Guillain-Barré syndrome and Flu Vaccine

[asphaltgambler]

So - anyone heard of this?

Older guy I used to work with - who is now @70 years old had the flu vaccine early last year and within 48 hrs developed paralysis in his right side, especially in his right forearm and hand. The condition worsened to the point he cannot use his hand at all and has very limited movement on that side of his body.

He likes to work but now has too many obstacles to work in the automotive business even part-time to be productive.

He is about to receive a very large monetary settlement. But his condition is permanent........................

Apparently there is a 'fund' set up and managed by the Fed's where for every 'shot' there is a $0.60 tax - paid from the maker of the vaccines to them.

Further, it seems to affect men who are older - like 50+. The older you are the higher the risk.

Because of this, my age (60) I am very much considering opting out from now on.......

[dobryan]

What are the percentages of folks who have the GB reaction vs those who die or are disabled by the flu? Life is full of choices that have odds for adverse reactions.

[dafischer]

FWIW, I'm 64 and have never had a flu vaccine, nor have I had the flu.

[brshap]

Originally Posted by dobryan

What are the percentages of folks who have the GB reaction vs those who die or are disabled by the flu? Life is full of choices that have odds for adverse reactions.

This is exactly right. The flu kills scores of older people every year. You are FAR more likely to die of the flu itself than any side effects of the vaccine and its not even close.

[Porchdog]

Careful with that kind of talk - you are going to end up on a list as an "anti-vaxxer"

Personally I don't get the flu vaccine as I feel the risks outweigh the potential benefit for me.
If I worked in healthcare, or was exposed to the public or large groups of people regularly I would probably think differently.

The MMR vaccine presents some pretty alarming potential side effects for protection against disease that isn't very dangerous to most of the population.

I'm very skeptical of Gardisil, especially for boys.

I have gotten many vaccines but I'm not convinced that the risk/reward is adequately disclosed for all of them.

[Tobra]

The flu vaccine is a different from the ones for childhood diseases, apples and oranges. For childhood vaccines, they are well established to be efficacious and safe, just spread them out a bit. The flu vaccine is a total crapshoot. They guess wrong which strains to include more often than not, so most of the time it does not have much of a protective effect.

I have had the flu 3 times in my life. First time as a lad, Hong Kong Flu, sick for a week. The other two times were when I got the flu vaccine. I very rarely get sick. If you remove flu vaccinations and a few incidents of food poisoning, it has been almost 50 years since I was ill enough to miss a day of work or school.

[asphaltgambler]

CDC says - 'thousands' of people per year have this with varying degrees of paralysis usually temporary for most. Also people do die as the paralysis can target the lungs / breathing function.

My wife who is the medical field and exposed to all kinds of crap during her work day has never had the flu shot. Conversely; as said above - older folks are at high risk from the flu turning into pneumonia then into death......

[Porchdog]

My son in the Marines hates his mandatory annual flu shot - he's symptomatic for up to a week after every one. He thinks that it's worse than the "peanut butter" shot - I don't even know what-all exotic diseases that one covers.

[flipper35]

Originally Posted by Porchdog

Careful with that kind of talk - you are going to end up on a list as an "anti-vaxxer"

Personally I don't get the flu vaccine as I feel the risks outweigh the potential benefit for me.
If I worked in healthcare, or was exposed to the public or large groups of people regularly I would probably think differently.

The MMR vaccine presents some pretty alarming potential side effects for protection against disease that isn't very dangerous to most of the population.

I'm very skeptical of Gardisil, especially for boys.

I have gotten many vaccines but I'm not convinced that the risk/reward is adequately disclosed for all of them.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2019/07/measles-is-killing-more-people-in-the-drc-than-ebola-and-faster/

There is always risk reward cases for these things.

For me, I will spend a minimum two days balled up on the bathroom floor if I get a flu shot.

[pwd72s]

Never heard of this...but now, despite never having a problem with a flue shot, I'm nervous. Dunno if I'll opt for another.

Flipper is right about about not adequate disclosure.

[aap1966]

Originally Posted by asphaltgambler

within 48 hrs developed paralysis in his right side, especially in his right forearm and hand. The condition worsened to the point he cannot use his hand at all and has very limited movement on that side of his body.
....

Seems a bit strange for Guillian-Barre. classically GBS is presents with hand and feet paraesthesia ("pins and needles"), then lower limb weakness that ascends over time to involve the trunk and arms, and possibly ultimately the muscles of respiration and the airway. Unilateral permanent involvement of one arm without the antecedent paraesthesia would be unusual enough to call the diagnosis into question.

As for vaccine side-effects. Medicine is all about playing the odds. I've looked after 2 people with life threatening reactions to paracetamol (acetaminophen or 'tylenol'). Not overdoses, life-threatening unheralded allergic reactions. Are you going to stay off Tylenol also?
The chance of a significant adverse reaction from the 'flu vaccination is several orders of magnitude less than actually dying of the 'flu, especially if you're over 60, or if you have other co-morbidities (diabetes, heart failure, COPD, etc) .

There is a fundamental paradox in the anti-vaxx arguments. We doctors supposedly are part of some great conspiracy of knowingly pushing vaccinations purely for evil financial reasons, but simultaneously vaccinate ourselves and our kids because we are ignorant dupes.
The anti-vaxxers need to argue either we're evil masterminds OR ignorant dupes, they can't have it both ways............................

[flipper35]

I know it is rare, but for me I am 3 for 3 on the flu shot and for all intents and purposes the flu shot isn't that effective. Some of the others are. MMR, Whooping Cough, Polio can all be pretty debilitating and they are far more proven to be effective.

[Tobra]

Stay off tylenol, yes.

Do your own research regarding efficacy of flu vaccine, also yes. They guess wrong more often than not what strains to include. So you get the risk of the flu vaccine and the reward of still being vulnerable to the dominant strain

[asphaltgambler]

aap1966 - the diagnosis must be correct as liability has been established, then compensation. FWIW - in Virginia confirming / proving liability is tough. Its not something like calling the injury lawer on 1 of the TV comercials that frequent daytime local television here.

Just tabling this for discussion for the brain trust.......

[GH85Carrera]

I have been getting the flu vaccination shot for the last 20 years. Never even a slight problem with it.

I have had the flu twice in my life. Once about 40 years ago and again about 5 years ago. Both times I was miserable. I will risk the flu shot as the only logical thing to do.

It is certainly not a panacea, but better than nothing. I had a shingles vaccination, and a pneumonia shot.

[drkshdw]

I've never had a flu shot and last time I had the flu was when I was in grade school. My parents and siblings on the other hand are righteous about getting their shot every year and every year every one of them get the flu. Never fails. But that ONE time you do get sick, you'll wish you had gotten the shot!

[red-beard]

The ex-Mrs Beard was a Medical Technologist (4 year degree people running the lab). She refused to get the flu vaccine because of GBS