Scary Airport Arrest

[Rodeo]

Originally posted by Seahawk
Rodeo,

Stalin? Communists?
You know what point you are trying to make, don't shy away from it.
Walk tall.

Yes, that the Repub Party has been hijacked by totalitarians.

It's about time the true conservative spoke up, and took their party back.

[Seahawk]

Originally posted by Rodeo
Yes, that the Repub Party has been hijacked by totalitarians.

It's about time the true conservative spoke up, and took their party back.

I remember when I had my first intellectual beer

No kidding, Rodeo, your slinging PolySci 101 terms would be sophomoric if it wasn't so frosh.

I have been to totalitarian countries...you may want to go as well. I bet you would be less inclined to make the comparison.

Ideas, Rodeo.

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by on-ramp
i'm still waiting for something that says it's against the law to carry 10K of cash of you if you havent done anything wrong.

Slopat will not debate anyone, nor will not provide proof either. Kinda like Rodehard and apologies, its just aint gonna happen.

[Rodeo]

Originally posted by Seahawk
I remember when I had my first intellectual beer

No kidding, Rodeo, your slinging PolySci 101 terms would be sophomoric if it wasn't so frosh.

I have been to totalitarian countries...you may want to go as well. I bet you would be less inclined to make the comparison.

Ideas, Rodeo.

In totalitarian countries, the government does what it wants to individuals. If the individauls "do nothing wrong," they have nothing to worry about, as Sammy said.

In free countries, that's not the case.

Quite the opposite.

[Seahawk]

Originally posted by Rodeo
In totalitarian countries, the government does what it wants to individuals. If the individauls "do nothing wrong," they have nothing to worry about, as Sammy said.

In free countries, that's not the case.

Quite the opposite.

Going to go take pics of the Duck Blind, so I'll be back in a few minutes.

So, laws are bad!?!

Free to do what!?!

Quite the opposite to what !?!

I do not fear laws and nothing in this thread ever proved a constitutional law was infringed.

Totalitarian...phhsst.

[Rodeo]

This started with sammy's (oft repeated) rant to the effect of "if you're doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to worry about" when the government peeks into some aspect of your life.

That is the precise opposite of freedom. In free countries, the government needs cause to invade an individual's privacy. The laws not only restrain the individual actions of citizens, they restrain the government from intruding on our lives, or homes, our cars, our telephones, our emails, our bank accounts.

There is no government action against an individual that can't be explained away with "if you're doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to worry about."

But that's not freedom, that's the opposite of freedom.

Today's supposed conservatives seem to never find a government power to regulate people that they don't like (except for gun control).

I don't find anything "conservative" about the continued intrusion of government into our lives.

[SLO-BOB]

Originally posted by Rodeo
In totalitarian countries, the government does what it wants to individuals. If the individauls "do nothing wrong," they have nothing to worry about, as Sammy said.

In free countries, that's not the case.

Quite the opposite.

Since when can we "do what we want" anytime, anywhere in the history of man? Here in the U.S. laws are not the exclusive domain of the Republican party, the Dems have their fairshare too. Believe it or not, most times the two parties even agree on those laws that keep civil order.

What free country has no law? Sounds scary to me.

As far as true conservatives, I've been that all my life. I don't like Bush et al either. I feel a re-alignment is in order. However, just because Republicans favor a "hands-off" approach from Govt doesn't mean we favor no law at all.

Furtheremore, this whole discussion is academic. Since when do you have to break the law to be arrested? Many people who have done nothing wrong get arrested everyday. Law enforcement can arrest those who a merely suspected of a crime, such as the afore mentioned cash toteing, nuke laptop guy. It is up to the courts to decide if he has broken the law. This is nothing new. To confuse due process with "guilty until proven innocent" shows a basic lack of understanding as to how the courts work. It may not be perfect, but it's the best we can do with the limited intellect afforded us by our creator.

[cool_chick]

Slo-bob, I think the point is that we are forced to tell the government if we carry large sums of money. Do you think it's the government's busienss to know about your hard-earned money?

[SLO-BOB]

Originally posted by cool_chick
Slo-bob, I think the point is that we are forced to tell the government if we carry large sums of money. Do you think it's the government's busienss to know about your hard-earned money?

That does seem to be one of the many points made. I believe it is their business to know.

[fintstone]

Originally posted by cool_chick
Slo-bob, I think the point is that we are forced to tell the government if we carry large sums of money. Do you think it's the government's busienss to know about your hard-earned money?

Only if you are taking it in or out of the country. There is a big difference.

[Seahawk]

Originally posted by Rodeo
This started with sammy's (oft repeated) rant to the effect of "if you're doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to worry about" when the government peeks into some aspect of your life.

That is the precise opposite of freedom. In free countries, the government needs cause to invade an individual's privacy. The laws not only restrain the individual actions of citizens, they restrain the government from intruding on our lives, or homes, our cars, our telephones, our emails, our bank accounts.

There is no government action against an individual that can't be explained away with "if you're doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to worry about."

But that's not freedom, that's the opposite of freedom.

Today's supposed conservatives seem to never find a government power to regulate people that they don't like (except for gun control).

I don't find anything "conservative" about the continued intrusion of government into our lives.

Are you a lawyer? My sister is a prosecutor and would LOVE to have you in court.

You enjoy freedoms you do not even recognize. In a totalitarian regime, your post count would be 11, maybe 12.

Words have meaning...name one intrusion by government in your life that is not lawful.

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by SLO-BOB
That does seem to be one of the many points made. I believe it is their business to know.

With both terrorists and druggies having an issue with declaring large sums of money, it seems that this is necessary.

Personally I do not really like having to declare it but as I am doing something totally legal its better than breaking the law and getting in trouble for it.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by SLO-BOB
However, just because Republicans favor a "hands-off" approach from Govt doesn't mean we favor no law at all.

Please allow me inform you that the Republican Party was formed in order to expand government into everyone's life. They were founded as the party of taxation, high tariffs, government corporate welfare, and government social programs. It's true that the Republcans became the party of less government once the Democrats found out how much fun they could have with other people's money, that period lasted only from the end of the First World War until the last Eisenhower presidency.

With the current Bush Ii regime, the Republicans have returned to their original philosophy.

Furtheremore, this whole discussion is academic. Since when do you have to break the law to be arrested? Many people who have done nothing wrong get arrested everyday. Law enforcement can arrest those who a merely suspected of a crime, such as the afore mentioned cash toteing, nuke laptop guy. It is up to the courts to decide if he has broken the law. This is nothing new. To confuse due process with "guilty until proven innocent" shows a basic lack of understanding as to how the courts work. It may not be perfect, but it's the best we can do with the limited intellect afforded us by our creator.

An arrest must rest on probable cause. However, government can "arrest" your money, car, or other property without probable cause and hold it, forcing you to seek court relief to have it returned.

[SLO-BOB]

Originally posted by cool_chick
Do you think it's the government's busienss to know about your hard-earned money?

I guess the other point I forgot to make is that the Govt makes my money it's business every April. (actually 4 times a year)Do I like it? No. I wish I was the one guy who did not have to pay taxes, as long as everyone else did.

It's one of the necessary evils.

[SLO-BOB]

Originally posted by fastpat
Please me inform you that the Republican Party was formed in order to expand government into everyone's life. They were founded as the party of taxation, high tariffs, government corporate welfare, and government social programs. It's true that the Republcans became the party of less government once the Democrats found out how much fun they could have with other people's money, that period lasted only from the end of the First World War until the last Eisenhower presidency.

With the current Bush Ii regime, the Republicans have returned to their original philosophy.

Dude, I live 20 miles from Ripon. I know about Republican philosophy.

[fastpat]

Originally posted by SLO-BOB
I guess the other point I forgot to make is that the Govt makes my money it's business every April. (actually 4 times a year)Do I like it? No. I wish I was the one guy who did not have to pay taxes, as long as everyone else did.

It's one of the necessary evils.

The IRS says that there are over 60 million people who are not paying taxes, and should be. Looks like there's a rebellion of sorts in the air.

[Rodeo]

Originally posted by Seahawk
Are you a lawyer? My sister is a prosecutor and would LOVE to have you in court.

You enjoy freedoms you do not even recognize. In a totalitarian regime, your post count would be 11, maybe 12.

Words have meaning...name one intrusion by government in your life that is not lawful.

I didn't say that I lived in a totalitarian regime. So your retort is meaningless.

I said that the "new conservative" appears to favor government intrusion over individual rights. That is the first step toward a "totalitarian regime."

If we get there, the point will become moot, because there will be nothing we can do about it.

I don't want to go down that road. With so-called "conservatives" favoring warrantles wiretaps, declaring how much money we carry, having our bank accounts monitored without cause, giving the FBI "secret warrants," abolishing habeas corpus, and on and on, we are headed down that road.

sammy's retort that "if you are doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to worry about" does nothing to stop the slide. Quite the opposite.

I hope you now understand my point. It's not that we live in a totalitarian regime, it's that I don't want to.

[the]

Originally posted by Rodeo
In totalitarian countries, the government does what it wants to individuals. If the individauls "do nothing wrong," they have nothing to worry about, as Sammy said.

In free countries, that's not the case.

Quite the opposite.

1. Fastpat is still wrong. It is not illegal to carry large sums of money in the US. There is NO LAW that says "It is illegal to carry large sums," or "you have to disclose to the government that you are carrying large sums of money in your pocket while walking around in the US" (i.e., I'm not talking about bringing money in from another country).

The crime of "carrying large sums of money while walking around in the U.S." simply does not exist. Because it is not illegal to do so.

2. Even Fastpat's frothing buddies here won't support him on his ridiculous statement. Not one.

3. Not sure where the "totalitarian" stuff is coming from. This is a thread about having to disclose it when you bring more than $10K INTERNATIONALLY into the U.S. (that means bringing it in FROM another COUNTRY, in case ya didn't know).

People find that to be some kind of U.S. totalitarian plot?!? Wow, get a grip. You must not travel much. Check out a customs form for Mexico. Or that perfect nation, Canada. Yep, you have to disclose if you are bringing in large amounts of currency (i.e., $5-10K or so) into either of those great nations.

Heck, even when I went to that paragon of Euro virtue and freedom, France, I noticed that I had to disclose if I had more than something like $7500 in currency. Sacre bleu! FRANCE! They even made me disclose if I had more than a quarter liter of eau de toilettes. Damn fascists.

[SLO-BOB]

Originally posted by fastpat
The IRS says that there are over 60 million people who are not paying taxes, and should be. Looks like there's a rebellion of sorts in the air.

I would have to know a lot more about that stat before I could agree or disagree with the rebellion statement. Are they referring to blatant tax evasion, illegals not paying taxes on money earned, people taking too many right-offs, etc? If it's the latter, count me in on the rebellion, but in fact I just want to reduce my debt. If it's the former, I believe there is more selfish motivs at work than patriotism.

[Por_sha911]

Please allow me to make two points:
1) Our constitutional rights are balanced by the good of society as a whole. I may not have the correct legal words for it but the best example is that you do not have the right to yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater. The right of free speech is controlled for the good of the rest of society.
2) Laws concerning large amounts of cash are set in place NOT to control people but to monitor them for illegal activity such as drug trafficking, counterfeiting, money laundering... The laws are in place to catch the bad guys. It seems to me that the issue is disclosure versus hidden transactions. That's why the customs guys ask if you have anything to declare. A police state is one that controls whether you can have the money and if you may buy what you want with it. Is this any different from concealed weapon laws? Seems to me that the only ones that should be upset are the ones that have something to hide.

I am a libertarian (not a liberal) and believe in small government. I bristle at the government controlling what I can do BUT I have to accept that these laws are in place to protect me.