Where do you think the sports car market is heading ?

[jhynesrockmtn]

I recently sold my 356. I was tired of having something worth close to $100k I didn't use much and was constantly worried might turn into something worth close to $50k if the market for vintage Porsches crashed. I have soured on more modern Porsche's with my wife's well maintained Macan falling apart as it gets close to 100k miles. After selling the 356 I bought my first proper BMW. I was initially shooting for an 80s era car but this popped up. German market Ti with the M52 and 5 speed. At a lowly 170hp it scoots and handles, but still has AC and heated seats. A nice compromise and at well under $15k, a relative bargain for a fun and unique car. I'll drive a sports car until I can't get in or out of it.

[911 Rod]

Personally I don't care.
Spending a couple hundred grand on a car is not on my list at this stage of my life.
I guess I could sell both of my cars and buy one, but I enjoy the visceral feel of the older cars.

[aschen]

My speculation is downward pressure from economic downturn with be more or less at equilibrium with upward pressure from tariffs and inflation.

As I mentioned prior I struggled with 718/981 purchase for a year or so basically in the same spot as you. Always considered myself a value shopper with is tough in a climate of no good deals.

Have lived with a 2018 Cayman GTS for a few years now, I think its a good enough car to pay the bit extra and start have fun while you can.

I paid 71k for a "stripped" 18 6mt in 2022 with 10 k miles. MSRP was 87 I think. I think there is a lot of negotiation room in online asking prices. Bring a trailer and Cars and bids show the cars real free market value IMHO.

[aschen]

Also I think the Manual requirement substantially slows potential depreciation in any context.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by jhynesrockmtn

I recently sold my 356. I was tired of having something worth close to $100k I didn't use much and was constantly worried might turn into something worth close to $50k if the market for vintage Porsches crashed. I have soured on more modern Porsche's with my wife's well maintained Macan falling apart as it gets close to 100k miles. After selling the 356 I bought my first proper BMW. I was initially shooting for an 80s era car but this popped up. German market Ti with the M52 and 5 speed. At a lowly 170hp it scoots and handles, but still has AC and heated seats. A nice compromise and at well under $15k, a relative bargain for a fun and unique car. I'll drive a sports car until I can't get in or out of it.

That will never happen with air cooled Porsches.

[Baz]

Lot to consider here.

I have my late mother's 2008 Ford Taurus SEL with only 21,555 original miles. Garage kept and religiously serviced by our local Ford dealer.

99% condition.....lots of wonderful features - too many to name. Absolutely a dream to drive, as long as you're not expecting it to be a sports car.

But I already have my Volvo wagon for a "passenger car" plus my Silverado for work and 4 Porsches to scratch the itch.

Why not just sell the Taurus?

The answer is I would never get a price equal to it's value.

The 'solution' is to just keep, drive, and enjoy it - which is what I am doing.

Maybe in 5 years time I can sell it and in the mean time have derived whatever loss in value it's depreciated by then.

But my goodness - transportation-wise - what a great car!

[Seahawk]

While I know, at 69, I am no ones radar for car buying habits, I remain opinionated

I DD a 30 year-old SUV that drives like a sled, is noisy and gets two dinosaurs to the mile around town...but I love it and it makes me smile: Mainly because I bought it nearly eight years ago for $10k and have maybe another $8k in it.

Like my DD, other than lust and cool, there are few performance reasons to own an air-cooled Porsche...perhaps to go slow fast and work on those numbers...I don't know.

The only air-cooled Porsche I would consider is a 964...I had a 1994 964 Targa which I would still own if I had not been run off the road. Even then, at the current price point I'd probably not want to drive/own one of my favorite heroes again.

I don't think the market for older Porsche's will, as a friend of mine says, 'Acapulco' (think Wide World of Sports cliff diving...I know) because of frankly low production numbers, they can keep up with modern traffic and they are and will remain iconic.

In my parts of the world, Maryland and SC, there is a strong market for older, small trucks and SUVs...I see at least 2 80's/90's Ford Rangers a day being driven by young men that are absolutely perfect, annoyingly so.

[jhynesrockmtn]

Originally Posted by Zeke

That will never happen with air cooled Porsches.

I hope you are right. I still have my 911 a couple of 914s.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by Zeke

That will never happen with air cooled Porsches.

Maybe. But a lot of people said that about muscle cars too. I don’t see how $60k for a beater SC is sustainable, but we shall see.

[wdfifteen]

This thread seems to be going in two directions: where the new sports car market is going and where the vintage sports car market is going.

In my opinion, the new sports car market is going away from being driver's cars toward being powerful, fast, dangerous cars whose controls are so nanny-laden that any dilettante can think he can drive one (and probably get killed in it). I'm not interested in them, so I don't care.

The vintage car market is just going to keep going up in value. Sometimes fast, sometimes slow. I think this will happen even as those of us who were around when air cooled Porsches were new age out. We can't compare what will happen to the market for cars that are perfectly capable of 125mph+ with the market for Model Ts and such that are hazards on modern roads and highways. They will still be useful, fun cars for many years to come.

[Cajundaddy]

My crystal ball is opaque.

We are currently seeing a lot of volatility and both housing and car prices seem high but... For the next 10 years I expect "desirable" Porsches to hold their value relative to other assets. These include classic aircooled 911s, 987.2, 997.2, GT3, GT4s, possibly the Cayman GTS 4.0L simply because they are amazing cars and people want them.

5 years from now when all of the taxis, shuttles, busses, trucks, Uber, are autonomous self driving at very low cost, I expect people still driving will choose a car that makes the experience special rather than an economy appliance. But I could be wrong...

We choose to own and drive these cars because of the way they make us feel, not as some sort of retirement 401K plan. If you can afford it without a loan, pick out a nice Porsche and enjoy!

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by jhynesrockmtn

I hope you are right. I still have my 911 a couple of 914s.

with 4 911s, 3 of which comprise my 401K, I hope so too. One I will never sell so I never have to worry about that.

[Rapewta]

I think a lot of us remember 1990 when the collectable high end cars went south.
You have to know when to get out and not get stuck with a ruinous loans.

Now back in the early 70's I invested in a Water Bed company and all it end up doing is liquiddate
my assets.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

Maybe. But a lot of people said that about muscle cars too. I don’t see how $60k for a beater SC is sustainable, but we shall see.

Where do you see that muscle cars tanked? I'm not considering the overpaying frenzy of auctions. If that comes back down to earth that's fine, but even older Corvettes of the >C3 era are not depreciating. Maybe not the best example comparing the 70's and 80's to the 60's era of chrome bumper muscle cars.

I'm talking about Goats and 442's and 427's. Any big block manual seems expense to me.

[ramonesfreak]

Easy to say values won’t drop when you’re in California where air-cooled specialists are plentiful. They are not plentiful here and when my mechanic is gone which will be very soon (opened his shop in 1974 when I was 2), my car will be a giant brick if things go south. Not all of us want to or can fix them. And I dont have a budget for shipping my car a thousand miles to a specialist. One could argue that those with money who can afford to ship a car or engine around the country for work will still want these cars but do millionaires really care about my SC? I doubt it. Any decent mechanic can work on a corvette or mopar. This issue has been on my mind for a while now. If I was in the market for my first air-cooled, I would likely pass after thinking this through. I don’t see the value going anywhere but down except for the collectible early cars. I hope I’m wrong but that’s my gut feeling

[Alan A]

So I look in here at the title and on this page see two pictures. One of a bmw sedan and the other a ford taurus..

You all have very different ideas as to what a sports car is than I do…

[Baz]

Originally Posted by Alan A

So I look in here at the title and on this page see two pictures. One of a bmw sedan and the other a ford taurus..

You all have very different ideas as to what a sports car is than I do…

[Cajundaddy]

Here are the current ones.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by Zeke

Where do you see that muscle cars tanked? I'm not considering the overpaying frenzy of auctions. If that comes back down to earth that's fine, but even older Corvettes of the >C3 era are not depreciating. Maybe not the best example comparing the 70's and 80's to the 60's era of chrome bumper muscle cars.

I'm talking about Goats and 442's and 427's. Any big block manual seems expense to me.

I went to the Hagerty market guides and punched in a few of the greats like a 1967 GTO, 1969 Camaro SS 396, 1970 Mustang Boss 302, etc. Nearly all of them skyrocketed in 2010-ish, plateaued, spiked again during CV, and are now back down at/below their previous highs. The GTO for instance is below its 2010 timeframe valuation. If you have Hagerty insurance their valuation tools are very interesting. So maybe saying “tanked” is too strong of language, but they certainly aren’t going up like some other classes of cars. As Patrick noted the muscle cars are different than a Model A because they can still be used as a real car, so I don’t see them vanishing from the collector car scene. But because this is a generational hobby, we are already seeing the next generation choosing a 1995 NSX instead of a 1969 SS 396 when their bitcoin hits.

[dmcummins]

I currently have an itch for a 69 or so mustang. Don’t know why except I’ve never owned one.

So prices will probably rise, unless I buy one.

I sold these when I thought $25,000 was high. But that was over 15 years ago.