Flatbutts Inconvenient Truth
 

It's time to come clean...as a DIY carpenter...I suck. I can't cut a straight line free hand. I just can't do it.

I just finished a decked walkway and if you look closely you'll get dizzy.

What sort of saw are you using?

Most of the cuts are with a DeWalt circular saw. The big cuts on the 6x6 landscaping ties are done with a chain saw.

You would think that a circular saw would be easy to cut a straight line with, but that has not been my experience. I can get a mostly straight line with a CS, but I have to have a link marked out and a laser focus on the line. I've found that the best way to cut a straight line with a CS is by having some sort of straight edge screwed, clamped, whatever to the thing that I'm trying to cut that I can use as a fence.

What I really want/need is a track saw. Either of us could cut a straight line with a track saw!

Chainsaw, you're on your own. I know that hand saws can end up cutting a curved line if the teeth aren't right and they need to be sharpened and set. I would assume that a chainsaw may be similar.

+1 Steve but it is a mystery to me. With the chain saw I'm sure it's the unbalanced weight that causes my lines to waiver. No matter how much I try to compensate it's no joy.

With the circular saw my sheets are in the wind. I have no explanation.

Worm saw.
You're welcome.




EDIT: I have trouble cutting straight with a conventional circular saw when using an aggressive carbide bit toothed blade with a large kerf.
Which most of us use, erroneously in many cases.
But with a worm saw, I've found it much easier to keep a cut straight.

A track saw works great also.

How does that make a difference?

I have a Festool track saw and dang is that thing wonderful. Any contractor that cuts doors down or cuts laminate countertops in the field would be foolish not to invest in one; clean cuts on all 8 edges and with a vacuum, minimal dust.

<iframe width="645" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/uCM1seqnAuY" title="How exactly does a posi trac rear end in a plymouth work?" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" referrerpolicy="strict-origin-when-cross-origin" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Worm drive saw is heavier and more powerful... so it can reflect your unsteadiness more.. A guide is helpful, though I've seen Heavy construction carpenters freehand laser straight cuts.

Cross cut framing use a chop saw... or use a speed square as a guide for quick cuts..

Are most of these cuts rips or cross cuts?

Most are cross cuts. I have a small table saw for rips. I can't use it for the cross cuts as it is in a spot that won't let me X cut anything over 3 feet long and the gate is only good up to 22 inches.

edit: I did get a quote from a contractor but it was outrageous.

Don't beat yourself up, flat. You showed up and made a thing using tools and your hands. Saved yourself a fortune in labor from an unknown source in the meantime.

You'll notice every mismatched corner and unused pencil mark.

but......very few others will notice. And if there's anything that just jumps out at you and you can't live with, step back for a few days and go through some ideas in your head to make the project work better for you.

There's a lot of ways to bury bodies in fab and construction work.

Just use a speed square for a guide.. set your blade where needed, square everything up.. and cut...

You can also use the circ saw on the 6X just use a speed square, flip 3 time, and just use a sawzall for the piece in the center if it doesn't break on its own

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1759790548.jpg

I use a speed square too. Makes life much easier !

I too am unable to keep to a line when ripping or cross cutting panels unless I use a square or batten clamped or fastened to the piece. Life got so much easier once I acknowledged that truth.

If you're watching the blade on the line, it's easy to get a wobbly cut.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1759794706.jpg


If you watch the front of the base plate, your cuts will be much straigher, and you'll not have sawdust flying towards your eyes

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1759794706.jpg

Kinda like driving on the track-
Are you watching only the track immediately in front, or are you looking all the way to the next corner?

Look far ahead, and you're driving smoothly.

Yeah, but holy carp, Festool is PROUD of their stuff. I'm sure it's top quality though.

Actually, comparing the prices of festool to DeWalt and others on Amazon they aren't that much more.

There are also so universal tracks that can be used on most circular saws, but they get mixed/moderate reviews which isn't surprising.

Woodworking doesn't have to be prefect. Just think "fit for purpose".

It’s not just having a track to guide it, it has zero clearance methods built in so you get very clean cuts in veneers and laminates too.

They aren’t much more than the lesser brands in track saws, so why go with one that isn’t as good? Oh and my friend wasn’t using his, so he gave it to me for nothing- wouldn’t take anything for it, so I got that going for me!

They make a real cool track saw especially for crosscuts in framing lumber, but you would need to be doing a lot of building to justify the cost. Probably “pay” for itself if you were building a deck or addition though.

How old is your circular saw? I have a old Craftsman one, couldn't cut a straight line to save my life. Turns out the bushings (too cheap a saw to have bearings) were worn and the blade wobbled around. Picked up a different saw, and no issues at all.

I too am just a wood butcher, not a carpenter. I can make some basic stuff, but it sure ain't work I would accept if I was paying for it.

That is what I do. But when the guide mark on the base plate runs off of the wood I must watch the blade. And now that I think of it most of the wobble occurs at that point. hmmm

+1

this thread gives me wood... (wood magazine)

https://www.woodmagazine.com/project-plans/workshop-jig/jigs-fixtures/zero-clearance-cutoff-guide-downloadable-plan

This one's fancy, but simple. I couldn't cut a straight line for the life of me. Usually just find a straight board and clamp it over whatever I'm cutting as a guide. Makes the cut piece more stable too.

My brother worked as a carpenter, and even a trim carpenter doing crown moldings in Antebellum mansion restorations. He can use an old skill saw and cut a straight line and it looks like a table saw cut. He also likes to camp in the woods.

I did not get those skills and my idea of camping is a hotel with no TV or internet.
He still struggles with his cell phone, and does not use a computer. I took to computers in the 80s, and it became a large part of my profession.

I think like anything else, its just " seat time " If you are really trying, the more you do , the more you will find ways to improve and up your technique etc.
Hack carpenter here .. I really appreciate the skills when i work with someone who is good at what they do . I always pay attention

I’ve been a carpenter for 30 years. Ask me to do plumbing, no way. I suck.

+1 on the worm drive. Mine is an older Skil 77, no issues with straight cuts. I think it is the added weight and balance.

Well, at least you're building something. You might get a C on execution, but you get an A for trying.

BTW "I can't," should be, "I can't yet."

I'm guessing the Worm-drive vs direct drive difference is like the difference in trying to turn a 17' Cadillac from the trunk vs turning a mid-engined 914.

The handle for the worm drive is
1) way out back (looks like 4-6" back from the rear edge of the blade).
2) a tiny change in your wrist shouldn't make much difference in the direction of cut. It would require a much larger change which should be much easier to feel. But I think the worm drive is also quite a bit heavier which is not great for you.

The handle for the sidewinder/direct drive saw is practically behind the blade when looking at the saw from the side. So a tiny twist of your wrist can amount to a big change in the angle of the blade.

worm drive
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1759864554.jpg

sidewinder
https://beavertools.com/media/catalo..._1-skilsaw.jpg

That that all means to me is that you/I/a bunch of us, need a guide of some sort to keep us on the straight and narrow.

Semi-related automotive story. I sold my old '88 911 where you sit pretty central to the vehicle. So when the car turns, you feel like you're turning with it. I then bought a Mazda Miata. Sitting in the driver's seat with the door open, I could stick my arm out and touch the rear tire. When you're sitting in the car, especially me with the seat nearly all of the way back, you feel like you're sitting on the rear axle. If you look in this pic, the side-view mirror looks like it's pretty close to the middle of the car. When I first started driving a miata, it felt "weird" because when you'd turn the car, it felt (to me) like I was being swung around behind the car which was a result, I think, of my seating position being farther rearward from the center of rotation of the car vs the 911 where it felt like you were nearly at or much closer to the center of rotation.

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/c...-s-986x603.jpg

I have at Kreg guide for ripping... it wasn't to much coin, and has a plate that fits to my DeWalt circ saw and follows the guide..

Festool is to much for my skill level

I've seen the Kreg and a few other universal tracks. I've seen some very positive reviews for some and also negative reviews for every one. I usually go with the average, because I know that 1) you can't please some people and 2) some people are so ham-fisted that they'd screw up using a hammer.

I assume you like your Kreg. You didn't say "it sucks" so it must be at least decent.

Clamp a straight edge to your stock to make a fence. Your sidewinder or worm drive will cut as straight as a table saw

It doesn't suck at all.. Its aluminum extrusions with a sled your saw ride in...I can't imagine the people having valid reasons for making negative reviews... its simple... If you think about what you are trying to do, and set up the proper tools properly.. it just works..

I've used it to make multiple passes on 2.5" black walnut used for an epoxy table,, and you can barely tell the saw passed 3-4 times.. accurately repeating a cut is a +

It seems that the kreg straight edge guide is well loved and quite a bit cheaper than their accucut. It's available in 4' or 8'

https://a.co/d/eRGqHYN

This is my baby, my main workhorse. Has to be around 25yrs old. It's a beast. Still cranking. Did a brush change on it a few years ago.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1760215374.jpg

I saw this on FB yesterday (and 50 others similar), but here's the YT version. (I probably wouldn't just use CA glue, but that's just me)

<iframe width="450" height="800" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/46VtkYb9u-c" title="simple jjg for circular saw. #woodworking #classicwood #wood #woodscraft #diy #woodwork #tools" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" referrerpolicy="strict-origin-when-cross-origin" allowfullscreen></iframe>

One of the key bits is that the stop that holds the jig square is (like in the video above) cut off by the saw itself so that the cut edge is also a guide of exactly where the blade will be cutting so you can line up your cut-line with the edge of that stop.

I've seen several variations.

I saw one that was basically just a T-square where the long bit was a wide-ish (looked like 4" wide) plywood (more dimensionally stable) connected with 4 screws. That version is probably best for long rip cuts that are 4' or longer.

For the models with the triangle, I assume those would be built smallish (less than 12" or maybe 16" for crosscut).

I saw a few where the triangular bit was an isosceles triangle so that the jig can be use for 90º or 45º cuts which is convenient.

I saw some where the triangle was cut from one piece of plywood which probably adds more rigidity and makes it easier to build.

One of the nice changes that I saw had the base of the triangle where the stop was cut with a slot that you could put a quick clamp in to hold the guide for you (something like this)
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1760972305.jpg

I saw one similar where the saw was set at 45º so it could be used for bevel cuts which is cool, but something that I hardly ever do.

I saw some fancier versions where the triangle was adjustable which is great, but I like the fixed, guaranteed square cut from a non-adjustable version.

I also saw one or two where the thing was made like a track saw, one long piece of plywood with a narrow fence attached where the edge of the plywood was cutoff by the circular saw which allows the saw to slide on the jig, and the bottom of the jig supports the top of the wood being cut for a cleaner edge, especially on plywood.

Of course, I don't think that any of these would help if you'd built a deck, and needed to cut all of the ends of the deck boards straight after the fact. But they would help with many/most other crosscuts or long rip cuts.

Stuff happens. Carpentry is an art and for those of us who don't do it every day, a speed square and a worm saw make it look like we actually sorta know stuff. My cuts will never be laser straight but... straight enough to make decent joints that will stand the test of time.