.
3) design an arm to connect the mount near the CIS unit to the OE 965 mounting bracket (it mounts to the manifold where the diverter mounted - the diverter is removed for this IC)
4) remove the entire rear wiper (motor and all) and tweak the decklid hinge to allow for the wastegate and BOV lines to connect to the IC. Might have to remove/relocate the A/C line that is zip tied to the hinge as well (but that condenser can stay in the decklid

).
5) drill and tap fittings for boost sensor and boost cutoff (and AAR - I'm not sure if this hose is needed)
6) get an aftermarket air cleaner (I did the $20 mr. gasket unit), as the stock airbox will not fit - you could cut and weld part of the stock airbox to fit it in, but that seems like a total waste....

I think that about sums it up - $1,800 for the intercooler, $600 in 'extra' parts NEEDED (could easily be $1,000 if you buy the K&N or other 'hi-po' airbox) to actually USE the IC for something other than a (billy) boat anchor, and a good day or 2 of R/R and fabbing.
It's a great value for someone whose brain apparently fell out of their head years ago..... like me.

DougM · 07-05-2007, 05:48 AM

Is this the unit you are talking about? If it is, I can take more detailed pics of the install.

RarlyL8 · RarlyL8's Garage

Holy crap, that's a lot more involved what I have seen.
Something must be wrong. The Porsche boards would be on fire if every experience were that bad. What does B&B say about this?

kellcats521 · 07-05-2007, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DougM
Is this the unit you are talking about? If it is, I can take more detailed pics of the install.

That is the 'bolt in' unit - mine is the long neck version that uses the 965 inlet hose. I'll try to take pictures tonight, I couldn't find the digital camera I need to use to get good pics last night.

mb911 · mb911's Garage

Anyway, this thing is junk too - only with Porsche could a company as piss-poor as B&B remain not only in business, but considered a marque aftermarket company ......

It must be said that the main reason they are in business is the corvette market they serve very well. The porsche market has become smaller for them and the concentration on the p market items has gone other directions. Now I must admit I recomended to a customer with a 2007 vette that I had heard good things about B&B exhaust for those cars..

Sorry You are having so much trouble hope it works out

930LDR · 07-09-2007, 04:33 PM

Without seeing pictures its tought to offer any meaningful commentary... but anything with a 965 inlet hose is going to be an issue for you. I have the Kokeln long neck IC and the downpipe is nearly in the exact position as the B*B pictured.

kellcats521 · 07-12-2007, 07:39 PM

I posted some pics over here.....

Pat K

930LDR · 07-13-2007, 07:04 AM

I have never seen that unit myself before. But that thing could never be a 'bolt-on' given the fittings. It actually looks more like a halfbay version of a 965 full bay.

To be quite honest... I think I would have held off on cutting anything until I knew for sure what I was dealing with.

Sorry for your frustrations.

kellcats521 · 01-15-2008, 12:31 PM

I'm reviving/updating an old thread only because there is still a lot of intercooler talk here - as some remember, I went thru the B&B longneck debacle last summer.....

I've since bought 3 other intercoolers to decide which one would work best (I gave up on the B&B - it's simply garbage at any price) The 3 other units I got are: 1) Garretson for 76-77 non I/C car (would work with OE diverter, or needs a fitting added to use BOV), 2) OE 965 (C2 turbo) unit (need to scrap A/C or switch to C2 condenser/lines), and 3) Garretson for 78-87 (thanks Kas930 here on Pelican - http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?t=384695).

In the end I'll prolly use the Garretson 78-87 unit - I did not see enough gain with the 965 intercooler to justify the cost of redoing my A/C system. I may hang on to the 965 unit and use it if I can gather up the C2 a/c parts on the cheep, but finding anything cheep for these cars is like winning the lottery.

Anyway both of the Garretson units are TOP NOTCH. Not inexpensive by any means, but unlike B&B, definately worth the money.

Pat K
87 930

kas930 · kas930's Garage

Pat,
I hope my intercooler works out for you. In my case I went the 965 route and gained 30rwhp. I started buying the parts to redo the AC, but in the end deceided to go the other way and removed the AC stuff and put it a box for a later date (all in the name of weight reduction)

.

Good luck!
Keith

mdurbahn · 01-15-2008, 07:53 PM

kas, you got 30 rwhp with the 965 ic over the garretson one?

rsrfan · 01-16-2008, 09:53 AM

Do tell? I am finishing up my installation of a C2 intercooler having previously ran a longneck Garrettson/Andial.

JP

mdurbahn · 01-16-2008, 11:25 AM

JP, did you keep your a.c?

rsrfan · 01-16-2008, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdurbahn

JP, did you keep your a.c?

No. I removed every last bit so the fit was not an issue for me. I will post pics when installed. I used heim joints in lieu of brackets so the install looks pretty trick.

JP

kas930 · kas930's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdurbahn

kas, you got 30 rwhp with the 965 ic over the garretson one?

I should have clarified.. I had a lot of other work done to the motor and the IC became the limiting factor. To make sure it was worth the investment I had the car dynoed after the swap and it was just about 30hp more (448 versus 479) than before the swap (I was present for this run but was not present for the first one). No other changes were made to the car, and I would say that the ambient temps were probably within 10 degrees.