Lennies BMW Rocket Sprockets new pricing - Page 3

lennie · 10-26-2013, 07:43 AM

Chris,

Yes the remap is a worthwhile effort and gets good results just like the tuned chips were from UltiMap when they were around. The correct tuning via a chip or remap is good and just what the factory should have done if not for emissions requirements the world over. When I had Duane at UltiMap do my bike it made a world of difference that I was happy with.

I never undersand why you are so negative about the benefits of the sprockets as they are a proven product. Each to their own I suppose. I guess for many the idea of a simple mechanical change is a scary thing as not all are mechanically capable. The sprockets are truly bolt in and you can get away without any tuning but the best results are when you do tune as with any mods. The sprockets are still relative even by modern standards.

OwenM · 02:34 PM

Fine tuning of air/ fuel ratios and ignition advance has never and can never be a substitute for physical modifications that improve the engines breathing, all they can do is optimism the use if the air that can be drawn in.

As can be seen in the Fuel/ Air ratio chart linked below, the sprockets allow the boxer to take in more air up to about 7500rpm. More air in equals more power and torque out, that should be simple enough to understand.

http://www.bikeboy.org/r1100sboxercamsproc.html

Remapping fuel and ignition has no effect on engine breathing so can NEVER provide what the sprockets do. An optimized tune with the sprockets installed will ALWAYS provide more power and torque below about 7000rpm than an optimized tune without the sprockets.

Those who want the best performance from their boxer below about 7000rpm have no choice but to install Lennies sprockets and invoke a richer fuel map, either via an ECU remap, add on fuel nanny or via the much simpler and cheaper air temperature sensor trick. A remap alone can never provide the same result.

As for products like Rexxer being the way of the future, I dont see it. I expect future motorcycle ECU's to be so locked down by the manufacturer that remapping will be effectively impossible.

Chris Canning · 10-26-2013, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OwenM

Fine tuning of air/ fuel ratios and ignition advance has never and can never be a substitute for physical modifications that improve the engines breathing,

That's put that idea to bed then,my K1200

OwenM · 10-27-2013, 11:45 AM

Your K1200 is not relevant to a discussion about Lennies sprockets.

On a boxer, the sprockets in combination with remapping with give more than DOUBLE the improvement of the remap alone.

Unlike the K1200 which was well know for poor fueling, the R1200's I have owned have had no fueling issues standard so little improvement was possible from fuel adjustments. Smoother running and cleaner throttle response at lower rpm where the main improvements, power was not significantly increased until the sprockets went in.

Chris Canning · 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OwenM

Your K1200 is not relevant to a discussion about Lennies sprockets.

On a boxer, the sprockets in combination with remapping with give more than DOUBLE the improvement of the remap alone.

Unlike the K1200 which was well know for poor fueling, the R1200's I have owned have had no fueling issues standard so little improvement was possible from fuel adjustments. Smoother running and cleaner throttle response at lower rpm where the main improvements, power was not significantly increased until the sprockets went in.

That's interesting because with a one off pipe Induct/SJ filter and PC with a custom map I got close on 10hp out of mine which took it to a 100hp if you reckon it'll go 110hp I'm all ears you can pick the bill if it doesn't.

OwenM · 01:44 PM

And how much extra power do you recon you would have obtained with the remap alone, no expensive custom exhaust, induct and SJ filter? Why pay all that money if a remap can do it all?
After market exhausts almost always provide worse low end torque than the standard system, which is why I wont install one on my RT or GS boxers. They need all the low to mid range grunt I can give them.

The sprockets are not intended to give more top end power, they provide more power and torque, below about 7000rpm, especially at part throttle where its much more useful and fun IMHO.

If strong low to mid range performance is not your thing thats fine, know one is twisting your arm to install Lennie's sprockets. But dont assume everyone else is not or should not be interested.

Please explain why you are so negative about the sprockets when you have no experience with them. Seems odd to me.

Chris Canning · 10-27-2013, 03:22 PM

When I got into biking all the old boys 28/30 years of age!!! had either Bonneville's or BSA IV Spifire Speacial's with Amal GP carbs,when I rolled up with my brand new 500H1A they where dead sure my ringer dinger wouldn't last,it did and the one thing I learned move with times because it never stands still.

It has nothing to do with being negative the world has moved on,you don't seem to think so, I do, folks who have read this can make their own mind up,I'm not selling anything either sprockets or re-maps.

BrianG · 10-27-2013, 05:12 PM

This dialogue puts me in mind of a common saying:

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lennie · 10-31-2013, 08:32 PM

Chris,

I have always respected your opinion in the past and still do.

The fact there are over 500,000 of these engines out there is s sign it was successful across most models.

It is not just a matter of moving on with the times as the sprockets work and it is a matter of awareness more than anything else.

This for me is a sideline thing for me for a bit of cash and not something I rely on. A retune by map or chip for the state of tune of a bike whether it be stock or modified is the best as it should be tuned correctly for fuel.

When it come to modifying the engine as many peopl like to, the sprockets will bolt in and work ona stock bike or one that have many mods as my had. After all I did with porting, cams, exhaust and intake I stilla dvanced the cam timing 9 degrees and on the dyno and on the street it made a difference that was a pleasure to ride. I had 102 rwhp and a fat midrange torque that was so much fun to ride in day to day riding and fast open highway runs. Anyone that rode with me was surprised how the bike drove off corners and that is what it is about for me.

If you think that time has passed for the sprockets that is what you can think and I guess we should all update to the latest technology to get the best from our bikes. All I have done with my tuning be it intake or cam timing mods is adapt proven engine tuning change to the BMW twin.

I hope you enjopy your riding as muich as many of us do.

airplast · 10-22-2016, 01:09 AM

are lennies sprockets a big job to fit does some one have a diagram

lennie · 10-22-2016, 03:00 AM

airplast,

pm me your email address and I will send the install notes to you.

signit98 · 10-22-2016, 08:03 AM

I have done quite a few sets now and (if you are a reasonably experienced wrencher) it is not an overwhelmingly complicated task, if you pay attention.

Be prepared and don't get intimidated.Make sure that you have a safety wire on the chain, BEFORE you take off the old sprocket and mark the chain to sprocket spot where the timing marker is on the original sprocket.

Be prepared to smile, A LOT, after you have it all back together...

lennie · 05:07 PM

signet,

all about shyte eating grins from better riding enjoyment no matter what the naysayers go on about

RIQUE · RIQUE's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by airplast

are lennies sprockets a big job to fit does some one have a diagram

I believe I was the last of the forum members to do the sprocket swap. It took me all Saturday morning to complete. I was very careful making sure the chain did not move out of place. Make sure you mark your spots prior to removal just in case. Combined with a tuned chip results are fantastic. Good Luck.

airplast · 10-29-2016, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lennie

airplast,

pm me your email address and I will send the install notes to you.

nothing from you so far mate

Groceryrun · Groceryrun's Garage

Hi Airplast :

Here's a website with a lot of info -

http://boxer-performance.com/

http://boxer-performance.com/rocket-sprocket-installation/

lennie · 10-30-2016, 01:14 AM

hi Airplast,

sorry for the delay as I have been away for work and crazy busy when back.

I emailed you the install notes just now.

airplast · 11-02-2016, 03:10 AM

thats cool no problem cant get my r1200 to pull above 6k in 6th gear red lines to every other gear which is the tune/chip of choice? i live in the uk......dont suppose it is worth changing the exhaust or decat even?

signit98 · 11-02-2016, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by airplast

thats cool no problem cant get my r1200 to pull above 6k in 6th gear red lines to every other gear which is the tune/chip of choice? i live in the uk......dont suppose it is worth changing the exhaust or decat even?

The ideal combination (for me) seems to be: Sprockets, no cat and mildly modified exhaust system (Offenbach) with a Techlusion or (better) AF-Xied.

Tolerable noise level and lovely engine characteristics.

tomvv11 · tomvv11's Garage

With better low end breathing, how does that affect R1100S gas mileage? Sadly I mostly commute with my '04 S, and really like its present amount of low end for stop and go, as well as its response when using the throttle to get out of the way of larger things. Could always be gruntier though. If sprockets would also increase the wretched mileage I'd seriously consider them, but I'm guessing that greater torque does not come from air, but from pulling in more gas/air.