930 on my mind, I have some questions

[Dave Colangelo]

I have recently been toying with the idea of getting a 930 to add to my collection. Prices are still manageable enough but rising fast. The alternative would be a good order 3.2 Carrera. I still have a while until I'm going to do anything but I was looking to get some questions answered in the mean time.

Please assume that all these questions are in comparison to a 3.2 Carrera or 3.0SC

1) Compared to the 3.2 Carerra how much worse (if at all) is the 930 on gas
2) How much more problematic are they
3) How much louder are they (stock)
4) In reality are they that much faster
5) How reliable are they

I already have a 78SC an 87 944 and an 88 924S so i am no stranger to Porsche and I know many of the little ins and outs at this point.

The thought of the 80+mph in 2nd is something im not going to be able to get out of my head anytime soon..

Regards
Dave

[full quack]

Ummm...you really need to get a ride in one{or drive one}.

Then your question #4 will be appropriately answered, the rest of your questions don't matter, or won't matter any longer.

Mark

[sck007]

All sanity goes out the window when boost kicks in. You will be looking for your next fix...Not just any fat bottom girl can cure it!

[Ronnie's.930]

Question number one = the 930 is far worse on gas (it came in the 1980s with the "gas guzzler" tax after all). The factory claimed 16/22 MPG city/highway driving, but for me, and many that post on this forum, that is pure BS (more like 9-12 city and 15-18 highway, and far less if you spend a lot of time boosting).

Oh, and regarding number 4 = BIG TIME - the 3.2 feels like it has the guts of Grandma's stationwagon next to the 930, and the 930 is much faster to stop as well.

[WPOZZZ]

1. Gas mileage? We don't care about no stinkin' mileage! lol As Ronnie said above, expect 9-12 in the city.
2. IF you maintain the car, it will treat you right. If you scrimp on maintenance, it'll cost you.
3. A stock exhaust is quiet and reasonable for a late night drive. Your neighbors will appreciate it.
4. Nothing like boost!
5. See #2
6. Buy now before they are out of reach.

[DohertyCM]

When the boost kicks in you will not care about gas mileage....
Reliability is the same as a regular 911...
Sound...depends on car and the setup that is on the car...or what you put on it.

[Shadetree930]

1) Compared to the 3.2 Carerra how much worse (if at all) is the 930 on gas

Figure 14 MPG

2) How much more problematic are they

Buy the right one and it is no different than any other 911. Modifications = Drama

3) How much louder are they (stock)

C'mon man! It's all about the sound! The turbo burble is a panty dropper.

4) In reality are they that much faster

Ummmmmm .....Yeah!

5) How reliable are they

Dead nuts reliable if you buy and maintain a solid unmolested example.



Disclaimer ....... I am in the process of selling my unmolested 930. Already regretting the decision.

[Tippy]

Best of both worlds is boosting a Carrera 3.2. You get EFI, bigger heads, bigger cams, and bigger intake right from the get go.

[Ronnie's.930]

Originally Posted by Tippy

Best of both worlds is boosting a Carrera 3.2. You get EFI, bigger heads, bigger cams, and bigger intake right from the get go.

But you also get a skinny little, anorexic-chic-looking car with tiny axles, cv joints and brakes!

[porche]

Originally Posted by Dave Colangelo

I have recently been toying with the idea of getting a 930 to add to my collection..................................
.................................................. .....80+mph in 2nd is something im not going to be able to get out of my head anytime soon..

Regards
Dave

Dave,
1) Compared to the 3.2 Carerra how much worse (if at all) is the 930 on gas - A lot! As long as you promise to enjoy it the way it should be driven.
2) How much more problematic are they - They’re not, if properly purchased.
3) How much louder are they (stock) - The OEM 930 set up is actually quieter than an SC/3.2 Carrera exhaust due to the effect of the turbo.
4) In reality are they that much faster - Try one, try one, try one! The year doesn’t matter, but try a properly set up stock 930 if you can. Floor it, and watch what starts to happen after 3 grand. If you're still on board, now into 2nd and cooking north of 5 grand, try to wipe the grin off your face and report back.
5) How reliable are they - They run hotter and they are not SC's or 3.2 Carreras but a good car can give you many exiting years. Learn to wrench it yourself for extra satisfaction.

The 930 is the most visceral vehicle on the market for the money today, and, they do have the sweetest looking body Porsche ever put on a road car!

If the car you find is not fast enough, they can be successfully built up.

[Tippy]

But you also get a skinny little, anorexic-chic-looking car with tiny axles, cv joints and brakes!

I believe my G50 has equally strong shafts and CV's as the 930's...

[s5uewf]

Having had a g50 3.2 Carerra (1988) and now having a 1988 930, I would say they are quite different in the way they drive, feel, sound, look, and operate. The G50 Carrera has a better shifting transmission with 5 speeds to overcome the moderate horsepower. Most 911's are "inertia" cars...take a while to accelerate, keep them in the 4500rpm power band and use the shifter to maintain velocity. My opinion.

G50 Carrera is low maintenance, gets reasonable mileage, and is a pretty car.

930 when in boost is completely different car than the Carrera. Only 4 speeds because you only need 4 speeds if you use the boost. Mine has been rock solid since I switched it to EFI, and it runs as well as my Carrera did - and gets better mileage than it did when it was set up with CIS. I like the 930 much more than the Carrera because it is more brutal, offers more performance which I enjoy, is exclusive, and is less of an inertia car than the 3.2's are.

You should find a stock example for a ride along as well as a modified example for a ride along - night and day even within the 930 category.
Good luck with your choice, all 911/930 models are great if you get a good example.

[redturbo911]

Dave take one for a test drive then think of question #4 SMILE and nothing else will matter. They are incredibly fast and sexy as hell.

[quattrorunner]

Before I turboed, I was concerned about gas mileage but thinking on it now, I'd way rather have boost. No looking back. Such an amazing experience to drive one of these powerful cars for the first time. But it doesn't get old. I do t get tired of or used to it. Every time I leave work, it's party time. Every time I go to work, it party time, till I get there.
It just may change your life. But try and keep it under control. Your infatuation I mean. I'm struggling with that one.

[Noah930]

1) Compared to the 3.2 Carerra how much worse (if at all) is the 930 on gas
2) How much more problematic are they
3) How much louder are they (stock)
4) In reality are they that much faster
5) How reliable are they

1) I get about 12-14 mpg in the city. Even when I'm running in the canyons I get that. However, if on the open highway at a steady 70 mph, I get about 20-22 mpg. My car is stock.

2) I've had a couple issues I couldn't take care of myself. But in general my reliability concerns are more because the car is 27 years-old, as opposed to being a 930 vs a 911. I think the car has stranded me twice in the 35K miles I've owned it.

3) Never even thought about the noise vs. a 911. It's louder than other (stock) passenger cars, but by no means is it loud. It doesn't wake up the neighbors or cause car alarms to go off in a parking garage. And that turbo burble (overrun on decel) is a **glorious** sound.

4) At low revs, a 930 may actually be slower due to turbo lag and a low compression motor. But holy smokes, when that boost kicks in at 3700 rpm (for a stock car) things get very exciting very fast. Some magazine had a paragraph along the lines of: 0-60 may be listed as 5.5 seconds. 0-30 takes about 4 of those seconds, and 30-60 comes about in that last 1.5 seconds.

5) See #2. The high engine compartment heat generated definitely shortens the life of components, but my car's got >100K miles on an unopened motor/trans. I realize that one day during my tenure of ownership I'll probably have to rebuild the motor. That may be a $10-15K proposition, even before the while-you're-in-there go-fast parts. That's a little scary.

Before I purchased my car I was actually looking for a 3.2 Carrera. But in my search I came across my 930. It wasn't much more than the high-end asking prices for 3.2 Carreras, so I thought why not? I haven't regretted the decision at all.

[1986 930]

I have had over a 20 year period, a '84 3.2, '91 964, and two 930's. I would say that the 3.2 Carrera is a bit cheaper to own and operate, but not a lot on two equally sorted cars. I found that the 964 cost at least as much as the 930 to own and operate. A basic engine rebuild( rings & seals)/clutch replacement on the 964 was around $9k so I think that is comparable to what I would expect on my 930 when we get to that point.

I drove the first 930 as a dailey driver in Dallas, Tx. from '94 to '99. It was very reliable and never left me stranded. After the first 6 months of sorting a few fuel pump relay issues, it ran flawlessly for 70k mile over the next 4.5 years.

I drive my current 930 to work once a week and around town. Mostly freeway driving averaging about 13-16 mpg.

All Porsches, and most used cars for that matter, are pay me now or pay me later. A 930 is more so than most.

Since you have had Porsches you probably already know that the first step to buying one is to have a really reputable mechanic identified to work on it. Unless you are a good DIY guy, this goes more for a 930 than most.

One thing I had to get used to again going from my 964 to my 930 was the art of down shifting into 1st gear to make city driving corners. You can do it in 2nd but you are lugging the motor a lot and it is no fun having less acceleration than a bycycle comming out of the corner.


The other driving difference is that in town, you are almost always in the wrong gear with the 4 speed when you are used to a 911 of any year. 45mph is a bit low on the revs in 3rd and a bit high on the revs in 2nd. That is a contributing factor in the lower mileage figures with a 930. Less than 70mph on the freeway and you are lugging the motor. 85mph is a comfortable cruising speed for everyone but Johny Law.

One thing I have not seen mentioned is the, "Hey, look at me factor". It is much higher on a 930 than other Porsces and takes a bit to get used to. Or, at least for me it did. A 911 is nice, a 930 is cool!


Good luck,

Mark

[jwasbury]

Originally Posted by Dave Colangelo

1) Compared to the 3.2 Carerra how much worse (if at all) is the 930 on gas

Is this a serious question? Really, these cars were designed to compete with Ferrari and Lambo...does anybody care about fuel economy when they are contemplating purchase of a 512bb?

As Noah930 mentioned, with a steady right foot cruising the interstate in 4th, you should see 20mpg. I find that pretty amazing considering the 930 was the fastest accelerating production car on the planet in its day. I got worse gas mileage in my 2012 CTS-V (which is the fastest station wagon on the planet).

As many others have already said, when you hit the boost pipe, chances are you won't care about MPG anymore either.

The 930 is really a very different experience than a 911, and it takes some time and effort to learn how to get the most out of the engine and tall geared 4spd. It is similar to the 911 in the raw and mechanical feel, but it goes to 11

Dave, we actually met once on one of the runs you organized. I didn't continue up to hawks nest with your group, but hung out in the parking lot of a meeting point. I am happy to arrange some seat time for you in my '79 if you would like a taste of a modded car.

[jwasbury]

Originally Posted by quattrorunner

It just may change your life. But try and keep it under control. Your infatuation I mean. I'm struggling with that one.

Oh...and this^

If you have a wife or significant other, your obsession with the boosted flat 6 may expose weaknesses in the relationship

[Hams930T]

Originally Posted by jwasbury

Oh...and this^

If you have a wife or significant other, your obsession with the boosted flat 6 may expose weaknesses in the relationship

Or in my case a weakness for opening my wallet - which in turn leads to a weakness in the relationship lol!!!!

[JFairman]

Yeah, you have to drive one or at least ride in it.

They are dual personality cars... below 3000 rpm it's a lazy old dog thats easy to putts around town in and over 4000 rpm it turns into a good car for the track as long as it has good shocks and tires.

Gas mileage kinda sucks but steady cruise on the highway isn't bad.
Miles per gallon or smiles per gallon.