Time to crank back up the Caliber War!

[Por_sha911]

Past comments heard in many places:
.22LR for CCW is good if being attacked by a squirrel.
.380 Auto is a 'mouse gun' so don't even bother.
9 MM is all you need because of new ammunition technology?
Nothing less than 45 ACP to be sure to drop the drug crazed freak breaking into your home?
.357 or .44 Magnum if you need to take down Bigfoot or shoot terrorists with body armour or you are a sissy!

Notice I missed one?

.40 Cal.

Check this out:
https://www.foxnews.com/lifestyle/colorado-man-shoots-bear-home-40-caliber-pistol?dicbo=v2-9c5e7a6db0da47b8c36225f6b667b038

[pwd72s]

Wow...even a .40 S&W (Short and weak) can do the job...given enough rounds. But shouldn't he have just called the police and waited for them to show?

[Bill Douglas]

.25 Cal if you wear a skirt.

[MRM]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

.25 Cal if you wear a skirt.

Like James Bond?

[red-beard]

[MRM]

For years the High Standard .22 target pistol was the CIA's handgun of choice. It used to be said that if you were confronted by an adversary waving a .22, you needed to be very wary. He was either an extraordinarily well trained killer, or an out of control amateur. Either one was too dangerous to tangle with.

https://medium.com/war-is-boring/the-cia-still-probably-still-uses-some-of-the-high-standard-spy-pistols-it-bought-during-world-war-9a84e2ab37a5

[Bill Douglas]

Originally Posted by MRM

Like James Bond?

He doesn't wear skirts?

[craigster59]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

.25 Cal if you wear a skirt.

I've got a little Baretta Jetfire with tilt up barrel that hurts like a mother when you're shot in the kneecap.

[Bill Douglas]

Originally Posted by craigster59

I've got a little Baretta Jetfire with tilt up barrel that hurts like a mother when you're shot in the kneecap.

Yeah, I wouldn't want to be hit in the kneecap with one. Especially if I was being chased by a bear. This is my one. A bit scruffy, but it was cheap.

[id10t]

At the other end.... .54 425gr maxi-ball

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

He doesn't wear skirts?

It's called a kilt when he does it.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by id10t

At the other end.... .54 425gr maxi-ball

I was going to post, unless you're hunting flies and mosquitos, your caliber had better start with a 5. But I see you're on board!

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by MRM

For years the High Standard .22 target pistol was the CIA's handgun of choice. It used to be said that if you were confronted by an adversary waving a .22, you needed to be very wary. He was either an extraordinarily well trained killer, or an out of control amateur. Either one was too dangerous to tangle with.

The Israeli Mossad as well.

I know a lot of Navy SEALS and former Army folks: As I have written here before, they all say that no one like to get shot and that placement is key, which requires familiarity and practice.

I don't like to shoot .45 caliber pistols anymore, so I have nothing but 9mm in the house. The one exception is the Ruger Vaquero in .45 Long Colt. I shoot it once a month, generally 10 rounds, more if I think I need it.

There are solid reasons I prefer a revolver in certain circumstances.

[id10t]

Originally Posted by masraum

I was going to post, unless you're hunting flies and mosquitos, your caliber had better start with a 5. But I see you're on board!

Yup. Think if I go larger it will be a smoothbore though... Hit the range with it again today, prior to going and helping my son work on my darn truck clutch/trans issue (we're replacing master/slave cylinders, fighting 30 years of rust has not been fun, finally after 18 hours got the last bolt out and the trans still won't move... argh)

A .530 230ish grain round ball wrapped in a .012 patch over 50ish gr of 3Fg powder (a full 308 case, so somewhere between 53 and 55gr water capacity, subtract 3% or so for BP grains-equivalents) is a pussy cat to shoot, relatively. Upping that to a 100ish grain hunting charge (ie, two 308 cases full of powder) and it still isn't too bad but you know you are shooting a .54. The 425 maxi with a 50ish gr load is about like a 12ga shotgun shooting high brass or buckshot or slugs. With a 90gr load (3 223 cases full) I can only shoot 2 or 3, and my recoil loving son will shoot one or two more than me just to prove a point. Neither of us have gone to the max load of 120gr and don't really see any benefit in doing so.

Before I got this I didn't realize just how much I really wanted a front stuffer rifle, and while I thought that one would suffice I find myself lusting after a different one than I have now (the synthetic stock is not bad, just extremely light and so the rifle has no balance to it) in probably 50 caliber (more variety of bullet choices, about only cal big box stores and even some online vendors carry). After burning 3/4 of a pound of powder I also think I need a small caliber rifle - .36 or .31/32 - and a smoothbore somewhere between .62 and .75 (20ga to 10ga), though for the shotgun I've got a possible plan to convert a old single shot cartridge gun

[rusnak]

Include me in the caliber de-escalation as well. Less recoil, and experts whom I trust say the 9mm has more velocity and very similar penetration to the .45 ACP. And I agree with the comment that it's about shot placement. Less recoil means quicker recovery. I'm also thinking a two shot double tap better. My HK VP 9mm is the last line of defense. OTOH, the first line of defense is a 00 buck load with a Benelli M4 so maybe I'm a hypocrite.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

The Israeli Mossad as well.

I know a lot of Navy SEALS and former Army folks: As I have written here before, they all say that no one like to get shot and that placement is key, which requires familiarity and practice.

I don't like to shoot .45 caliber pistols anymore, so I have nothing but 9mm in the house. The one exception is the Ruger Vaquero in .45 Long Colt. I shoot it once a month, generally 10 rounds, more if I think I need it.

There are solid reasons I prefer a revolver in certain circumstances.

Agree on all of the above.
I carry 9 but love to shoot my Ruger 45LC when I want the extra adrenaline.



I was just amazed that this guy took down a decent size bear with a .40!

[speeder]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

Agree on all of the above.
I carry 9 but love to shoot my Ruger 45LC when I want the extra adrenaline.



I was just amazed that this guy took down a decent size bear with a .40!

Yep. He must have gotten a lucky shot in the armpit that hit its heart or something.

[Wetwork]

10mm Glock seems to be the hands down winner in the Alaska/Montana "Oh crap a charging brown bear?" Not the 9's or 44'mags. Seems many hard, fast hits on critter is king. Google is your friend.-WW
ps. Humans aren't bears.

[Por_sha911]

But some folks who carry have the concern that a meth-head is closer to a bear than a human (which perpetuates the caliber wars continuing).

[ledhedsymbols]

I've retired all our handspoons except for 9mm for defense/carry. Here's why:
#1 Mrs. Ledhed has a Beretta Nano in 9mm. It's HER EDC the she chose.
#2 9mm is cheap and easy to shoot. If you can't hit what you are aiming at, caliber debate is mall ninja BS. This is the biggie...
#3 9mm Critical Duty rounds are not something I ever hope to get in my body EVER.

In thousands of rounds, her little Beretta has never failed to fire or function. I don't care for the trigger feel, but it's plenty good enough. It also was about $250 on sale about eight Christmases ago, so it's tough to beat the price.

In the end, it's better to have a .22LR than to yell STOP!