kkk k27 turbo rebuild

[j930]

what is the difficulty level of putting new seals on this turbo. I am getting oil inside the turbo and would like to pull apart and refresh it. do they sell the seals for it?

[mark houghton]

You can buy the seals and bearing and thrust washer in a kit for usually less than $100 I think. Not all that difficult to take apart, clean, inspect the shaft, and replace everything. The only caution (and it's an important one) is that the turbo balance could be affected. Presumably if you mark everything (both the turbo and compressor impellers) and the nut securing them to the shaft so that you re-install them exactly as they were before taking apart, the balance may remain fairly close. Or, after installing, you can send it out just to be balanced.
Most people shy away from this, but I do know of one person I corresponded with who has rebuilt several in this fashion without dire affects. I'll forward a couple of communications I have via PM so you can make an informed decision.

[j930]

thanks , I appreciate the advice

[Falk930]

Mark,
maybe we can get the "how to K27" rebuild info too?

thanks
Falk

[mark houghton]

For everyone, the info I have is just some PM correspondence from a member on this forum - a DIY kind of guy like many of us - who threw conventional wisdom out the door and called BS on the cloak of mystery surrounding turbo rebuilding. These things have only one moving part and are simple to take apart and replace stuff. Having a balanced assembly is important for efficiency, longevity, and safety obviously....'cause they do spin kinda fast ya know. Do this at your own risk. Of course if you've got seriously worn components (the shaft, seal seats, compressor blades, and bearing) then rebuilding would need to go beyond the simple seal and bearing kit.

[930cabman]

I would never rebuild a high speed unit as the turbocharge unit WITHOUT a precision balance. These units are very delicate and cannot withstand an out of balance condition. The turbo unit on my own car is in need of a rebuild, if any one knows of a trusted source?

thanks in advance

[Ronnie's.930]

This is a well known and respected outfit that uses one of those bazillion dollar, high speed balancing machines:

http://www.durabilt-turbo.com/#top

[voitureltd]

http://www.durabilt-turbo.com/#top[/QUOTE]

I have used them in the past also. They even advised me on my last one I sent that according to what they analyze in their observations that it was well suited to motor that it was hooked up to. I had mentioned a more expensive upgrade with the rebuild as this was a Kremer hybred Turbo that was installed when the car was built in 1984.I thought possibly 2010 technology could be applied for better performance, however "Bob" declined and said not to waste my money as it was just right. Not only did they source some rare race rebuild parts, it was soon back in the mail . They even apologized for taking so long!!!!
They are VERY good and If I recall the price was around $500 for the full rebuild balancing etc. I had a shop try to rebuild one once and as I recall there is a trick to getting it torqued right and using the right lock tight as the nut
loosened up and subsequently ruined the turbine blade within 10 minutes which meant cleaning the entire intake / intercooler system again and a later turbo rebuild. Fortunately I had a similar spare to install. On mine we found a loose fitting sucking air on the sump pump that caused the seals to leak in the first place that mysteriously was not torqued right.

[JFairman]

I also used Durabilt last time I had a problematic K27HFS turbo rebuilt. They are the best according to Kevin at Gunnar Porsche Racing and thats why I had them do it.

Bob, kows his stuff and is very helpful.
They have a VSR turbo balancing machine and they upgraded the turbo with better parts than were in it and had it back to me in 2 weeks.

[mark houghton]

Originally Posted by 930cabman

I would never rebuild a high speed unit as the turbocharge unit WITHOUT a precision balance. These units are very delicate and cannot withstand an out of balance condition. The turbo unit on my own car is in need of a rebuild, if any one knows of a trusted source?

thanks in advance

Let me play devil's advocate....have you ever rebuilt one WITHOUT precision balancing and HAD a catastrophic failure? Or is this just an opinion and a risk you're not willing to take?
If y'all haven't noticed, I love challenging conventional wisdom as well as The Holy Grail. Who says it's not ok to take apart a turbo, as long as you put it back together exactly as it was so as not to affect the balance. Is it the turbo rebuild business professionals perpetuating what certainly is a good thing (balancing), but is re-balancing always necessary with all levels of rebuild...minor to major? Don't get me wrong, I don't condone this one way or the other and I certainly wouldn't recommend the undertaking unless the person has the skills and confidence at hand.
Just food for thought and a lively discussion

[cellison]

ok stupid question. maybe i misd it, do you rebuild the turbo yourself and send it to them for balancing were i assume they have to tear back into it to balance if it is out of balance, or do you send them your unit and they rebuild and balance?

[William930t]

I have some turbo rebuild info and read good things about these companies:

BEWARE of the DIY "Ebay Turbo Rebuild Kit" myth! - Tampa Racing

http://gpopshop.com/kkk-rebuild-kits

http://www.durabilt-turbo.com/10212.html

Majestic Turbochargers, Inc. Home Page

Tim's Turbos - Turbo Rebuilding

The Boost Lab

Evergreen Turbo Co. OEM and High Performance Turbocharges

[930cabman]

Just my two cents, back in the '70s I worked under a late family member and learned the trade, dynamic balancing of high speed rotating equipment. It was kinda fun,and worked at it for about 6 years and learned enough about it to know the forces generated at high speed are great and can be dangerous. Hence the warning, also when in balance the equipment will perform more smooth and last longer. I recall the objective being having the center of gravity(mass) of the rotating object having the minimal deflection from center line.

thanks,

John G

[930cabman]

Originally Posted by voitureltd

http://www.durabilt-turbo.com/#top

I have used them in the past also. They even advised me on my last one I sent that according to what they analyze in their observations that it was well suited to motor that it was hooked up to. I had mentioned a more expensive upgrade with the rebuild as this was a Kremer hybred Turbo that was installed when the car was built in 1984.I thought possibly 2010 technology could be applied for better performance, however "Bob" declined and said not to waste my money as it was just right. Not only did they source some rare race rebuild parts, it was soon back in the mail . They even apologized for taking so long!!!!
They are VERY good and If I recall the price was around $500 for the full rebuild balancing etc. I had a shop try to rebuild one once and as I recall there is a trick to getting it torqued right and using the right lock tight as the nut
loosened up and subsequently ruined the turbine blade within 10 minutes which meant cleaning the entire intake / intercooler system again and a later turbo rebuild. Fortunately I had a similar spare to install. On mine we found a loose fitting sucking air on the sump pump that caused the seals to leak in the first place that mysteriously was not torqued right.[/QUOTE]

Tony,

Where was the loose fitting that caused the seals to fail?

thanks in advance