U.K. Ex-Soldier Faces 5 Years in Jail for Turning in Discarded Gun

[LeRoux Strydom]

The UK legal system is messed up big time.

Source:

A former U.K. soldier says he found a discarded shotgun and turned it in to police — and now faces at least five years in prison for doing so, ThisIsSurreyToday.co.uk reported.

Paul Clarke was found guilty of possessing a firearm Tuesday after personally handing it over to Surrey Police on March 20, the Web site reported. Clarke said he spotted the gun in his garden.

Clarke's lawyer Lionel Blackman asked the jury to consider how they would respond if they found a gun.

"This is a very small case with a big principal," Blackman told ThisIsSurreyToday.co.uk.

The judge in the case said the intention of anybody possessing a firearm is irrelevant, the Web site reported.

The jury took 20 minutes to issue the guilty verdict, ThisIsSurreyToday.co.uk reported.

[Leland Pate]

Sounds about right.

[Joeaksa]

Simply crazy.

Some crook discards a gun after a crime and a honest innocent citizen finds it and turns it in. Only in the UK or OZ would they send him to jail...

[legion]

This is the difference between being a subject and being a citizen.

[Moses]

Originally Posted by legion

This is the difference between being a subject and being a citizen.

Abso-fukking-lutely!

[TSNAPCRACKLEPOP]

one more mission for the Equalizer

[widebody911]

So, if he sees a gun laying in his yard, why not call the bobbies and let them deal with it?

[MotoSook]

He'd probably be charged with possession anyho since it was in his garden.

So, if he sees a gun laying in his yard, why not call the bobbies and let them deal with it?

[mossguy]

Originally Posted by widebody911

So, if he sees a gun laying in his yard, why not call the bobbies and let them deal with it?

I think I would first toss it out of the yard when no one was looking. Then call.

Best,
Tom

[MotoSook]

What's to prevent someone from planing a gun in the neighbor's yard because the neighbor has been a farker?

Stupid jury and system if the OP link is true.

[MFAFF]

Interesting this one..

It goes a bit like this....

Ex-soldier notices odd bag in his yard.. brings it in...opens it and dicovers sawn-off shotgun inside.

What does he do? He calls the Police...and rather than asking them to shift themselves to collect what is in all likelihood a criminal weapon he takes it down to the local police station...is arrested and charged for illegal possession.

Now setting aside certain reactions debating citizens and subjects... its pretty well known here that unless you have a gun certificate 'possession' of a fire arm, including a shotgun, is illegal, regardless of the how and why....

It isn't a 'secret' law.. its been damn clear for a few years...and for f##ks sake finding a sawn -off shot gun in a black bin liner at the bottom of your garden sends signals out loud and clear...especially when the only access to your garden is via open land behind...

The law is an ass... but then again what the person did was not exactly the brightest reaction.

So the law is far too prescriptive...bit like some US laws....and the police handled this very badly... heard that before...prosecutors are between a rock and a hard place... poor laws, clear breaking of law.. means prosecution and conviction. It serves no purpose...it does not make anyone safer as a result... but its hardly unique to the UK...

[legion]

In the U.S., we could have the police brush it off, a prosecutor refuse to try the case (very common in situations like this), a judge throw out the case because it lacks merit, or a jury nullify the charges by returning a not-guilty verdict because they disagree with the underlying law itself.

Seems everyone in England just does what their supposed to do without really thinking about it.

[Tim Hancock]

Originally Posted by legion

Seems everyone in England just does what their supposed to do without really thinking about it.

That in itself is not so bad of a concept until you factor in how many ridiculous laws are stacking up on the books.

I can't imagine living in a place where I need to apply for permits to own even a shotgun. That said, it seems like many locales even in the US are increasingly trampling on our right to bear arms. Didn't we split away from England 200+ years ago to be more "free"? Yet slowly we are allowing ourselves to revert back to oppressive regulation by our govt.

[The Gaijin]

He should have asked for asylum - then go on the dole, and then get his 25 next of kin to housed for free.

He would be on easy street as this was tied up in Euro-court and the UN for the next 50 years.. The law is an ass indeed!


So what good is a monarch anyway, but for a case like this? Don't they pardon people anymore?

[The Gaijin]

Originally Posted by MFAFF

It isn't a 'secret' law.. its been damn clear for a few years...and for f##ks sake finding a sawn -off shot gun in a black bin liner at the bottom of your garden sends signals out loud and clear...especially when the only access to your garden is via open land behind...

The law is an ass... but then again what the person did was not exactly the brightest reaction.

My guess is that this was a very typical Englishman - not wanting to put the police out or have any fuss made at his back gate.

He thought to himself - "If I just bring this to them, I wont have MI5 and Scotland Yard camped in my garden and The Sun and News of the World digging up pictures of my wife circa 1992..."

Poor bloody ba$tard.

[competentone]

The jury took 20 minutes to issue the guilty verdict, ThisIsSurreyToday.co.uk reported.

Welcome to "The Village."

[svandamme]

pretty messed up law,

but i have to say, the way he brought the gun to the police station doesn't sound like the way to do it either

""I didn't know what to do, so the next morning I rang the Chief Superintendent, Adrian Harper, and asked if I could pop in and see him.

"At the police station, I took the gun out of the bag and placed it on the table so it was pointing towards the wall.""


Frankly , he walked into a police station, with a weapon, without giving them a heads up.

I would have at the very least mentioned to the police when i called them, why i wanted to see them, that i wanted to report a weapon, and do they want me to bring it in, or will they come collect it?


As far as i can tell, the Jury probably had no choice whatsoever if the law is written so abstract. It says "posession" and does not leave room for grey areas, in which case they could only rule "Guilty"....
I suppose they could have refused to rule, which would probably subject them to some kind of charge for "contempt" or "refusal to fulfill jury duty'

[legion]

I don't think even someone in Chicago would be charged with "possession" in the U.S. under these circumstances.

And the jury could have refused to find him guilty because the law itself is unjust.

[The Gaijin]

Went into a public-'ouse to get a pint o' beer,
The publican 'e up an' sez, "We serve no red-coats here."
The girls be'ind the bar they laughed an' giggled fit to die,
I outs into the street again an' to myself sez I:

O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, go away";
But it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins", when the band begins to play,
The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play,
O it's "Thank you, Mister Atkins", when the band begins to play....

For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, wait outside";
But it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide,
The troopship's on the tide, my boys, the troopship's on the tide,
O it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide...

When it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, 'ow's yer soul?"
But it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll,
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll.

We aren't no thin red 'eroes, nor we aren't no blackguards too,
But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you;
An' if sometimes our conduck isn't all your fancy paints,
Why, single men in barricks don't grow into plaster saints;

While it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, fall be'ind",
But it's "Please to walk in front, sir", when there's trouble in the wind,
There's trouble in the wind, my boys, there's trouble in the wind,
O it's "Please to walk in front, sir", when there's trouble in the wind....

For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!"
But it's "Saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot;
An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please;
An' Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool -- you bet that Tommy sees!

Rudyard Kipling

[MFAFF]

OK so lets put it this way..

You find a fully automatic Uzi wrapped in a black plastic bag in your back yard....
OYu know..

1) Its not yours
2) Its not 'likely' to be legal
3) You know that the law (assinine as it might be) sets rules covering ownership..

Do you expect the law to be suspended because you are doing a 'good thing'?

The law might be an ass.. but its still possible to get it changed.

There are sadly many assinine laws and my day to day routine does I am sure break obscure laws...if I get caught then I will need to deal with the consequences, even if the intentions are 'good'....

From living in the US I know that the number of assinine laws is proportional to the number of laws...and the US is no stranger to some laws that we in Europe find beyond comprehension and unfairly restrictivei..