Terrorist Attack kills 34 Youths in Lebanon

[Hugh R]

Someone bottom line this fighting for me. Has Isreal ever attacked lebanon or any other country, or taken land unilaterally, or has it been in response to attacks by others first? I know Isreal took the Golan Heights because they got tired of morter rounds being dropped on them from the Golan Heights. Please enlighten me.

[Mulhollanddose]

This guy can be trusted, ex--professor, ex-anti-war organizer, now Conservative.

[jdm61]

Originally posted by fastpat
[B]Eh?
[b]
Ah, an apologist for Israeli terrorism, should have recognized it right away.
[b]
No, that was the group of Israeli agents spotted in New Jersey.

What gave the British the right to give Palestinian land to the Zionists in the first place?

Ahhhhh.........okay. I understand now. We are being PC, so we need to use the term "Zionist" instead of "Dirty Jew"..Ok. And since we are splitting hairs, I guess that means that if the Israelis stop using F16's and M109 self propelled guns and start strapping Semtex to their chests and blowing up Beirut buses and cafes, then they too can be called "freedom fighters"? Or do they have to go to Argentina and blow up a Muslim day care center in order to truly be rightwous warriors in your eyes? As far as the Jews go, It is my belief that they get a mulligan when they go after ANYONE whose stated mission is to wipe them from the face of the earth......and NO, I am not Jewish, FYI.

Oh, and as for the British, they didn't give anything to the Zionists. The UN did. And why did the British and French "steal" it from the Turks, who "stole" it from the Arabs, who "stole" it from the Greeks, who "stole" it BACK from the Romans, etc, etc, etc. The Jews just threw out some squatters who had been living on their land....they even made it legal....lol.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by Hugh R
Someone bottom line this fighting for me. Has Isreal ever attacked lebanon or any other country, or taken land unilaterally, or has it been in response to attacks by others first? I know Isreal took the Golan Heights because they got tired of morter rounds being dropped on them from the Golan Heights. Please enlighten me.

Google the Stern Gang and/or Irgun with regard to a village named Deir Yassin. Keeping in mind that this will be but one or two examples of thousands.

[jdm61]

Originally posted by fastpat
Google the Stern Gang and/or Irgun with regard to a village named Deir Yassin. Keeping in mind that this will be but one or two examples of thousands.

And Google Andersonville while you are at it....THOUSANDS? You seem to know a lot about the "atrocities" committed by Jews. Is your general knowlege as comprehensive? Irgun and Stern gang are considered by many to be terrorist organizations....but I refer by to my mulligan comment. If almost half of your ehtnic/religious group had gone up in smoke, that might make you a bit radical......so what is your point? And if your point is that Hezb"Allah fired rockets at northern Israel because they feared for the survival of all Shi'ia, then you are full of Shi'ite.....lol Israelis have not occupied Lebanon for 6 years and Hezb'Allah runs the place. They were merely acting on instructions from Iran so that they could be relevant again on the world stage. Well, they got what they wanted and some things that they didn't. maybe.
Incidentally, Fastpat.......I find a certain incongruency in your stated political views and your views on Israel defending herself. Do you actually sympathize with a group whose stated purpose is to convert, enslave or exterminate all infidels and establish a world wide theocracy based on the teachings of Ayatollah Rudollah Khomeini or are you just a virulent anti-Semite?

[fastpat]

Originally posted by jdm61
And Google Andersonville while you are at it....

I'll match your irrelevancy with Camp Douglas, Illinois. There now, feel better?

THOUSANDS? You seem to know a lot about the "atrocities" committed by Jews.

These events need to be in the public record more often, particularly when the Israeli's are again committing atrocities by the thousands.

Is your general knowlege as comprehensive?

I learn something new everyday, do you?

Irgun and Stern gang are considered by many to be terrorist organizations....

Mass murdering terrorist gangs, Israeli gangs. Menachem Begin's gang.

but I refer by to my mulligan comment. If almost half of your ehtnic/religious group had gone up in smoke, that might make you a bit radical......so what is your point?

Yeah, and the British murdered thousands of my relatives in Scotland and Ireland, some as recently as post World War Two. I'm not an advocate of murdering any englishman I find. If you are an American, then act like one, if you have loyalty to another country, go there to live.

And if your point is that Hezb"Allah fired rockets at northern Israel because they feared for the survival of all Shi'ia, then you are full of Shi'ite.....lol Israelis have not occupied Lebanon for 6 years and Hezb'Allah runs the place. They were merely acting on instructions from Iran so that they could be relevant again on the world stage. Well, they got what they wanted and some things that they didn't. maybe.

Riiiight.

[jdm61]

Originally posted by fastpat
[B]I'll match your irrelevancy with Camp Douglas, Illinois. There now, feel better?

[b]
These events need to be in the public record more often, particularly when the Israeli's are again committing atrocities by the thousands.

[b]
I learn something new everyday, do you?

[b]
Mass murdering terrorist gangs, Israeli gangs. Menachem Begin's gang.

[b]
Yeah, and the British murdered thousands of my relatives in Scotland and Ireland, some as recently as post World War Two. I'm not an advocate of murdering any englishman I find. If you are an American, then act like one, if you have loyalty to another country, go there to live.

Riiiight.

Let's not forget Elmira. And chances are your "relatives" in Scotland and Ireland spent about as much time killing each other as they did running from or fighting the ENGLISH just like my relatives.......that is the correct term. There were no modern British until the early 1700's. And anyone "murdered" post WW II Scotland or Northen Ireland (as the British were not in Ireland in 1946) would have fallen into the category of criminal or terrorist. And i am loyal to America. As for Israel, they are our allies. Aside from the fact that there are a number of American expats who are now Israelis, their interests are aligned with our interests. The are the sworn enemies of people who have vowed to kill us. As for being loyal to America or moving to another country, that rings somewhat hollow coming from a guy who claims to be in favor of secession from the US. And WHY should the exploits of the Stern Gang or Irgun be in the "public record"? They are historical fact. You failed to answer my question, but your continued ranting against Israelis combined with your other comments lead me to the conclusion that you are some kind of Neo-Nazi or white supremacist. And as with a lot of guys like you, you have read enough so that you can spout enough out of context fact to"support" your twisted little opinions. Why don';t you get yourself a blog or cable public access show so that you can play with your fellow pinheads and not disturb the rest of us? I was cutting you a tiny bit of slack on the outside chance that you might have been from the Middle East, but as I now know that you are probably an Ulsterman from South Carolina, I have absolutely no use for you or your opinions.

[red-beard]

Originally posted by fintstone
I've met his wife. She is far too intelligent to fall for such obvious propaganda.

Thank-you! You are far too kind, but correct in every way!

I look forward to seeing you again!

James

[fastpat]

Originally posted by jdm61
You failed to answer my question,

I responded to your question. You simply don't want to hear my answer.

but your continued ranting against Israelis combined with your other comments lead me to the conclusion that you are some kind of Neo-Nazi or white supremacist.

Well, well, there it is, the anti-Semitic card. Not very well played, either. I expected it, as usual I can tell you that under internet rules, anyone invoking the "NAZI" ad hominem loses their argument instantly. More so in this case since you're attempting to thwart a hard look at Israeli terrorism.

And as with a lot of guys like you, you have read enough so that you can spout enough out of context fact to"support" your twisted little opinions.

My facts, which they are, are wholly in context here. We're discussing an Israel terrorist pogrom in Lebanon and someone asked the question, I responded with the information. That you don't like it is just too bad.

Why don';t you get yourself a blog or cable public access show so that you can play with your fellow pinheads and not disturb the rest of us?

I believe it is you who needs to do that, it's becoming apparent you're here to attempt to silence criticism of Israel, certainly it's not to provide information.

I was cutting you a tiny bit of slack on the outside chance that you might have been from the Middle East, but as I now know that you are probably an Ulsterman from South Carolina, I have absolutely no use for you or your opinions.

Then bugger off, and stop reading in this forum. I don't think anyone has tied your arse to Pelican OTD.

[jdm61]

Originally posted by fastpat
[B]I responded to your question. You simply don't want to hear my answer.

[b]
Well, well, there it is, the anti-Semitic card. Not very well played, either. I expected it, as usual I can tell you that under internet rules, anyone invoking the "NAZI" ad hominem loses their argument instantly. More so in this case since you're attempting to thwart a hard look at Israeli terrorism.

[b]
My facts, which they are, are wholly in context here. We're discussing an Israel terrorist pogrom in Lebanon and someone asked the question, I responded with the information. That you don't like it is just too bad.

[b]
I believe it is you who needs to do that, it's becoming apparent you're here to attempt to silence criticism of Israel, certainly it's not to provide information.


Then bugger off, and stop reading in this forum. I don't think anyone has tied your arse to Pelican OTD.

LMAO.....pogrom......you use a Yiddish term to decribe a war against Arabs? funny way to attempt to diffuse any suspicion of anti-semitism. As for the "Anti-Semitic card", you seemd to have played that one yourself. I seriously doubt that you were using the term Zionist in the strictly historical context. Sounded more like the way that the Al Quaedidiots use it. And you did NOT answer my question so i will ask it in a simple and direct fashion that even you can understand and no equivocate on........do you like Jews or not? As for an examination of Israeli POLICY in Lebanon, I am not attempting to silence criticism of Israel in any way. I have little problem with some people who feel that Israel may have overeacted. What I have a problem with is YOU conveniently leaving out the facts regarding not only Hezb'Allah's behavior, but alos the complicity of many of the residents of southern Lebanon. If they consider Hezb'Allah to be their legitimate repesentatives, then how are they all of a sudden "innocent" bystanders. Whi9le i hate to see children injured of killed, the people of that area welcomes Hezb"Allah with open oarms and joined in their mission to destroy Israel. They are now reaping what they sowed.

[snowman]

I think it would be totally justified if Isreal dropped the A bomb on Iran, Syria, and Lebanon. War is war and only the outcome is justified, ie the winner wins, the loser, loses. If someone starts a war with you, you should finish it, as soon and as quickly as possible, with as little loss to your own people as possible. War is NOT a game, there are NO rules.

THe Only reason not to kill every single one of THEM is if they could do the same to you.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by jdm61
LMAO.....pogrom......you use a Yiddish term to decribe a war against Arabs? funny wayto attempt to difuse any suspicion of anit-semitism. As for the "Anti-Semitic card", you seemd to have played that one yourself. I seriously doubt that you were using the term Zionist in the strictly historical context. Sounded more like the way that the Al Quadidiots use it. And you did NOT answer my question so i will ask it in a simple and direct fashion that even you can understand and no equivocate on........do you like Jews or not?

Let's see, do I like Jews? I like some Jews, mostly the ones I know, I have no idea about those whom I do not know. I can, however, tell you that a man's religion, or lack thereof, has never been a deciding factor in who I do or do not like.

Naturally, since we're not talking about Jews here, we're talking about Israeli's, citizens of a foreign country, I find your question simply and completely irrelevant to this discussion, and more than a little racist. It intended to obfuscate the subject of this discussion. It is intended to shut down debate.

And, it is not working.

[jdm61]

Originally posted by snowman
I think it would be totally justified if Isreal dropped the A bomb on Iran, Syria, and Lebanon. War is war and only the outcome is justified, ie the winner wins, the loser, loses. If someone starts a war with you, you should finish it, as soon and as quickly as possible, with as little loss to your own people as possible. War is NOT a game, there are NO rules.

Dang!!!!!!!!! yo'rehardcord, Snowman.....lol. Unfortunately, while Islamic miltants like Hezb'Allah do not have rules when dealing with infidels......or at times with their brother Muslims that they do not agree with..... us westerners do.......sometimes to our own detriment. But that is why we are stuck in the 21st Century and the opposition want to go back to the 9th.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by snowman
I think it would be totally justified if Isreal dropped the A bomb on Iran, Syria, and Lebanon. War is war and only the outcome is justified, ie the winner wins, the loser, loses. If someone starts a war with you, you should finish it, as soon and as quickly as possible, with as little loss to your own people as possible. War is NOT a game, there are NO rules.

THe Only reason not to kill every single one of THEM is if they could do the same to you.

Let's see, 6 million give or take, Israeli's, one billion muslims. Ya' think the Israeli's might be advised to show more restraint?

[jdm61]

Originally posted by fastpat
Let's see, do I like Jews? I like some Jews, mostly the ones I know, I have no idea about those whom I do not know. I can, however, tell you that a man's religion, or lack thereof, has never been a deciding factor in who I do or do not like.

Naturally, since we're not talking about Jews here, we're talking about Israeli's, citizens of a foreign country, I find your question simply and completely irrelevant to this discussion, and more than a little racist. It intended to obfuscate the subject of this discussion. It is intended to shut down debate.

And, it is not working.

Well then do you like miltants (who happen to be Shi'ia Muslims) who strap explosives to their chests and kill children? And to bring up your previous comment about being loyal to America.........Are you naturally sympathetic to a terrorist group that killed 240+ United States Marines and a large number of State Department personnel? Did you conveniently forget that Hezb'Allah made their bones in Lebanon with those two attacks back in '82? You make NO mention of who Israel is fighting, regardless of what tactics they are using. They are at war with a de facto government that has declared war on them. Perhaps they should just handle it in the Roman fashion and sterilize Lebanon to about 20 miles north of the border.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by jdm61
Dang!!!!!!!!! yo'rehardcord, Snowman.....lol. Unfortunately, while Islamic miltants like Hezb'Allah do not have rules when dealing with infidels......or at times with their brother Muslims that they do not agree with..... us westerners do.......sometimes to our own detriment. But that is why we are stuck in the 21st Century and the opposition want to go back to the 9th.

The Israeli's are not and never have been a western country. They are a mideast country settled, currently, mostly by europeans. That is not the same thing.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by jdm61
Well then do you like miltants (who happen to be Shi'ia Muslims) who strap explosives to their chests and kill children?

No more or less than I like Israeli's who used aerial bombardment to continue to steal land from those to which it belongs.

Morally, there is no difference between a suicide bomber and an Israeli Air Force pilot who intentionally kills civilians. And, yes, that has and continues to happen.

And to bring up your previous comment about being loyal to America.........Are you naruarlly sympathetic to a terrorist group that killed 240+ United States Marines and a large number of State Department personnel? Did you conveniently forget that Hezb'Allah made their bones in Lebanon with those two attacks back in '82?

The US government has no business, Constitutional or otherwise, in the mideast. Fortunately, Reagan had the good sense to leave Lebanon after Hezbollah showed him the door.

You're attempting to justify 80 years of US government murder and meddling in the mideast by the several attacks in response to that meddling. That's going to be tough, in fact, that's going to be impossible.

[jdm61]

Originally posted by fastpat
The Israeli's are not and never have been a western country. They are a mideast country settled, currently, mostly by europeans. That is not the same thing.

Gee, Wally.......does that mean that they can't go to the Master Race Spring Dance with us? LMAO Using that logic, we must be Asian, since many of our ancestors were Europeans that settled (or "stole" if you will) a country previously conrtrolled by proto-Chinese, Mongolian and Paleo-Siberian peoples

[munro86]

Your anti-semitic Pat-patently obvious.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by munro86
Your anti-semitic Pat-patently obvious.

No, you are anti-Semitic.

See, I used it with as much force as you did.

You're pretty weak on the intellectual quality as well.